Given the number of amps you have being idle it would seem silly to spend money on passive crossover parts IMO.
The ATC 50 or 100 are exceptional speakers, and this very good kits:
Floorstanding ATC K50 & K100 Loudspeakers
But if I have $2,500 for speakers, surely don't build nothing and buy a pair of Magneplanar.
Floorstanding ATC K50 & K100 Loudspeakers
But if I have $2,500 for speakers, surely don't build nothing and buy a pair of Magneplanar.
I re-listened the Seas build with the same CD. A bit unfair, because it's hooked up to my AV HT now which is running on Outlaw975 pre with Outlaw 5 ch amp. The Infinity is hooked up to a Parasound pre, Parasound DAC, Parasound amp and Crown amp for the bass. I think the Seas is a more neutral speaker. The Kappa has the super highs sound, perhaps from the planar tweeters. They are also more dramatic. Maybe it's the "highs" and the dynamics that I'm missing from the Seas.
Hi John,
your whole problem is a suboptimal XO filter and probably wrong box
type. Can't find any info on 26 RNX, only 26 RFX. You don't need to
spend money on a new project, I guess not.
The capacitors sounds pretty good. The ClarityCap is considered a premium brand. The Madisound house brand cap are ok. Since you are using better caps (at least in the HF) than the old Kappa, the quality of crossover parts does not seem to be the source of your listening dissatisfaction.
In a custom crossover job like this, there is no way for them to compensate for the variance of your drivers. Even if you provided good measurement of your individual drivers, they may or may not use them in the design process. We know that you will have to pay many times more for premium and matched drivers sets. Again, it should not have major impact on the treble sound.
I suspect that the main source of your complaint comes from the fact that you are used to the EMIT ribbon tweeter sound from the old Infinite Kappa. You can be assured that the Seas soft dome will sound completely different.
Call Madisound to describe your dissatisfaction with the highs of your system, they may have some suggestion for tweeter substitute. But make sure that you like a ribbon tweeter better than a soft dome. (I just happen to like the soft dome better. It is very personal about what one considers more accurate in sound.)
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Certainly. Going from passive to active crossovers offers the biggest jump up in performance. Professional, highly efficient, and linear drivers installed in well thought out enclosures, goes right along with that. Stomps all over that wimpy
high-fidelity stuff.
Can you recommend any active designs? The LX 521 is the only one I'm aware of, and I'm not sure if it's great for my type of music (classic rock mostly and some pop - no rap, metal or classical). Thanks, J
well, discussing sound perception is like discussing art in words. so there is no way here to tell what would best couple with your listening space and best meet your expectations. other than that there are A LOT of choices.
since your space is pretty big, I would suggest you make use of the subs and the high Watt amps you already have and go bi-amped, with a miniDSP or alike XO for low bass only. then put something on top that can give you large dynamics in the mids and whatever dispersion you fancy over your listening area. lots of aproaches there. many already mentioned here.
I myself have Joe Rassmussen's Elsinores. it's a great pair for the budget, 85L per box, tuned to 32-33 Hz. I have the "original" version with Peerless drivers. they have a new version now on the thread. the only challenge is to get an Alu tweeter waveguide for it. they have to be towed in quite a bit. once broken they excel at vocals, jazz, broadway style music but they can also do a decent job on house and techno if needed. Joe's unusual XO (series-parallel) allows for a plain vanila amp to do a very good job driving them. I cannot say much about rock since many of those recordings are not of great quality to begin with.
a large pro mid xoed to a CD or an AMT (like TPL-150) would also be something I would like to hear.
good luck.
since your space is pretty big, I would suggest you make use of the subs and the high Watt amps you already have and go bi-amped, with a miniDSP or alike XO for low bass only. then put something on top that can give you large dynamics in the mids and whatever dispersion you fancy over your listening area. lots of aproaches there. many already mentioned here.
I myself have Joe Rassmussen's Elsinores. it's a great pair for the budget, 85L per box, tuned to 32-33 Hz. I have the "original" version with Peerless drivers. they have a new version now on the thread. the only challenge is to get an Alu tweeter waveguide for it. they have to be towed in quite a bit. once broken they excel at vocals, jazz, broadway style music but they can also do a decent job on house and techno if needed. Joe's unusual XO (series-parallel) allows for a plain vanila amp to do a very good job driving them. I cannot say much about rock since many of those recordings are not of great quality to begin with.
a large pro mid xoed to a CD or an AMT (like TPL-150) would also be something I would like to hear.
good luck.
Joe Rassmussen's has made a large batch of waveguides, so sourcing this part is not a problem now, you can have a look on the Elsinore thread here :
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/97043-elsinore-project-thread-191.html#post4193563
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/97043-elsinore-project-thread-198.html#post4350071
I personnaly own an aluminium pair of waveguide, i'm planning to start my Elsinore build this summer. Now I own the Nomex164 which use the sames speakers than the mk5 version.
IMO something like Bagby's Kairos, sealed and XO'd to a pair of dual subs using top woofers for bass reinforcement. Acoustic Elegance comes to mind. You could probably get something like dual TD12S woofers with plate amplifier.
