It turned out pretty well. I think in order for it to be a high quality speaker, you have to have the best quality drivers you can get your hands on, as you will be stretching each to the extremes.
I tried Faital 15pr400 and Hf140 on rather large PH916 horn. It sounded quite nice, having an energy and impact that is much harder to find in smaller multi-ways but could not match the best of them in overall presentation, IMO.
If I were to make another attempt I would either push toward a larger horn with a beefy 1.4 compression driver(which ultimately leads to a super tweeter), or a midrange driver and a smaller horn/1" compression driver combo. I think you can see in what JBL has done, both of these strategies being employed. I wish I could get my hands on their horns and compression drivers, at least the nice ones. I believe that is where you would find the possiblity of a nice system. If I had a larger room, I would be looking at Le'Cleach profiles to compare to K2/M2 profiles.
FWIW, I have moved to what I would call large multiways, TMWW, MTWW, and MTMWW. The big decision now is how to address 450-20K, and 40-450. TM vs MTM(currently lean heavily toward TM or MT), and whether to use light, quick dual 8" that give up some low end, or 10's that may surrender a little speed, but dig a little deeper.
🙂
If I were to make another attempt I would either push toward a larger horn with a beefy 1.4 compression driver(which ultimately leads to a super tweeter), or a midrange driver and a smaller horn/1" compression driver combo. I think you can see in what JBL has done, both of these strategies being employed. I wish I could get my hands on their horns and compression drivers, at least the nice ones. I believe that is where you would find the possiblity of a nice system. If I had a larger room, I would be looking at Le'Cleach profiles to compare to K2/M2 profiles.
FWIW, I have moved to what I would call large multiways, TMWW, MTWW, and MTMWW. The big decision now is how to address 450-20K, and 40-450. TM vs MTM(currently lean heavily toward TM or MT), and whether to use light, quick dual 8" that give up some low end, or 10's that may surrender a little speed, but dig a little deeper.
🙂
I am also tinkering with a beefy three way.
I am currently torn between an MTM with dual 15" woofers that can go low (Beyma 15LX60v2 for instance) combined with a coax 2" mid/high driver on a large horn and a large WTMW with 10" midrange , 1" tweeter and two 12" or even 15" woofers.
There is a nice 10" PA midrange by Eightensound that doesn't cost an arm and a leg:
0019 10NMB420 - Neodymium Magnet 10NMB420 : Eighteen Sound - professional loudspeakers
Regards
Charles
I am currently torn between an MTM with dual 15" woofers that can go low (Beyma 15LX60v2 for instance) combined with a coax 2" mid/high driver on a large horn and a large WTMW with 10" midrange , 1" tweeter and two 12" or even 15" woofers.
There is a nice 10" PA midrange by Eightensound that doesn't cost an arm and a leg:
0019 10NMB420 - Neodymium Magnet 10NMB420 : Eighteen Sound - professional loudspeakers
Regards
Charles
Jbl 2384 horn can be had on eBay.
But I agree, a 1.5" crossed to double 15's gets upset @750hz 24db at cranked volumes.
1khz works a bit better, but a twist on the active crossover makes it easy to change either way.
The double 15/horn is its own niche.
Norman
But I agree, a 1.5" crossed to double 15's gets upset @750hz 24db at cranked volumes.
1khz works a bit better, but a twist on the active crossover makes it easy to change either way.
The double 15/horn is its own niche.
Norman
I twice tryed to buy 4622-hf (2430+2384) new locally 😀 .
At the moment I'm using 2430k+seos24.
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Hi Flaesh,
Your project sounds very interesting. Are you using the JBL D2 driver on the SEOS horn? Would you mind telling us about the crossover point and the sensitivity of the EQ'ed driver?
Best,
Kris
Better yet, do you have any measured data? I've been wondering how the d2 would do up high off axis on an oswg......
I did some quick measurements on my SEOS 18 (1.5" version).
Didn't look like a super match. Generally more ripple in the FR and noise in the impulse response. Could be a mismatch in throat section?
In the original M2 WG its a different story.
Also, the SEOS 18's have the "usual" unstable performance within the listening window. At 5-7kHz somewhere, the have a tendency to be very hot. I know you have noticed the same thing Nate...
Regards, Fredrik.
Didn't look like a super match. Generally more ripple in the FR and noise in the impulse response. Could be a mismatch in throat section?
In the original M2 WG its a different story.
Also, the SEOS 18's have the "usual" unstable performance within the listening window. At 5-7kHz somewhere, the have a tendency to be very hot. I know you have noticed the same thing Nate...
Regards, Fredrik.
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You said yourself in another thread (on another forum?) that the d2 exit was a negative angle.....I'm sure the seos18 has a positive entrance angle so there could be quite a mismatch.
Fredrik - thanks for the measurements. The "hot spot" from 5-8khz seems to be fairly common in oswg/conical horns to some extent. Geddes mentioned that a few years ago in the "Geddes on waveguides" thread.
Some top octave narrowing on the d2 but it's much smoother off axis than most larger exit cds I've looked at. Cool
Yes, d2 throat is negative angle.
With adding cone angle we'll get [quasi] positive angle..
😀M2 horn throat seems ~parallel.
VTX horns are expanding.
Faital doesn't make special horns for "Combined Exit"..
So the question
I'm not sure either what you mean by the "(quasi) positive angle" 😱
I've been wondering how an optimal design for this driver would look as well.
The M2 obviously uses diffraction to achieve what they were looking for there so I think a sharp transition is probably part of the design. They may be on to something, but I would rather go for as little diffraction as possible. I was doing some drawing the other day, and I wonder if a very short radius section joining the D2 to an OS profile would work. The radius would be tangent to the D2 throat and to a 0deg throat radius OS profile. This would constrict the D2 exit (1.5") down to about 1.488" and the radius section would be about .065" long.
Getting a bit ot for the topic at hand..........maybe I'll start a new thread.
I've been wondering how an optimal design for this driver would look as well.
The M2 obviously uses diffraction to achieve what they were looking for there so I think a sharp transition is probably part of the design. They may be on to something, but I would rather go for as little diffraction as possible. I was doing some drawing the other day, and I wonder if a very short radius section joining the D2 to an OS profile would work. The radius would be tangent to the D2 throat and to a 0deg throat radius OS profile. This would constrict the D2 exit (1.5") down to about 1.488" and the radius section would be about .065" long.
Getting a bit ot for the topic at hand..........maybe I'll start a new thread.
I would love to see a thread with recommendations for the correct design of the horn for D2 🙂 ..
I don't know, and after rechecking I think the ripples/noise in the previous measurement was an error on my behalf. Probably the driver was not properly centered on the horn.
Here is another one, just on axis that looks pretty good (see attachment).
Gated, no smoothing @ 2m.
This is the D2 on the SEOS 18 1.5. Not the 2450-SL like the picture title says.
so please disregard my previous post! Sorry 😱
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