Hello,
As the title suggests, I am looking for any general or specific recommendations or referrals. While I do have some clue (and am a trained EE), I am certain some people here just have much more knowledge about what's available and what's best. I am open to new or used, bench or portable, etc.
I am sort of a repair hobbyist, I work on particular older car audio equipment, sometimes with the help of Mr. Babin or other distinguished contributors. This is for personal use or small jobs for friends or acquaintances.
I don't want to break the bank, but I do have a reasonable budget and may pay more if it's right.
Thank you for any suggestions or feedback!
As the title suggests, I am looking for any general or specific recommendations or referrals. While I do have some clue (and am a trained EE), I am certain some people here just have much more knowledge about what's available and what's best. I am open to new or used, bench or portable, etc.
I am sort of a repair hobbyist, I work on particular older car audio equipment, sometimes with the help of Mr. Babin or other distinguished contributors. This is for personal use or small jobs for friends or acquaintances.
I don't want to break the bank, but I do have a reasonable budget and may pay more if it's right.
Thank you for any suggestions or feedback!
For me, a CRT display and an analog scope is the only thing I'd want to use for day to day work. The old Tek 2200 series are really good but there are many options for analog scopes. Don't overlook a used BK precision 2120 or similar.
Don't buy it online unless it shows a locked waveform displayed. Email me any ebay auction numbers for scopes you might be looking at.
I hate the donky kong resolution of an LCD display and the dithering that most all have when the waveform is at ground or steady DC. Digital scopes have their place but for me, not as a primary scope. If you have a decent budget, there's the choice of having 2 scopes.
This is for audio and class D amps. For use on purely digital circuits or where you need to catch glitches, a digital scope may be a better choice.
Don't buy it online unless it shows a locked waveform displayed. Email me any ebay auction numbers for scopes you might be looking at.
I hate the donky kong resolution of an LCD display and the dithering that most all have when the waveform is at ground or steady DC. Digital scopes have their place but for me, not as a primary scope. If you have a decent budget, there's the choice of having 2 scopes.
This is for audio and class D amps. For use on purely digital circuits or where you need to catch glitches, a digital scope may be a better choice.
Both HP & TEK had many good analogue scopes. I used both TEK 530 & 540 series every day during my
time interning in the research lab. At one point I used a TEK 315D for a while. The 'D' meant a built
in delay line, required to see the front edge of a step function. The 530 & 540 series had delay lines as standard.
Later selling at HP the 140 & 180 Series plug-in models were very popular, there are many on the used market.
The HP 120B would be a good starter used scope.
The TEK 450 Series portable scopes were very popular.
Avoid anything with a storage screen. A replacement is like finding a batch of unobtanium.
Philips also made a good line of analogue scopes, they were lower priced & popular in colleges & universities.
Quite a few of the newer digital scopes offer limited FFT of 8-bit resolution. That is very nice to have.
I gave away my 2-channel, 100 MHz R&S (Panasonic 3rd Party build) scope about 10 yrs ago.
I've been using Pico Scope products for about 25 yrs.
The most often used for audio is a 2-channel, 10 MHz version. It has 12-bit resolution. If needed I've also another
2-channel Picoscope of 16-bit resolution. And a 2-channel, 250 Mhz. Very convenient, dump the results direct to a laptop.
time interning in the research lab. At one point I used a TEK 315D for a while. The 'D' meant a built
in delay line, required to see the front edge of a step function. The 530 & 540 series had delay lines as standard.
Later selling at HP the 140 & 180 Series plug-in models were very popular, there are many on the used market.
The HP 120B would be a good starter used scope.
The TEK 450 Series portable scopes were very popular.
Avoid anything with a storage screen. A replacement is like finding a batch of unobtanium.
Philips also made a good line of analogue scopes, they were lower priced & popular in colleges & universities.
Quite a few of the newer digital scopes offer limited FFT of 8-bit resolution. That is very nice to have.
I gave away my 2-channel, 100 MHz R&S (Panasonic 3rd Party build) scope about 10 yrs ago.
I've been using Pico Scope products for about 25 yrs.
The most often used for audio is a 2-channel, 10 MHz version. It has 12-bit resolution. If needed I've also another
2-channel Picoscope of 16-bit resolution. And a 2-channel, 250 Mhz. Very convenient, dump the results direct to a laptop.
What other test equipment do you have? A scope alone is not enough, so if you spend all the money on it
you're worse off. Just $250-$300 will buy a decent new scope.
I got my Tek2465a for $250, I still see them going for that occasionally.
Get the fastest analog scope you can afford to get your hands on !!
Start there learn to use it and buy another one later with what ever feature you may need later, IMHO don't settle for any thing less than 100Mhz bandwidth to start with, Typical mcu clocks for projects fall more in the 40mhz to 80mhz and higher range this days.
I was spoiled very early on in 1984 by the On Screen Display of my 40Mhz Hitachi V-425, but, I had to finally breakdown and get a 2465 of some type due to the speeds.
I still have my Hitachi and still use it.
