Hi, It isn't what is the Tr of a phono cart/system..... but what is the fastest Tr sound? And, up to 10usec seems reasonable. But, yes, not with a vinyl system. However, the wider BW carts (without resonances within audio range) will be better performing...
We can get microphones and speakers to exceed 35KHz and recording which does Not have all the electro-mechanical issues mentioned and well documented, deterioration with use et al..... IMO it would be better improving these new more modern systems.
BTW -- B&K has/had a demo disc of music all recorded using their instrumentation mics (wide bandwidth, low noise, high dynamic range, low distortion). Unfortunately, it is on a 16/44 CD !! :-( Maybe we will get the Master recording of it to download.
-RM
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Tournesol, of course I am working on improving digital playback as my main concern. It is unfortunate, but I have to remind people of the potential of analog, both tape and vinyl, because I have heard it, even recently to sound better than the best digital that could be compared to it. Perhaps there is better digital out there, but I have not heard it yet, AND it is true that the analog IC based electronics following the digital chip is marginal, and probably audible. We shall see. I have the eval board for the ESS 9038 all wired up, and ready to measure.
Modern? You clearly have an odd definition of this. Boron was being used back in the 70s and not sure when the last new stylus design was, but not much in the last 40 years. Ortofon may have tweaked their VDH sourced dimonds or just changed the name for marketing. They don't post pictures so hard to tell!
And of course boron tubes are no longer available so there is a very good argument that the best tapered thin wall Al cantilevers are far superior in all bar marketing.
Ok so we have established that 10 usec is reasonable and that we - afterwards - need wider BW to preserve the 10usec. say >350KHz -3dB. And do so with low noise and distortion.
The Low distortion is important --- electro-mechanical devices like phono carts and speakers have a lot of issues still..... distortion, dynamic range, resonances, damping, channel separation, compression, etc.
Are we there, yet?
THx-RNMarsh
f=0,35/t
Well, you don't need wider BW to preserve the t. The t is there alright. Wider BW would be to alter the definition of f which is at a -3dB point. A CD system producing f=22,049 would create a t=0,35/f but not at full output. The rise time could be created - this is my point. The loss is in level linearity, not in rise-time.
There is no "alternative" relation between f and t as it was set at time of big bang
//
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True, but do set a nice upper bound for audio. I.e. if you can honestly reproduce an explosion, everything else is easier.
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Using an error in a mechanical system to define the upper bound for Tr for a music reproduction system is pointless... It has to be set by audible events in music.
I.e. if you can honestly reproduce an explosion, everything else is easier.
That's why I mentioned the Bofor.
I don't think it is feasible to reproduce an explosion with audio gear used for playing music in a home environment.
P.S. provided audio gear and house remain functional after the explosion reproduction
George
Correct. And it has been repeated every time Mr. Curl insists bringing back this test of his.
George
Many here who criticize remind me of my former associates in the Ampex audio department almost 50 years ago. They were happy with a 15KHz spec. and 30ips was rejected entirely. They basically argued like many here: Why bother improving what already works, and if you find an improvement, it will only be more costly and people just don't care.
My first challenge at that time was to convince them to change to 2mil lamination reproduce heads. I proved that they were quieter and more frequency accurate, but it took about 10 years before they converted over to it. I always seem to be about 10 years ahead of the crowd. Maybe, you guys would do well to listen up more, and criticize me less! '-)
My first challenge at that time was to convince them to change to 2mil lamination reproduce heads. I proved that they were quieter and more frequency accurate, but it took about 10 years before they converted over to it. I always seem to be about 10 years ahead of the crowd. Maybe, you guys would do well to listen up more, and criticize me less! '-)
I prefer vinyl for many reasons. I enjoy the sound more. Technical merits can never overcome subjective value. And I'm into the whole ephemeral side, record shops, etc. Others couldn't be happier to use a tablet to select music, whatever, not for me.
But:
If you were to separate all vinyl and CD into two categories, vinyl vs. CD... And then remove ALL technical aspects of difference so both played as perfectly as possible and would be fairly indistinguishable with identical productions... You'd have a pretty clear cut description for both.
CD = A bunch of predominately **** masterings a/o mixings.
Vinyl = Lots of beautiful masterings a/o mixings, if you're willing to hunt them down.
So the technical aspects are relatively worthless to nit-pick over.
But:
If you were to separate all vinyl and CD into two categories, vinyl vs. CD... And then remove ALL technical aspects of difference so both played as perfectly as possible and would be fairly indistinguishable with identical productions... You'd have a pretty clear cut description for both.
CD = A bunch of predominately **** masterings a/o mixings.
Vinyl = Lots of beautiful masterings a/o mixings, if you're willing to hunt them down.
So the technical aspects are relatively worthless to nit-pick over.
I don't see why a phono stage should not be designed to cope with a mistracking transient. Certainly it shouldn't cause it to misbehave. Whether it should pass on the love to the rest of the chain that might not like it is a secondary question. RIAA eq should take much of the edge off it but it still might be sensible to add another pole outside the audio band which is switchable. As some already implement the discredited Neumann pole it's kind of already there.
Better cartridges also help
Better cartridges also help
Generally speaking all the vinyl I listen to sounds much more natural. I think it was a big advantage for the old school production guys not to be so OCD about tech parameters etc. New-ish releases are less different. But they don't generally sound as good to me as older albums. The art of making albums sound good hasn't gone up IMO.
My most recent album acquired
Grabbed this in LA a month ago.
A few other albums that I just own
Good old stuff : Anything on Liberty is worth checking out, generally, their studio was great.
Gold only label, the orange is garbage (and common): But the DCC CD is also stellar.
Everyone loves this album, and it would be criminal to play it without the sound of vinyl: it's not old, but it's fab.
Hunt down a BSK3010 (rumors) Jacksonville (texture sleeve) that is F1-7 in the dead zone. Then compared it to an F40+ (especially an F60). That'll give you an idea of how bad things get when they don't cut new enough mastered mothers... Then find a 1980's repressing and compare, or the CD. The new 45rpm one is meh.
I've got a bunch of world music, early blue grass like Bill Monroe, some classical, rock, etc. I'm the guy who listens to everything at a listening station. I buy albums, not bands, not genres.
My most recent album acquired
Grabbed this in LA a month ago.
A few other albums that I just own
Good old stuff : Anything on Liberty is worth checking out, generally, their studio was great.
Gold only label, the orange is garbage (and common): But the DCC CD is also stellar.
Everyone loves this album, and it would be criminal to play it without the sound of vinyl: it's not old, but it's fab.
Hunt down a BSK3010 (rumors) Jacksonville (texture sleeve) that is F1-7 in the dead zone. Then compared it to an F40+ (especially an F60). That'll give you an idea of how bad things get when they don't cut new enough mastered mothers... Then find a 1980's repressing and compare, or the CD. The new 45rpm one is meh.
I've got a bunch of world music, early blue grass like Bill Monroe, some classical, rock, etc. I'm the guy who listens to everything at a listening station. I buy albums, not bands, not genres.
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