Smaller Danley speakers for home?

They actually show more than that. There are shots of the naked horn with a coaxial driver at the mouth and two larger woofers (8”?) on the sides, and four ports further up. No idea if this is the new thing, or just an older PA model.


that looks like the sm60f, nothing new .

i really hope danley comes up with something new for the home market and not just a rebranding of the old , like they did with the cinema line , or some low efficiency speakers for the studio .
 
that looks like the sm60f, nothing new .

i really hope danley comes up with something new for the home market and not just a rebranding of the old , like they did with the cinema line , or some low efficiency speakers for the studio .

Looking at the speaker in the background it could fit the SM60F horn.. possibly it received a more “hifi” filter and a nice looking cabinet.
 
I can't wait to see what Tom has up his sleeve this time!
He has been talking about a dedicated speaker for the home market for a decade, so I think this will be a very mature and well thought out design.

While waiting, I'm speculating whether he might 'reuse' some of his existing designs; for instance SM60F on top of a CS30 or TH112 sub, but integrated into one cabinet 😕 The TH112 would fit the sensitivity of SM60F perfectly, however I think the 112 tapped horn is too big for a livingroom friendly design.
A combination of synergy and TH would be fantastic!
 
Hi All,

In the very early beginning of the unity horn concept (warping back to the 2000`s) there were some people building their loudspeakers wrapped around a unity horn, with very good results. The unity horn diy kit that time was sold by Lamda Acoustics. They had some very well other loudspeaker drivers too.


Unity

cheers,
Marcel
 
Speculation: Earlier reports (here probably) had it that you could order some of DSL speakers like the SH50 with your choice of nice finishes. Of course, it'll still be as big as a small refrigerator 🙂
Based on my knowledge of speaker trade-offs, I'd guess that the home speaker will be, say, an update of the SM60F. In pro sound, the bass, applied to the "mid-high box" or "tops" trades off the lowest octave of the woofer driver in favor of astronomical dB output. For the home, I'd expect a variant of his tapped horn, perhaps tuned to 20 Hz instead of much higher, with a corresponding reduction in dB output but still more than sufficient for the home: 110 dB? 120 dB? It's probably some variation of the old Hoffmann's Iron Law: for a given box and being able to choose among different woofers, you can have 130 dB at 100 Hz, or 100 db at 20 Hz, but you cannot have both. Not even close.
 
You do not need to buy an SM60F probably. The much smaller Go2 8 CX is absolutely phenomenal in every way. It has a liveliness and impulse behaviour like very few speakers, it is very smooth and work well really with everything including operas. Most of the Danley spealers could be ordered in veneered finish too. The Go2 is an exception however. As I heard.
 
You do not need to buy an SM60F probably. The much smaller Go2 8 CX is absolutely phenomenal in every way. It has a liveliness and impulse behaviour like very few speakers, it is very smooth and work well really with everything including operas. Most of the Danley spealers could be ordered in veneered finish too. The Go2 is an exception however. As I heard.

So you are basically saying the single 8 inch coax direct radiator of the Go2 can replace the SM60F with a 5 inch coax and dual 8 inch woofers in a synergy horn for sound quality?
Have you listened to these two models side by side, same system/room?
 
For home use, what are the design pros and cons of the SH50 vs SM60F? I notice the Sm60F has rounded corners and mouth, while the SH50 is sharp edged. I would have thought this would result in a smoother response but the SM60F is rather ragged in my opinion, simply a drawback in the coaxial used, or?

If a DIY'er is not constrained by economical/manufacturing issues, would aspects could be improved on in Danley's current designs?
 
For home use, what are the design pros and cons of the SH50 vs SM60F? I notice the Sm60F has rounded corners and mouth, while the SH50 is sharp edged. I would have thought this would result in a smoother response but the SM60F is rather ragged in my opinion, simply a drawback in the coaxial used, or?

If a DIY'er is not constrained by economical/manufacturing issues, would aspects could be improved on in Danley's current designs?

I owned a pair of SH50's for six years before selling them about a year ago.
I've never listened to the SM60F, but one of the things that bothered me with the SH50's was a sort of 'cupped mouth' sound in the lower midrange/upper bass that I could never adjust to. If this was due to the 12" woofers firing into the horn cavity I don't know.

