Hi,
After the great succes of my last project and the commercial interest for selling them. I thought I should design an ultimate reference system to dream off using the same philosophy to keep myself busy and just for fun. It will be a 4-way system plus subwoofer towers. The subwoofer towers will consist of eight woofers per tower mounted on the sides, in opposite directions to eliminate vibrations. The question is, what would be the ultimate woofer? The Scan-Speak Revelator 32W T00 or T01, or the one of the 15" Acoustic Elegance woofers?
Would like to hear your thoughts
After the great succes of my last project and the commercial interest for selling them. I thought I should design an ultimate reference system to dream off using the same philosophy to keep myself busy and just for fun. It will be a 4-way system plus subwoofer towers. The subwoofer towers will consist of eight woofers per tower mounted on the sides, in opposite directions to eliminate vibrations. The question is, what would be the ultimate woofer? The Scan-Speak Revelator 32W T00 or T01, or the one of the 15" Acoustic Elegance woofers?
Would like to hear your thoughts
Pro woofers don't like going that low. I'm talking about a high-end application here. I expect these woofer towers to hit like 15 Hz or lower. PA woofers won't do that. And i just looked up some measurments of a 21" B&C and the SS had a lot lower distortion. Pro woofers are quicker but because of the huge number of woofers and their huge total Sd they already are gonna be as fast as can be. Ya'll can't stop bragging on about PA drivers. Please explain to me why they should be better fr this application.
At a very basic level the AE has more volume displacement. Both the Scan and AE have 14mm of xmax but the AE has a surface area of 855sqcm vs the Scans 526sqcm.
For low frequency reproduction linear volume displacement is the most important thing regardless of anything else.
You mention that you're going to use 8 of them per tower. That's a lot of woofer and will probably need a lot of cabinet volume, even more if you're wanting to go ported. If you're wanting 15Hz extension then you're going to be needing a very low tuning frequency and that will, no doubt, require that the drivers be used in an appropriate sized box. Or sealed and EQ.
You can't just decide on the driver in the way you appear to be wanting to do. You need to know the box volume you've got available and then simulate with all the drivers you're considering to see which suits the application the best.
You might find you're better off with something else entirely, like the Ultimax drivers from Dayton, or some sealed PA driver with plenty of EQ.
For low frequency reproduction linear volume displacement is the most important thing regardless of anything else.
You mention that you're going to use 8 of them per tower. That's a lot of woofer and will probably need a lot of cabinet volume, even more if you're wanting to go ported. If you're wanting 15Hz extension then you're going to be needing a very low tuning frequency and that will, no doubt, require that the drivers be used in an appropriate sized box. Or sealed and EQ.
You can't just decide on the driver in the way you appear to be wanting to do. You need to know the box volume you've got available and then simulate with all the drivers you're considering to see which suits the application the best.
You might find you're better off with something else entirely, like the Ultimax drivers from Dayton, or some sealed PA driver with plenty of EQ.
The system all active with DSP. All sealed enclosures.
The last part is wrong and I think it's where my design philosophy is different from most others. I don't design a cabinet and then choose the drivers that go into it. That way you're immediately limiting your design in the drivers you can use. I choose a combination of the very best drivers and then design a cabinet around them. So right now I'm not looking for woofers that can fit in a certain cabinet. I'm just looking to choose the very best woofers I could possibly have.
The last part is wrong and I think it's where my design philosophy is different from most others. I don't design a cabinet and then choose the drivers that go into it. That way you're immediately limiting your design in the drivers you can use. I choose a combination of the very best drivers and then design a cabinet around them. So right now I'm not looking for woofers that can fit in a certain cabinet. I'm just looking to choose the very best woofers I could possibly have.
The only way you can determine if one driver is truly superior to another is to see how it performs in a cabinet. You have to simulate. This will show you the expected natural extension and then the required EQ to meet your extension goals. It will then allow you to see how loud each setup will go within the drivers linear excursion whilst showing you how much power it will take to get there.
It's only when you've done all of this you'll know what suits your system the best.
I understand the desire to want to keep the system completely sealed but this is really unnecessary. This is especially true if you're wanting a system that will have very low extension. Having a ported system tuned to 16Hz (or so) isn't going to have any impact, whatsoever, on the performance of said system when reproducing music. Lets go with sealed for tight bass etc. When tuned to 16Hz the port is going to do nothing for frequencies significantly above it and the subwoofer will essentially function as if it were sealed. Having a very low tuned port will only increase the systems efficiency at very low frequencies (where it's needed) and leave the bass within music well alone.
It's only when you've done all of this you'll know what suits your system the best.
I understand the desire to want to keep the system completely sealed but this is really unnecessary. This is especially true if you're wanting a system that will have very low extension. Having a ported system tuned to 16Hz (or so) isn't going to have any impact, whatsoever, on the performance of said system when reproducing music. Lets go with sealed for tight bass etc. When tuned to 16Hz the port is going to do nothing for frequencies significantly above it and the subwoofer will essentially function as if it were sealed. Having a very low tuned port will only increase the systems efficiency at very low frequencies (where it's needed) and leave the bass within music well alone.
There's independent measurements of both drivers on one site, hificompass
ScanSpeak 32W/4878T01 | HiFiCompass
Lambda Acoustics TD15X-Apollo | HiFiCompass
Im not sure how you compare distortion at what voltage for the Scanspeak to compensate for its 6db lower in sensitivity but they seem to be close in the low bass with the 32W having better results in the midbass region.
I own a variety of AE woofers but think 2-3 of the 32W would equal or beat one AE 15" crossed 200hz or so.
ScanSpeak 32W/4878T01 | HiFiCompass
Lambda Acoustics TD15X-Apollo | HiFiCompass
Im not sure how you compare distortion at what voltage for the Scanspeak to compensate for its 6db lower in sensitivity but they seem to be close in the low bass with the 32W having better results in the midbass region.
I own a variety of AE woofers but think 2-3 of the 32W would equal or beat one AE 15" crossed 200hz or so.
The Scanspeak Revelator is a proven top performer, third party measurements are available online. Also of note is the Scanspeak has a massive X-Mech which could be helpful if these speakers will see some abuse or help it cope with the odd accident. I've personally used the Scanspeak drivers and believe they are some of the very best available at any price. Eight per side would be amazing.
Any driver can hit 1Hz in a sealed box, but SPLs will vary.
Your mention of "speed" in the bass suggests you have a lot to learn.
In my experience, high-end PA drivers feature all the usual "HiFi" stuff like demodulation, double spiders with silicon damping, etc. But PA drivers are built to withstand virtually anything. In a HiFi application, they'll have a very easy life, and be running at very low distortion levels and with very little thermal compression as a result.
It's difficult to find an apples-to-apples comparison - where did you compare the distortion levels?
Chris
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