Sorry Brian about that ear problem. The turntable was entirely Martinas and she has the skill and patients to adjust it to perfection. Martina knows that the Aro is not the end of the world but her combination was good enough to fascinate. At home i use a Spiral Groove SG 1 with Triplanar arm and Titan i or Olympos. I will mount the Schroeder Artemiz soon because the Triplanar is a bit too heavy for optimum placement of the fundamental resonance. The Spiral Groove sits on a table that i designed and that is on a granite floor. The granite is on 50cm concrete and that is poured right on the soil.
Even Jacco going beserk could not push the neadle out of the groove i asume. Anyway, there are not many people on this planet that can adjust a turntable to perfection and that is a problem in reality. I whould guess that 90% of turntable users have not heard their table at the optimum. I have seen Be´s table too and it is a work of art.
Even Jacco going beserk could not push the neadle out of the groove i asume. Anyway, there are not many people on this planet that can adjust a turntable to perfection and that is a problem in reality. I whould guess that 90% of turntable users have not heard their table at the optimum. I have seen Be´s table too and it is a work of art.
And here I was on my drive home last night listening to Bing Crosby singing Christmas songs that were recorded on an Ampex 300 tape deck over an FM station that he used to own. (I assume the tapes were transcribed to a digital format and not on broadcast carts) Probably recorded in one take, no overdubs, no studio processors.
Not as much high frequency content as the newer stuff, but much more listenable.
Distortion is a term that covers way too much area. Pavel is quite right when mentions that distortions such as second or third harmonic are not a problem when they are down by 30 db. Ninth order probably would be objectionable at that level if there were actually a circuit that bad, so we probably can't test that.
Crossover notch problems at -30 would show up, but that brings up the issue of levels.
When you use a test waveform you can get a precise measurement, there is no difference between the peak and average levels. When playing music you may have a peak to average level of 20 to 30db. Live recording can be even greater. So reproducing a low note on a pipe organ may cause artifacts that are objectionable to the ear, but below the assumed measured criterion.
Of course record warp, a well addressed issue can cause similar problems.
So when Pavel mentions vinyl distortion, I am confident his measurements are correct. As to how they are perceived, well your ears are your judge.
I do know from setting up many turntables that minor adjustments do make a difference. I of course cheated. I would tweak an adjustment one way until I could hear a change, then back the other way until I would hear another change. The I would set the adjustment in the middle. Someone once observing me do this noted he did not hear each adjustment I made, but when I was done it was to him quite an improvement.
As to IC versus discrete, This is an old issue, one that the market has decided. Except for a few specialty suppliers, there is no work going on in improving discrete semiconductors, all the money goes where the return on investment is. Do IC's work better? Well given an infinite amount of money and the resources discretes probably would have the advantage, as you could optimize each and every part. Reality is you don't have the money and the parts being made tilt the new design towards IC's. So since we in the high end audio business are not the major market force we must accept what is made and try to pick the devices that best suit our needs.
There are of course parts made for audio, actually there are some very low noise transistors and other parts of fairly new vintage. These parts are made for the larger "Music" market where the volume justifies some investment. So yes there are still folks using 1970's semiconductors in new designs.
Do you know what you call a musician who breaks up with his girlfriend?
That is why low cost is an issue in products for that market.
Not as much high frequency content as the newer stuff, but much more listenable.
Distortion is a term that covers way too much area. Pavel is quite right when mentions that distortions such as second or third harmonic are not a problem when they are down by 30 db. Ninth order probably would be objectionable at that level if there were actually a circuit that bad, so we probably can't test that.
Crossover notch problems at -30 would show up, but that brings up the issue of levels.
When you use a test waveform you can get a precise measurement, there is no difference between the peak and average levels. When playing music you may have a peak to average level of 20 to 30db. Live recording can be even greater. So reproducing a low note on a pipe organ may cause artifacts that are objectionable to the ear, but below the assumed measured criterion.
Of course record warp, a well addressed issue can cause similar problems.
So when Pavel mentions vinyl distortion, I am confident his measurements are correct. As to how they are perceived, well your ears are your judge.
I do know from setting up many turntables that minor adjustments do make a difference. I of course cheated. I would tweak an adjustment one way until I could hear a change, then back the other way until I would hear another change. The I would set the adjustment in the middle. Someone once observing me do this noted he did not hear each adjustment I made, but when I was done it was to him quite an improvement.
As to IC versus discrete, This is an old issue, one that the market has decided. Except for a few specialty suppliers, there is no work going on in improving discrete semiconductors, all the money goes where the return on investment is. Do IC's work better? Well given an infinite amount of money and the resources discretes probably would have the advantage, as you could optimize each and every part. Reality is you don't have the money and the parts being made tilt the new design towards IC's. So since we in the high end audio business are not the major market force we must accept what is made and try to pick the devices that best suit our needs.
There are of course parts made for audio, actually there are some very low noise transistors and other parts of fairly new vintage. These parts are made for the larger "Music" market where the volume justifies some investment. So yes there are still folks using 1970's semiconductors in new designs.
