Mine is horrifying, a special "green" design where each room is a zone with impossible to replace dual counter-rotating 6" fans from the computer industry. I traced the wrong way one to old DEC mainframes, the ebay price is often >$200 and there are 8.
ATC P4 :
850W total power (one channel delivers 200W in 16 ohm => 80V minimum rails)
150W minimum power consumption, 1200W max.
Class A ? (or minimum AB biasing)
Sunon 12Vdc/80mm fans, mounted on the outside.
Maglev (PVW1) series, best to expect is 28-30dB for a 33cfm specimen.
2 channels adds 3dB, 3 fans per monoblock makes it close to 40dB.
Inaudible ?
http://www.atcloudspeakers.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/ATC-P4-Amp-backWedsite-Edit-Large.png
(lots of fancy brands who offer active versions, e.g. Meridian, Magico, Kharma. A friend of mine owns 2 sets of B&O Beolab5, in a surround setup with his 103'' plasma tv. He absolutely adores them, they look pretty, but I wouldn't even want them if they came free)
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Before their last or last but one site update ATC called them class A and somewhere in the blurb mentioned the level of biasing.
Apparently Linn makes some active ones too but I wouldn't wish anything Linn on my worst enemy. The only usable thing they make is turntable which is a bolt-for-bolt copy of an ancient Thorens (deleted in the early '70s I think, about 6 months before the Linn hit the sales rooms).
Apparently Linn makes some active ones too but I wouldn't wish anything Linn on my worst enemy. The only usable thing they make is turntable which is a bolt-for-bolt copy of an ancient Thorens (deleted in the early '70s I think, about 6 months before the Linn hit the sales rooms).
B&M Line 100, >$500K. Line 50, >$100K. (mid '80s, BM40, >$35K)
Cabasse La Sphere, complete with dsp and 8 power amps, >$200K (mid '80s, Albatros VII, >$30K)
Plenty more examples, but altogether still a small piece of the big buck loudspeaker pie.
Cabasse La Sphere, complete with dsp and 8 power amps, >$200K (mid '80s, Albatros VII, >$30K)
Plenty more examples, but altogether still a small piece of the big buck loudspeaker pie.
i was shocked when i heard some profesional, about rca cables sounding better in one direction than the other.. 😱DC cable rejuvinator... I will make millions
1) refresh electrons
2) slow down, almost eliminate cable oxidation
3) retrain electrons to move in the right direction (that's why the writing on the cable is important)
🙂
At least you didn't claim Linn copied the AR XA. That would be just silly.
May be Thorens copied the suspended chassis design but with the Linn you can actually exchange all parts with the Thorens except the plinth.
Oddly enough Thorens invented direct drive in the '20s but never built one themselves.
They did however have some built by EMT and re-badged them.
Personally I'd pick an EMT dd over any belt-driven table.
Oddly enough Thorens invented direct drive in the '20s but never built one themselves.
They did however have some built by EMT and re-badged them.
Personally I'd pick an EMT dd over any belt-driven table.
Amusing web site. 100's of Watts for horns? But do they still sound like horns?
On second thought, despite enjoying the company of JD, you were sorely missed at the ETF shoot-out range.
The active designs are seeming to move into using digital crossovers these days. I find that I cannot get decent sound out of any digital crossover.
What the audiophools, (as one might call them, but not I), at the upper tier..are looking for..is micro phase coherence in transient aspects of fundamentals and harmonics, so that the entire note structure sound as natural as possible. digital, for all it's abilities, cannot do that. Some aspects of passive crossovers allow for that very well.
When I tried to mess about with digital crossover units, I tried all the best units of the time period. This was a few years back. If you look at the technical side of it, you look that the numerical transform aspects of the hardware, you see that you can get phase coherence, but at a cost - one of the loss of the very subtle aspects of micro phase changes in micro and macro transient function, and how all of them relate to one another, in the given millisecond grouping. (as that is what the ear listens for and hears by)
In that, digital fails. it sounds grungy and gritty/dirty, no matter what you do to the crossover. The best sound I could get out of a digital crossover was to use it as a simple, no extra parameter of any kind...6db per octave system.
