I have these old Audioengine A5 powered speakers, sitting about 3 meters away.
These use built-in TDA7294 amps with passive crossover onto 5" woofers + 1" dome tweeters, approx 8L boxes.
I don't have an SPL meter, but at moderate volumes, they basically sound fine, but when I increase the volume to "loud" (not insane loud, mind), they start to sound unpleasant - voices become very shouty is the best way I can put it, and treble becomes nails on chalkboard-like. One quickly wants to back off the volume at this point.
Technically, why is this?
These use built-in TDA7294 amps with passive crossover onto 5" woofers + 1" dome tweeters, approx 8L boxes.
I don't have an SPL meter, but at moderate volumes, they basically sound fine, but when I increase the volume to "loud" (not insane loud, mind), they start to sound unpleasant - voices become very shouty is the best way I can put it, and treble becomes nails on chalkboard-like. One quickly wants to back off the volume at this point.
Technically, why is this?
It's easier to hear diffraction at higher volumes, among other things. Dr Geddes has done a study to show this.
My first guess would be clipping.
dave
dave
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At a range of three-meters distant, you're asking too much of them at this range, likely they are clipping. A range of two-meters distant I would consider, an absolute maximum.
By many accounts these would be among the "near field monitor" type genre of speakers.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Rick...
By many accounts these would be among the "near field monitor" type genre of speakers.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Rick...
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Aren’t AudioEngine aimed at computer speakers, i expect they are designing for 1m listening distance.
dave
dave
That's fair.
Assuming it is "driver stress", what explains this technically, and how does one address that if needing higher SPL and midfield distance?
Assuming it is "driver stress", what explains this technically, and how does one address that if needing higher SPL and midfield distance?
My guess is - the power supplies carry too much load-induced ripple at high levels and the PSRR of those TDA7294s isn't up to the job of rejecting that.
If you want something in that size factor, and want more output, build a set of my Synchaetas. 86dB sensitivity, 4 ohms, 2 ltrs sealed, F3 110Hz. Dayton ND25 and PRV 4MR60-4. You'd be surprised at how loud they can be and keep their composure.
Without going larger in drivers and cabinets, this is likely the best suited direction to go. Maybe some FaitalPro drivers would be another option.
Without going larger in drivers and cabinets, this is likely the best suited direction to go. Maybe some FaitalPro drivers would be another option.
Hi, like folks are saying, there are a host of technical reasons why the speaker sounds strained at higher volume.
There's a simple common denominator under the technical reasons, and it's plain ole size.....or rather the lack of size.
It's just the way the SPL numbers work....
There's a simple common denominator under the technical reasons, and it's plain ole size.....or rather the lack of size.
It's just the way the SPL numbers work....
Maybe the power supply is not having that VA to drive to the level you are trying to. Maybe
Edit: asfik Audio engine are desk speaker for Probably near field listening so may not be working well for larger area.
Edit: asfik Audio engine are desk speaker for Probably near field listening so may not be working well for larger area.
Found your thread. Neat minis! Though I'd be more inclined towards your Purveyors - the placement would fit better.
Two very different goals, and two very different sensitivities. Thank you for the compliment though.
Just to close out this query, I looked back at @AllenB's comment on diffraction, and thought to start experimenting with the toe-in.
Previously firing dead on, they're currently toed out 10-15 degrees. The screeching issue dramatically recedes with each 10 degrees of "toe-out". They can also play quite loud now without becoming annoying. Curious.
Previously firing dead on, they're currently toed out 10-15 degrees. The screeching issue dramatically recedes with each 10 degrees of "toe-out". They can also play quite loud now without becoming annoying. Curious.
Cool. Here's an older Troels design on a flat baffle with the 18W - might also be of interest for cabinet volume and XO frequency, although with a series crossover (I don't understand them very well).
A 5" midwoofer, as in any 5" midwoofer in existence is practically a distortion generator below 300Hz with levels above 85dB. It goes up to 50% easily at 50Hz at levels above that. Same holds true for many dome tweeters, especially when used too low at high levels they become true distortion generators. Small woofers driven out of their linear excursion drop output at the low end pretty fast so you'll end up with a bassless sound which sounds tiring. I have never understood why people keep fiddling around with these incapable tiny drivers, but that's another story.
The audio engine is a budget speaker on all levels and it is designed as a nearfield desktop loudspeaker at moderate to low levels, a 3m listening distance is already asking a lot of them. The amplifiers, and especally the amplifier power supplies are weak, the woofers are too small with not enough linear excursion. They probably have lots of cone break-up as well. Another source of high distortion is in the parts you don't see, especially the way the voice coil is glued to the cone is where it goes wrong in cheap drivers.
The audio engine is a budget speaker on all levels and it is designed as a nearfield desktop loudspeaker at moderate to low levels, a 3m listening distance is already asking a lot of them. The amplifiers, and especally the amplifier power supplies are weak, the woofers are too small with not enough linear excursion. They probably have lots of cone break-up as well. Another source of high distortion is in the parts you don't see, especially the way the voice coil is glued to the cone is where it goes wrong in cheap drivers.
This is the primary cause of level-sensitive audible distortion in small loudspeakers: Intermodulation Distortion
...which is extremely nonlinear with peak amplitudes of the drivers--particularly with woofers which play well into the midrange and lower treble frequencies at the same time they're trying to reproduce higher amplitude bass frequencies. The midrange frequencies are where you're mostly hearing those non-harmonic sidebands, particularly the higher order sidebands.
Another guy wrote about this subject a few years ago: Red Shift: Doppler distortion in loudspeakers
Chris