I think the deadend cabinet has a lot to do with it. Maybe the mid/bass mounting behind the baffle as well. Perhaps more so than spending lots of money on genuine bexatrine b110s, t27s and fancy crossovers.
If you think the initial leading edge of step response (basically the time domain version of the FFT spectrum) has anything to do with recreating the sound of the tweeter of the LS3/5A, here is the measured one from a Sterling done by Stereophile:
Here is the one from my simple homage to the LS3/5A using a Dayton RST28F-4:
This was achieved using a much simpler crossover too. Use of a conventional LR2/4 would not have produced this nearly identical right triangle shape. Based on this, I would say the RST28F is a pretty decent tweeter to use here. In the US, it’s very cost effective at only $36. Might not be true in EU or Aus.
Wow, well done!
That's impressive.
Think you might have chosen my next tweeter. The T27 is supposedly the hardest bit to match on the LS3/5A as everyone know the B100 mid/bass is a bit flawed really. I'm not specifically looking for exactly the same anyway, a little improvement would be nice. They do an aluminium and a soft dome it seems as well in that design. Might try the metal, I just like the overall presentation of metal domes more, some can be nasty though.
What basic crossover did you use as well? I would be really interested to know. Was it an off the shelf type. Dayton Audio again perhaps?
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Hi Westwounds,
Thanks! It’s all here:
RST28F and DC130A Foamcore Homage to LS3/5A
But XO looks like this:
Measured XO curves look like this:
Vs the Sterling LS3/5A as measured by Stereophile:
The RST28F is quite low distortion:
Thanks! It’s all here:
RST28F and DC130A Foamcore Homage to LS3/5A
But XO looks like this:
Measured XO curves look like this:
Vs the Sterling LS3/5A as measured by Stereophile:
The RST28F is quite low distortion:
Well that's my woofers sorted for now. Tweeters now and torn between these two 🙂
The seas look pretty impressive as well.
Dayton Audio - RST28A-4 1-1/8" Reference Series Aluminum Dome Tweeter 4 Ohm
H1212-06 27TBFC/G
Do I have to start another thread 😀
The seas look pretty impressive as well.
Dayton Audio - RST28A-4 1-1/8" Reference Series Aluminum Dome Tweeter 4 Ohm
H1212-06 27TBFC/G
Do I have to start another thread 😀
The Seas has a grille and phase plate, so does the RST28. I am not sure if the massive ultrasonic peak at 27kHz would bother you? The Seas also starts falling off above 15kHz whereas the Dayton is flat past 20kHz. It’s breakup must be higher up relative to the Seas.
I’m sure they will both work, it comes done more to the XO and integration with the woofer.
Edit - Audio Express has a nicely done review of the Dayton RST28A/F:
It has a big peak too (at 22kHz).
Whereas the RST28F (soft dome) has no such nasty peak 🙂 I would go with the soft dome personally.
I’m sure they will both work, it comes done more to the XO and integration with the woofer.
Edit - Audio Express has a nicely done review of the Dayton RST28A/F:
It has a big peak too (at 22kHz).
Whereas the RST28F (soft dome) has no such nasty peak 🙂 I would go with the soft dome personally.
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My sph-130s arrived today ready for my next project. I'm not sure they look/feel quite as good as the 135TCs but I'm really looking forward to having a try anyway and using other decent paper mid/bass's in OEM speakers in the past I have liked what they do. I have to say the 135TC's have exceeded my expectations, they sound great so far. Especially when married to the Scanspeak D2010.
Forgive my LS3/5A inspired design 🙂 They started out as a possible simile type speaker but have evolved as I've gone on. The woofers were even mounted behind the baffle in LS3/5A style as well but I changed my mind and moved them later to the front. Why, because I thought well I would really have to know what I'm doing for that and with all good intentions even though I like the style I think front mounting is probably a better option. Time aligning and going active is a project for the future and for now I don't know how to design a crossover to accommodate it as it really should.
The new 130 will be partnered with a metal dome for a change of flavour to the set I have now, as well as going in a Plywood cabinet rather than the 12mm MDF I used here. I'm hoping I can get a metal dome as good or possibly better than the D2010 sounds but at the moment I cant see anything bettering what the D2010 is giving, I really like it, though I do love metal tweeters as well.
Sure I would like a set of ProAc miniatures, tab 10 sigs whatever, Genuine LS3/5As or Harbeths but I haven't got the income for that, plus this DIY project has been about seeing what I can do and making something different as well. I feel I've achieved that and something comparable(ish) so far and am ready for the next 130 models, if I can only find a metal tweeter to match or better even what the D2010/135TC are doing, but all speakers are compromises, its as good/better with a different flavour of course 🙂
2020-08-29_04-32-44 by eddiebaby2012, on Flickr
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I am glad the 135 TCs have been successful for you.
I am very interested as to how you get on with the 130s. As I said I have not heard them myself. I like your willingness to experiment.
The unfortunate thing about Monacor drive units is that our cousins over the pond cannot source them easily, and so we cannot benefit directly from their experience with them.
I am very interested as to how you get on with the 130s. As I said I have not heard them myself. I like your willingness to experiment.
The unfortunate thing about Monacor drive units is that our cousins over the pond cannot source them easily, and so we cannot benefit directly from their experience with them.
I'm interested as well. Cabinets are done and just pondering on a tweeter now.
Even with my experimenting it's nowhere near the costs of actually buying some mini monitors. Even though some would argue they are worth the cost, and if its a factory finished item and you know what you are getting thing then yes they probably are. But I'm quite enjoying DIY it does have its own issues to overcome though. I think you have to approach it with a bit of an open mind.
The 130s look very much like the MSH115 I have stashed for a 3 way project.
The stamped frame worried me a little, but cosmetically it is far better than many, and is pretty strong.
But the midrange blew me away lol
The stamped frame worried me a little, but cosmetically it is far better than many, and is pretty strong.
But the midrange blew me away lol
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I think the ±1dB variance was from each other, not from nominally flat.[/QUOTE]
That is interesting.
That is interesting.
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I can vouch for the midrange of the msh115,. But it is a midrange driver and unsuitable for producing bass.
Morel MW144 is looking good for a closed box, but since most of us are not listening in a van or similar room a bass reflex might be a better idea.
Why would bass reflex be better? Part of the LS3/5A sound/design as a concept, is the use of closed box design?
It should be easy to get a smallish CB to have a Fb of about 90Hz, if not lower, and with a nice 12dB rolloff to reduce over excitation of room modes.
In contrast, a reflex may get marginally lower in a similar volume, but drops like a stone beneath Fb, and may end up with lumpy bass, in room.
The Morel could be a good candidate though. That part I can agree with.
It should be easy to get a smallish CB to have a Fb of about 90Hz, if not lower, and with a nice 12dB rolloff to reduce over excitation of room modes.
In contrast, a reflex may get marginally lower in a similar volume, but drops like a stone beneath Fb, and may end up with lumpy bass, in room.
The Morel could be a good candidate though. That part I can agree with.
I don't find it trivial how much bass you loose with the closed model.
This might be worth looking at BTW.
LS3/5a Clone Reloaded - Aus Fehlern lernen
This might be worth looking at BTW.
LS3/5a Clone Reloaded - Aus Fehlern lernen