Any additional corrections enacted numerical additions and shifts in the chain of levels, and how they were handled, all that would introduce even more error in the all to critical areas of the signal that I mentioned.
At this point in time, the best I've heard or am aware of...is still analog crossovers. Active or passive (or a combination, that is best) but all analog, not digital. Digital is great for venues, overnight set-up, etc, but I still prefer analog even there, and if correctly done, in a permanent install, I can still get more quality sound out of an analog install over that of digital.
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Wow, that's quite an elitist statement. Even the roadies? 🙄
Many a good sound engineer started out as a roadie, you know. They aren't all knuckle draggers.
I know roadies very well. I knew all the roadies in the GD film, and several were good friends and we still say hello when we meet. However, hi fi was not their first love, but I do have a pair of portable speakers made of GD Birch with 5" drivers that two of them made for me. Of course they could hear, but then they had far more exposure to really high level sound than most people, including me, as I did not work every show. Still, they could hear differences in amps that many here would dismiss.
I think JC was alluding to the ability of roadies to hear from between the thighs of grateful (pun intended) groupies... A rare skill, hence JC's compliment.
I think.
I think.
The lingo used is rather absurd.....micro, micro, so you can hear "millionths" worth of error? This drivel has the appropriate wording, with no technical aspects whatsoever. Gritty, dirty, grungy....what is up with these descriptions?
Get serious will ya'? Music, all music can be broken down mathematically, so we don't have to resort to nonsensical descriptions. Measure once, twice...however long & arduous it takes to get the numbers......then we'll talk & DBT your data.
__________________________________________________Rick........
LOL, but some are...... I've worked with plenty.
The international tour production guys are all well switched on.
That said, they'll all have an opinion on the sound (coming from a variously experienced background), maybe not expressed in audiophile terms, but valid nonetheless.
If a roadie reckons the sound is good they'll say so.
If there is something not quite right, they'll say so also.
Dan.
Reading this gives me the impression that you got so used to hearing the aberrations introduced by analogue, speaker-level crossovers that you actually miss them when they are not present and are now scrabbling to find scientific sounding reasons why you prefer to listen to the technically inferior product without having to admit it to yourself.
Most roadies working around high spl levels have hearing damage. How do they determine which huge speaker driver is or isn't working in an array? Stick their head right next to it while it's playing in excess of 120 dB 😱 Sure some will be wearing hearing protection but most not. Ever been to a venue where the soundboard man is going deaf? Horrendous sound turned up to painful distorted levels.The only roadie with good hearing is the one that hasn't been working the circuit very long.
Working around the GD does get you around 'groupies' but usually only for the band, unless there is an excess, and the band members are booked up.
On the road with the GD sound system with about 75 groupie women got me plenty.
However, living with 75 female classical musicians got me plenty too!
I find Roadies to be 'complex'. Usually tough, low educated, wannabe musicians themselves, most with the GD had lousy restaurant table manners, for example, but they were usually quiet about the sound system, unless there was a BIG problem. It is the mix and recording engineers, who mingle with the roadies, and sometimes work along side them that really analyze the sound every day. The GD movie had 3 of these people mentioned or interviewed. Healey, the concert mix engineer, and Bob and Betty, the recording engineers, as the GD had its own 16 channel, 2" mastering recorder. They had great ears.
On the road with the GD sound system with about 75 groupie women got me plenty.
However, living with 75 female classical musicians got me plenty too!
I find Roadies to be 'complex'. Usually tough, low educated, wannabe musicians themselves, most with the GD had lousy restaurant table manners, for example, but they were usually quiet about the sound system, unless there was a BIG problem. It is the mix and recording engineers, who mingle with the roadies, and sometimes work along side them that really analyze the sound every day. The GD movie had 3 of these people mentioned or interviewed. Healey, the concert mix engineer, and Bob and Betty, the recording engineers, as the GD had its own 16 channel, 2" mastering recorder. They had great ears.
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