Put my android on noise meter and logged 4 times 30 seconds house music lol it hurts but not as much as testtone lol.
PeakdB 86,0dB with coax, 86,9dB with twisted pair.
LAeq max 65,6 avr 64,6 dB with coax
LAeq max 66.2 avr 66.0 dB twisted pair
My phone also seems to detect a louder twisted pair. So louder because of lower capacitance ???
PeakdB 86,0dB with coax, 86,9dB with twisted pair.
LAeq max 65,6 avr 64,6 dB with coax
LAeq max 66.2 avr 66.0 dB twisted pair
My phone also seems to detect a louder twisted pair. So louder because of lower capacitance ???
Would be fun if the coax and twisted pair could be measured so any differences also vs. frequency could be revealed.
More nonsense!
Where are the cables from/to? The 'phone?!😱
How can you judge that the insulation (which?) is "unstable" etc etc.
I don't know why I am bothering!
Where are the cables from/to? The 'phone?!😱
How can you judge that the insulation (which?) is "unstable" etc etc.
I don't know why I am bothering!
Soundwise the slightly louder one often is considered better/is preferred. But in my case I do not feel comfortable with unshielded cable from cdtransport to poweramp, dac=poweramp in my situation. I worry too much lol.
Also wonder if impedance is so much off now that it does matter even with only 0.9 meter
Also wonder if impedance is so much off now that it does matter even with only 0.9 meter
If the difference in capacitance causes a noticeable difference in signal level then there is something seriously wrong with the source. Or you are measuring signal+noise so the twisted pair picks up more EM junk - just as we said.
Do not believe something wrong with my source or anything else in my system. Difference in level not from outside the cable.
What is the claimed output impedance of your source? Can you be sure that the alleged greater signal level is all audio from the source and not interference? As the person claiming unphysical effects the burden of proof rests with you.
Do you suggest inaudible interference carries digital signal to higher level somehow? Would be funny, almost unphysical, but surely illogical. Recorded silence I listened to was barely audible with a hint more spike/static with twisted pair, can't hear noise with music.
Primare specifies this audio digital output as spdiff, nothing more.
But you keep looking in wrong direction I believe, almost religously believing spdiff cables never should make a difference, whatever form they take. Both transmitter and receiver are 100% closer to spec than this unshielded twisted pair ever can be.
Primare specifies this audio digital output as spdiff, nothing more.
But you keep looking in wrong direction I believe, almost religously believing spdiff cables never should make a difference, whatever form they take. Both transmitter and receiver are 100% closer to spec than this unshielded twisted pair ever can be.
You are seriously claiming that a change of cable type carrying digital audio causes a measurable difference in the resultant analogue signal level?
No, not religion: just physics/maths/engineering. The 'religion' is among those who claim that impossible things are happening.irribeo said:
Most likely the unshielded analog interconnect picked up a slight amount of noise or interference. Not enough to be bothersome just enough to add some sparkle to the sound.
The real difference can come when your system with wires plugged in is subject to even the most basic say conducted immunity test or similar.
On a different note, I wonder whether really high tech gear, say medical/aerospace or military stuff, the engineers worry about the dielectric becoming polarized, breaking the cables in etc...
On a different note, I wonder whether really high tech gear, say medical/aerospace or military stuff, the engineers worry about the dielectric becoming polarized, breaking the cables in etc...
DF96, Peak dB is higher, from cd hrough cable to powerdac->speakers and uncalibrated mic/app. 30 sec "music" 4 times, 1st coax, 2nd,3rd twisted pair, 4th time coax. Just sharing. Posted all details. I also listened to music, Brahms-Vengerov, Enya. AB repeat 15 seconds roughly, lower avr volume, probably dozen times, and coming from coax listening to twisted pair I felt it was louder, several times. Funny thing was I could not be sure about it being softer from twisted to coax. Somehow I can't tell volume going down a little(after short break). Difference is not huge, I am certain I can't hear it at this time of day/night.
Once again I read you say physics/maths/engenering tells you there can't be any difference between whatever cable used for spdiff (or at least short cables I described). does that also mean you can't hear a difference, whatever short cinch/rca you use for spdiff in your system (at home, using home-audio) or do you mean you just can't explain?
Once again I read you say physics/maths/engenering tells you there can't be any difference between whatever cable used for spdiff (or at least short cables I described). does that also mean you can't hear a difference, whatever short cinch/rca you use for spdiff in your system (at home, using home-audio) or do you mean you just can't explain?
Without scope and eye diagrams of the interface you cannot determine any metrics of the interface, the digital side requires this, anything else is speculation.
No, what he said was that you can't get a level difference that way. Other differences are unlikely, but possible, manifesting as noise or pops/dropouts.
It's a straightforward extension of this that's the "answer". Vary the method of transmitting signals and the level and type of interference and noise that's introduced varies. This then intermodulates with the audio signal, especially with dynamic waveforms, ie. music. Not obvious distortion, but the low level, noise floor, quality of the waveform is altered, the spectrum of such if isolated from the 'pure' music signal will differ between the two connection types, and the powerful DSP mechanism in your head filters this out, and says, this replay sounds "different".
Good ol' pyschoacoustics then also climbs on board, meaning that the subjective impression of the loudness of one version versus the other will not be identical, because of that variation. Every objective measurement will show perfect equivalence, but inside your head what your hearing registers will be a contrary 'result' ...
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Depends on how level is measured and how severe and frequent the dropouts are. In the limiting case, the level will be zero!
Dropouts are EXTREMELY audible, so it's easy to confirm that you do/don't have them. Far more likely is that you're using a not very repeatable measurement method.
Dropouts are EXTREMELY audible, so it's easy to confirm that you do/don't have them. Far more likely is that you're using a not very repeatable measurement method.
SPDIF uses unbalanced 75ohm coaxial cable. Using anything other than this could at best make no difference, and at worst could cause data corruption (unlikely, as it would sound horrible so you would notice it) or increased jitter (likely, but audibility may vary). Increased jitter is unlikely to increase analogue signal level. However, the added distortion might create the perception of increased signal level.irribeo said:
Measuring the level of a changing music signal is very difficult. Estimating the level by hearing is even less reliable. I don't think there is anything I need to explain.
If someone told me he had just seen a unicorn I would not feel under too much pressure to 'explain' it, given that what he claims to have seen is known not to exist and explanations are trivial: alcohol or other recreational substances, fatigue, a practical joke etc.
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