Of course, if we are going to huge SPLs, a high-end SEOS-based speaker could also be an option. Linkwitz's LX521 are also a strong choice.
Of course, if we are going to huge SPLs, a high-end SEOS-based speaker could also be an option. Linkwitz's LX521 are also a strong choice.
My opinion on the subject: (and only my 2 cents )
The vast majority of electroacoustic transducers express their material own characteristic and are recognizable in auditions. I never heard a soft dome tweeter that sounded "open" in HF compared to metal (so most silk domes sound muted to me), and I never heard a metal dome that was as "natural" as the soft domes in some situations, and most metal domes sound like metal at extreme HF to my ears... The ribbon tweeters sound with a good HF presence in my ears, which the domes do not have at that level. These differences are relatively small, and sometimes virtually invisible to simple measurements (maybe/probably several composite complex measurements show that), but they are enough to start a controversy ...
When I received the TQWT mkII kit from Troels Gravesen, containing the Audax TW034 in an waveguide, I was disappointed at first: the soft dome did not have that "interesting" HF sound of my previous ribbons, for example. But it sounded exceptionally neutral and support very high SPL before distortion becomes objectionable, so I decided to continue with them, and was rewarded with time: besides me adapting hearing to the new condition, the "resin" covering the dome must have hardened a bit (with a year dust...), and the tweeter really sounds more open than before, even comparing to another speaker I maintaned from the same time I received the kit.
Maybe take a large burn-in time and so the tweeter maybe hard a little and assist in the results... or loosen the suspensions, or material change the break-ups a little, or all of this.
Like other members here have spoken, I have very curious to know the TP-150H of Beyma, seems very promising ...
The vast majority of electroacoustic transducers express their material own characteristic and are recognizable in auditions. I never heard a soft dome tweeter that sounded "open" in HF compared to metal (so most silk domes sound muted to me), and I never heard a metal dome that was as "natural" as the soft domes in some situations, and most metal domes sound like metal at extreme HF to my ears... The ribbon tweeters sound with a good HF presence in my ears, which the domes do not have at that level. These differences are relatively small, and sometimes virtually invisible to simple measurements (maybe/probably several composite complex measurements show that), but they are enough to start a controversy ...
When I received the TQWT mkII kit from Troels Gravesen, containing the Audax TW034 in an waveguide, I was disappointed at first: the soft dome did not have that "interesting" HF sound of my previous ribbons, for example. But it sounded exceptionally neutral and support very high SPL before distortion becomes objectionable, so I decided to continue with them, and was rewarded with time: besides me adapting hearing to the new condition, the "resin" covering the dome must have hardened a bit (with a year dust...), and the tweeter really sounds more open than before, even comparing to another speaker I maintaned from the same time I received the kit.
Maybe take a large burn-in time and so the tweeter maybe hard a little and assist in the results... or loosen the suspensions, or material change the break-ups a little, or all of this.
Like other members here have spoken, I have very curious to know the TP-150H of Beyma, seems very promising ...
Troelsgravesen
Following many references here, I read this experimenter's site.
Maybe he is a great designer, may be all his designs are works of genius and hard work. Certainly his machining and woodwork look that way.
But, Lord, the arrogance! If Donald Trump were a speaker builder, he would probably sound like this. Ours is a hobby that thrives on humility and helping each other, not a place to prove you are better or above others. On his site, just about every paragraph ends with a warning: do not dare ask me XYZ!
Again, may be he is everything he makes himself out to be. But...arrogance typically snuffs out criticism, without which excellence is often just in the protanist's mind.
Following many references here, I read this experimenter's site.
Maybe he is a great designer, may be all his designs are works of genius and hard work. Certainly his machining and woodwork look that way.
But, Lord, the arrogance! If Donald Trump were a speaker builder, he would probably sound like this. Ours is a hobby that thrives on humility and helping each other, not a place to prove you are better or above others. On his site, just about every paragraph ends with a warning: do not dare ask me XYZ!
Again, may be he is everything he makes himself out to be. But...arrogance typically snuffs out criticism, without which excellence is often just in the protanist's mind.
The problem with Johnny-Come_Lately's reading his website is that he has been doing this for years and knows his designs are good, because he designs, builds, tests, AND listens to them. What you need to understand is that he has been bombarded with questions (many of them incomprehensibly stupid) and he has had enough.
What you misconstrue as arrogance is having had a gutful of dealing with imbeciles. Spare a little thought for him. He offers his designs for free (largely) so you benefit from his hard work.
Don't throw stones when you don't know the story.
I'm a fan of Troels. He was gracious in helping me, and never asked for payment.
Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
Are you aware of the logical fallacy, False Equivalency?
If some people ask imbecilic questions, it isn't unreasonable to label them imbeciles. All you have to do is look at some of the questions asked on this site, such as, "i jus instaled a 4 miilion watt amp to drive my 2 million wat speakers in my car and wen my eers bled the amp bust in flaims.what is wrong/".
I shouldn't need to remind you not all DIYers have angel wings and a halo.
Another for the list.