Also not a big fan of the BMS 4550 dry/sterile sound signature, so I hope Tom has opted for something different in his new speakers.

Third issue I had with these was the super tight pattern control, this is of course a design goal for the speaker so can't fault it for that. But it makes them sound like giant headphones. They made me realize that I actually prefer some room reflections, sacrificing some of the brilliant clarity they offer.

But I have not heard any speaker come close to producing such a coherent sound. This is something I have missed since selling them.
 
Third issue I had with these was the super tight pattern control, this is of course a design goal for the speaker so can't fault it for that. But it makes them sound like giant headphones. They made me realize that I actually prefer some room reflections, sacrificing some of the brilliant clarity they offer.

But I have not heard any speaker come close to producing such a coherent sound. This is something I have missed since selling them.

Could one design for 90 or even 120 degree coverage without undermining some fundamental aspect of the Synergy idea?
 
Danley have several models with a 90 degree horizontal pattern, I think this would be a better option for use in a home setting.
I'm quite sure the signature series will have a wider dispersion horn (IF it employs a synergy horn, fingers crossed that it does!)

I don't think the synergy concept is a limiting factor to wider dispersion horns, as long as the less than 1/4 WL rule between driver bands can be maintained.
 
Last edited:
Hi Lament,

Thanks for sharing your experiences.

They make a lot of sense to me, as I've been working on various synergy builds with different patterns..... 60x40 first, then 90x60, and now 75x60.
The 60x40 sounded too tight, much like the giant headphones you describe.
Then, 90x60 was nice, smoother, but without quite as much clarity.
The 75x50's i have running now, are so far hitting the spot for me...seem to be a good middle ground.

But all that said, I used different mid drivers for each build, so my science in nailing down pattern preference is not super strong.

I think the 'cupped sound' (another member has called it the 'tunnel effect') and pattern control are strongly interlinked, but I'm still exploring how so, because the the size of the horn seems to be as big a variable in this aspect of sound.

Question for you, did you hear any difference with the SH-50's up close vs further away?

I'm hearing an upwards spectral tilt as distance increases, more so with tighter pattern than wider. Could just be all room though...dunno...
 
Hi Mark,

your observations regarding different dispersion patterns are very interesting, and indeed corresponds well with my findings with the SH50.

I had them outside for a few garden parties, and the cupped mouth effect was definitely not as pronounced as in my listening room with about 12 feet distance to the speakers.
I speculated that this effect was maybe due to resonances inside the horn, especially considering the upper bass frequencies produced by the 12's bouncing around in there.

So I guess when used for their intended purpose, this will not be an issue.
I'm quite surprised however, that very few seem to notice or be bothered with this among those who use them in their home. But I suppose there are not many of us 🙂
 
The Go-2 8CX is a "wide" dispersion speaker with about 10dB less output capability and 6 dB less 1watt sensitivity than the 60x60 SM60F, they are quite different speakers- neither are meant to replace either.

However, a new Tom Danley Signature series is in the works- some day..

Tom Danley – Danley Sound Comes Home

I had SH50, SH60, SH100B, SH-LPM, SH100 with TH Mini, CS30 and DTS 10 subs for quite some time (after using an Avantgarde Trio for some 10 years), mostly drove them with an MC2 Audio amp like the MC1250 and S1400. The Go2 8 CX should be more than satisfactory for an average room size (less than 40-50 sqm) and with an at least 40W amps, then an SH50 or SH60F. This is what I ment with my explanation. The mentioned SH series (except probably the SH96 or the CSH496 as a cinema speaker) speakers can sound extremely good, but after using the Go2 8 CX at home I would say for the majority of the listeners it should be an ideal speaker even if ugly like hell. The pair is around 3k Euro, for this price you could not have a single SH50 and even the SH50 needs a sub. The Go2 8 CX could be used very well without sub even if it is 10 dB less output capable. If one wants to get a taste of the Danley world, the Go2 8 CX is an ideal entry-level Danley speaker. Its impedance never goes below 8 ohm ( I measured it this week), can be much easier driven than the SH50, which needs more grunt even if it is 6 dB more sensitive.

So I think as a deal the Go2 8CX is the best Danley deal at the moment, next one is the SH96 or CSH496 and then the SH50/SM60F. At least according to my taste and my electronics. 🙂
 
So you are basically saying the single 8 inch coax direct radiator of the Go2 can replace the SM60F with a 5 inch coax and dual 8 inch woofers in a synergy horn for sound quality?
Have you listened to these two models side by side, same system/room?