Do you know what you call a musician who breaks up with his girlfriend?
That is why low cost is an issue in products for that market.
Last edited:
Homeless, as I was when I developed the comp differential jfet input stage in 1971. Lived in a 16 mm sound studio, when I could not find a girlfriend to sleep with. Those were the days! Beautiful women, on occasion, hard times, and a mind free to create, rather than put out 'fires' in the workplace. Sat on the dock of the bay, on occasion, didn't see Otis there, however. ;-)
Joachim, I just use a Linn Sondek, by choice, and one of the less expensive cartridges that you sell. I wish I had gotten what Allen initially recommended, but even at discount, it was costly. It had an SL in the title, and cost $2200 at the time. I have always regretted not going for it.
Hah! Having met Jacco, I'm convinced he can do anything when he goes beserk! Just pray it doesn't happen when you are around 😀
jan didden
Joao, I too, love analog magnetic tape, but it is REALLY HARD to get software for it, these days. Back in the day, I designed these monsters, and was very good at it, but the best recorded sound that I have ever listened to is DIRECT DISC vinyl. I had dozens of examples, before the firestorm, 19 years ago, and a wall of master tapes as well. All lost, alas, so I have to enjoy what is still available, and used record shops did come to my aid.
Thank you for that Joachim.
Martina sounds to be the type of person of whom there are too few around!
I too have had a Wheaton, but it was the first thick arm-tube version. It was superb - to me - with an Io and a Be Cartridge on a SP10. I also had a Breuer but that could not handle low compliance heavy MCs
Agree that set up and mounting are of paramount importance and a well set up TT will always be better than a good one badly aligned/mounted. I am at present replinthing a rebuilt SP10 motor in a slate/alloy plinth, with all electronic controls a meter away- including speed change and on/off switching. I am doing much the same with an old Lenco 75 - with a 1" fine grain pure carbon mat.
Here is a pic of Be's air bearing TT. It has a Morrisanni (spelling) unipivot arm. The carbon top is the tip of the iceberg, and the brass rim is all PLatter which floats as I earlier described! I cannot give any details as to the way in which this is achieved as it is not my right to disclose such information. I think that I have other pics and if anyone is interested please PM me as I don't want to go tooo far off topic!
Attachments
I had an extra long Breuer tone arm before the firestorm. I miss it!
Herr Breuer is quite a character, as well. Is he still with us?
Herr Breuer is quite a character, as well. Is he still with us?
Unlucky you JC.
Yes, I believe that he is not only still around but is again producing his arms for sale. Try a Google search.
Hear, Hear.
It's inspiring ladies such as Martina Schoener and EveAnna Manley that make a hick realise how astonishing the opposite corner is.
(either that, or i'm a sucker for strongminded chicks)
On the gotta meet one day V-Impressive-P list : MySpace - Vanimal - 42 - Female - Chino - myspace.com/manleylabs
I really had a crush on Eve Anna some years ago. Any woman who could drink, gamble, and ride a motorcycle, is OK in my book! ;-) I have an autographed picture of here in my bedroom, in an 'art' pose.
John, i do not know how old your Linn is but in it´s latest incarnation it is still the de facto standart here in Germany. That table is very good although i am not an expert to set it up.
The other John ( Atkinson that is ) swears by it too so overall performance is still excelent
regardless what the Linn haters say.
Talked to Stig the other day. He has a Vendetta and is interested in an update. Did he contact you because he may help you out with a new cart ?
Yes, Jan , i agree. Even 50cm concrete can not stop Jacko.
The other John ( Atkinson that is ) swears by it too so overall performance is still excelent
regardless what the Linn haters say.
Talked to Stig the other day. He has a Vendetta and is interested in an update. Did he contact you because he may help you out with a new cart ?
Yes, Jan , i agree. Even 50cm concrete can not stop Jacko.
More than happy to help, and MY Linn is not the best available, I traded it for a Vendetta upgrade, with a 'Stereophile reviewer', now deceased, and he got the newer one, in the early '90's, after the firestorm. However, I lived with a Linn from 1974, and I love it, warts and all. ;-)
Joachim,
i'm not so sure about that.
I studied/worked in radiology as sort of an academic interlude, knowing each bone and protuberantia of the human skeleton works a charm if there's ever a need to floor my 400lbs gardner, who moonshines as a "collector" for the local mob.
However, going bezerk is becoming rather expensive nowadays, i'm still on roll-call for 4 x 40 hours community service, as in serving coffee/tea at the local elderly home.
Either that, or 50cm walls for 2 months.
Couple of months ago i got into an arguement with a local fat femme hippique, can't hit a woman so i threatened to knock out her horse.
Close call for someone who postponed a 2 year probation by appealing against a sentence for physical assault.
Fortunately i can outbooz anyone on this planet, without getting nasty.
No need to explain to you that living with yourself is the hardest.
But hey, i'm soiree cooking with a forensic pathologist early januari 2k11, let's hope she doesn't bring her own stash of knives and ingredients.
Howcome Mr Curl has all the juicy bits each time ?
Last edited:
- Status
- Not open for further replies.