I repaired it twice after all this time and still works great except for the worn out seltor sweep assembly !! :/ 😉
Next on my list for the bench would be a Siglent if anything digital is gonna take up any space here, its got it all RTA, FFT's and Everything, as well as good depth !! 😉
Cheers !!
jer 🙂
Get the fastest analog scope you can afford to get your hands on !!
Start there learn to use it and buy another one later with what ever feature you may need later, IMHO don't settle for any thing less than 100Mhz bandwidth to start with, Typical mcu clocks for projects fall more in the 40mhz to 80mhz and higher range this days.
I was spoiled very early on in 1984 by the On Screen Display of my 40Mhz Hitachi V-425, but, I had to finally breakdown and get a 2465 of some type due to the speeds.
I still have my Hitachi and still use it.
I repaired it twice after all this time and still works great except for the worn out seltor sweep assembly !! :/ 😉
Next on my list for the bench would be a Siglent if anything digital is gonna take up any space here, its got it all RTA, FFT's and Everything, as well as good depth !! 😉
Cheers !!
jer 🙂
I own and use a Silent SDS1104X-E (4 channel upgraded to 200MHz + all options unlocked). It's a great beginner/hobbist scope. It's nice that it doesn't take up a massive amount of space. There are use cases for both digital and analogue - and quite a few threads on this.
You don't need a 100MHz scope. The following link shows one of the highest frequency square waves that you'll ever see in car audio amps. There is virtually no difference between the 100MHz and the 2MHz scopes.
http://www.bcae1.com/repairbasicsforbcae1/repairbasics.htm#scope
Is there a scope with an LCD display that can display a waveform that is as smooth as either of these. Remember that this is for audio.
http://www.bcae1.com/repairbasicsforbcae1/repairbasics.htm#scope
Is there a scope with an LCD display that can display a waveform that is as smooth as either of these. Remember that this is for audio.
Suggest that you look at these offerings and decide what kind and price seems most suitable.
https://www.saelig.com/category/PS.htm
https://www.saelig.com/category/PS.htm
Thank you all, I knew this was the right place to ask!
I need to do a little more reading and research, but I definitely want to order something soon.
I will investigate the suggestions and update the thread. Happy 4th weekend.
I need to do a little more reading and research, but I definitely want to order something soon.
I will investigate the suggestions and update the thread. Happy 4th weekend.
Thank you.
I have most of the other essentials, at least I think I do. I have
A reliable 12-16 V 100 A power supply.
A good DMM
Good soldering skills, much improved now that I have more appropriate stuff for what I do and know how to use it better.
Lots of supplies and parts for particular audio equipment
I think you are correct about cost, and a decent low cost used analog bench scope (that isn't about to die right) is probably what I should want.
Thank you Perry. I was hoping you would respond, I think you went over this for me before actually.
I really appreciate your offer of looking at any I might be looking at, I am a little nervous about a used scope only because I don't know what to look for nearly as well - especially when it comes to real condition and reliability.
We used to use a very common Tek bench scope back in engineering school in the 90s that I am familiar with.
Do you find you use the trigger/transient feature very often that some have and some don't?
Thank you again.
The trigger level is always important but I don't understand what you mean by transient.
Do you have any 'hamfests' near your home? If so, you may be able to see and test the scope you want to buy in person.
If you buy from Craigslist, you may be able to test the scope. You can buy cheap $5 probes on ebay (perfectly fine for audio and well above) and should bring at least one probe if you're going to look at a scope that has no probes.
Do you have any 'hamfests' near your home? If so, you may be able to see and test the scope you want to buy in person.
If you buy from Craigslist, you may be able to test the scope. You can buy cheap $5 probes on ebay (perfectly fine for audio and well above) and should bring at least one probe if you're going to look at a scope that has no probes.
Only those who have not worked with a quality digital oscilloscope can still think of analog oscilloscopes.
I agree. I used an excellent Agilent digital scope for more than 10 years at work and would never look at using an analog scope again. Before that I used Tek analog scopes for decades. The Agilent/Keysight displays look very analog in the way they display a waveform. I'm sure other manufacturers use similar display technology now.
Also, good luck finding an analog scope that is even close to meeting spec. I used to repair and cal old Tek and other brand scopes for a living and they were always a lot of hard work.
A 2MHz scope is not quick enough to catch bursts of instability in an amplifier output stage. Since this instability could be the reason an output stage failed it's important it is noticed during testing. If I were buying a new scope for audio work I wouldn't buy one slower than 50MHz.
Also, good luck finding an analog scope that is even close to meeting spec. I used to repair and cal old Tek and other brand scopes for a living and they were always a lot of hard work.
A 2MHz scope is not quick enough to catch bursts of instability in an amplifier output stage. Since this instability could be the reason an output stage failed it's important it is noticed during testing. If I were buying a new scope for audio work I wouldn't buy one slower than 50MHz.
Just be warned there's two SDS1104X variants - the SDS1104X-E and the SDS1104X-U. Get the -E and not the -U. The -U is the cheaper frontend that's limited to 100MHz and cannot be unlocked to 200MHz and it looses the fastest timebase setting. There may be other things but the -U is basically the hardware cut down -E.