Sure and quite a bit more Danley speakers too. The Go2 8 Cx is a way better speaker than it looks. I got my Studio 2 this week as well, so soon I can compare them too.
 
Hi Lament,

Thanks for sharing your experiences.

They make a lot of sense to me, as I've been working on various synergy builds with different patterns..... 60x40 first, then 90x60, and now 75x60.
The 60x40 sounded too tight, much like the giant headphones you describe.
Then, 90x60 was nice, smoother, but without quite as much clarity.
The 75x50's i have running now, are so far hitting the spot for me...seem to be a good middle ground.

But all that said, I used different mid drivers for each build, so my science in nailing down pattern preference is not super strong.

I think the 'cupped sound' (another member has called it the 'tunnel effect') and pattern control are strongly interlinked, but I'm still exploring how so, because the the size of the horn seems to be as big a variable in this aspect of sound.

Question for you, did you hear any difference with the SH-50's up close vs further away?

I'm hearing an upwards spectral tilt as distance increases, more so with tighter pattern than wider. Could just be all room though...dunno...

Probably the biggest difference that I heard between the Lambda Unity Horn and the SH50 is that the SH50 does this thing where it's difficult to determine where the soundstage begins and ends.

EobjcI0.jpg


EobjcI0.jpg


KhRUyCg.jpg


Here's a pic comparing the Lambda Unity Horn and the SH50.

The woofer taps in the SH50 are over forty centimeters from where the tweeter is located. So we have this odd speaker, that's producing sound that's fairly flat and phase that's well behaved, yet the drivers are located as much as 40cm apart.

In my opinion, a lot of the information that we have about location is because of phase. Most speakers place all the drivers on a vertical plane, so it can be a very odd/interesting listening experience to hear a speaker where the depth of the drivers varies by so much.

Back in the 90s, a lot of the car audio dudes were putting midbasses *behind* the listener, and it was a similar/shocking experience, that you could create a soundstage in *front* of the listener, even when the midbasses are not.

This gets into some weird aspects of how we locate sounds at low frequency, which is a subject for another day...
 
Could one design for 90 or even 120 degree coverage without undermining some fundamental aspect of the Synergy idea?

One could easily design a Unity horn with a beamwidth of 360 degrees.

With shading, you could make it cardioid.

Ulrich Horbach knows what's up:

izJnF7p.jpg


The first person to make a DIY Unity horn, he made a speaker with seven horn loaded drivers in a ring. The horn loaded drivers share a common coentrant horn (sound familiar?), and it's sold by a little company named "Apple Computer:"

6a0120a5580826970c01b8d2af38cc970c-pi


And yes, Apple gave credit to Danley : US10015584B2 - Loudspeaker with reduced audio coloration caused by reflections from a surface
- Google Patents
 
Last edited:
For home use, what are the design pros and cons of the SH50 vs SM60F? I notice the Sm60F has rounded corners and mouth, while the SH50 is sharp edged. I would have thought this would result in a smoother response but the SM60F is rather ragged in my opinion, simply a drawback in the coaxial used, or?
The SH50 is a whole 'nother beast, it's a true 3-way Synergy with a 1" compression driver, four 5" mids and a pair of 12s. It's bigger, and it goes deeper AND a little louder. If I thought I could ever afford whatever Tom is working on, this is the kind of tech I'd love to see put into a home speaker.
 
For home use, what are the design pros and cons of the SH50 vs SM60F? I notice the Sm60F has rounded corners and mouth, while the SH50 is sharp edged. I would have thought this would result in a smoother response but the SM60F is rather ragged in my opinion, simply a drawback in the coaxial used, or?

If a DIY'er is not constrained by economical/manufacturing issues, would aspects could be improved on in Danley's current designs?

In my life, I've never seen a coaxial driver with really smooth high frequency response. I attacked the problem here, and gave up in frustration:

Prosound Coaxial Hacking

Even the KEF LS50, which is generally beloved, is far from flat:

1212KEF50fig3.jpg


Here's the published response of the BMS coax :

http://www.bmsspeakers.com/fileadmi...n140_2011-04_neodymium_coaxial_transducer.pdf