Depends on how you define better. With regards to less HISSSSSSSS, SNR ratios, and raw power, most newer amplifiers will tromp the old school relics.
With regards to longevity, I want to see the latest offerings from China or Korea still running 15 years from now. To boot, the ones with SMDs are WAY more difficult to self-service if something goes poof.
Lastly, look at where Performance Auto & Sound's advertising revenue comes from. You think Alpine, Soundstream, Kenwood, etc. would advertise in their magazine if they said old school was better?
With regards to longevity, I want to see the latest offerings from China or Korea still running 15 years from now. To boot, the ones with SMDs are WAY more difficult to self-service if something goes poof.
Lastly, look at where Performance Auto & Sound's advertising revenue comes from. You think Alpine, Soundstream, Kenwood, etc. would advertise in their magazine if they said old school was better?
grumble, grumble, grumble...
The magazine exists largely on the advertising budget of today's manufacturers. It would be foolish to suggest that current manufacturers weren't making leaps and bounds of progress in technology.
It's a tough market out there right now. Retailers and manufacturers alike need all the help they can get from publications, or anywhere they can get it.
As an indicator to the state of car audio amplifier sales, I was told recently that JL wasn't even going to have a booth at the upcoming CES.
(edit) sorry, 0ldSch00l -I didn't see your reply. At least we agree.
The magazine exists largely on the advertising budget of today's manufacturers. It would be foolish to suggest that current manufacturers weren't making leaps and bounds of progress in technology.
It's a tough market out there right now. Retailers and manufacturers alike need all the help they can get from publications, or anywhere they can get it.
As an indicator to the state of car audio amplifier sales, I was told recently that JL wasn't even going to have a booth at the upcoming CES.
(edit) sorry, 0ldSch00l -I didn't see your reply. At least we agree.
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People here would not be running certain old amps if they sucked, even though some specs might be better in new amps. What I find is new amps tend to clip really nasty compared to my favorite old amps, and since I tend to not run huge amps it is a significant issue when I stand on them once in a great while.
It would be nice if someone brought up distortion ratios and harmonics.
On the other hand I've run some popular great old school amps that had turn on thump, hiss, and thought why do people like these things? If you really want to have fun look up discussions on linear power amps 🙂
The only thing I see new is ICEpower and the hybrids, and really they are not that new they just seemed to have figured out how to make them cheap enough now, but I'm not sure how much innovation JL has into the hybrids. Home amps been running class D IC amps for some time. But when you can get an old class AB thru-hole put together in China for near nothing and they work, why bother improving something....I guess, can't see much other reason.
320464522863 is a rare LP, but only good for certain things. IIRC 2x30 & 1x60, but you could run the mono sub at 1/2 ohm (4x4ohm subs). Friend of mine still has one, they were great to just toss in a car and have an instant system and work well with efficient drivers. But you can't change the xover or anything, well maybe a tech can with solder I don't know. I would not have much use for one these days unless it was a small system.
It would be nice if someone brought up distortion ratios and harmonics.
On the other hand I've run some popular great old school amps that had turn on thump, hiss, and thought why do people like these things? If you really want to have fun look up discussions on linear power amps 🙂
The only thing I see new is ICEpower and the hybrids, and really they are not that new they just seemed to have figured out how to make them cheap enough now, but I'm not sure how much innovation JL has into the hybrids. Home amps been running class D IC amps for some time. But when you can get an old class AB thru-hole put together in China for near nothing and they work, why bother improving something....I guess, can't see much other reason.
320464522863 is a rare LP, but only good for certain things. IIRC 2x30 & 1x60, but you could run the mono sub at 1/2 ohm (4x4ohm subs). Friend of mine still has one, they were great to just toss in a car and have an instant system and work well with efficient drivers. But you can't change the xover or anything, well maybe a tech can with solder I don't know. I would not have much use for one these days unless it was a small system.
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My experience with Linear Power was that they fell short of the expectations I had for them. I guess that is what I get for remembering how awesome they were in the late 80s/early 90s and listening to the LP cult followers.
Oh well, live and learn.
Oh well, live and learn.
I finished fixing an older Punch 150 last week, and that thing has tons of power. I've been curing the epoxy on the VC of my ID 12" which in 4 ohms, should handle 500 watts. That's saying something about old school amps with new parts!
LP were great amps back in the day, and appear to clip more like a tube amp IMO. Can never get the real gurus to say much about them however. I didn't think they were that clean at higher volumes, but great bass/sub amps. I hear they draw a lot of current though. There is a great post IIRC here a guy says he worked there and they are nothing special, I would tend to agree but I only used up to the xx02 series. I have a feeling some like that tube sound, I know I'd much rather have that then what most new amps do. Most say get a larger amp but often for me too much of a pain to install/finance for the few times I will use most of it....and I can still hear. But I found other amps that work for me much cheaper than LPs.
Whoa! Someone getting crazy on epay 200429959459 Nice amp but wow, if it is someone here I hope you have a good reason or values went up and I didn't know it.
yeah....some interesting bidding goin on there too....makes me want to dust off a few of my 3566 and see what they go for...
Then again, it could also be the seller, or someone the seller knows, shill bidding the amp up. I've seen that happen way too many times with certain sellers, especially one from Mississippi who is always selling his "rare, custom, or one of a kind" amps!
yeah....i was kinda hinting at that....those sequential bids....has to make one wonder..
ive bought a few amps that way.... the last bid beat me, then they mysteriously cant make the payment, so the seller offers the item to me for my highest bid...i politely decline, then point out that the "correct" amount should be my highest bid BEFORE the mystery bidder "started" bidding....all but one seller agreed with me....i shall not name names though....lol
ive bought a few amps that way.... the last bid beat me, then they mysteriously cant make the payment, so the seller offers the item to me for my highest bid...i politely decline, then point out that the "correct" amount should be my highest bid BEFORE the mystery bidder "started" bidding....all but one seller agreed with me....i shall not name names though....lol
Quoted from the auction:
"RMS per channel @ 12 Volts:
150W @4-ohms stereo
200W @2-ohms stereo
400W @4-ohms mono
RMS per channel @ 14.4 Volts:
230W @4-ohms stereo
315W @2-ohms stereo
630W @4-ohms mono"
Umm, I do believe the 14.4V power a figment of the seller's imagination. Alpine quoted 12V figures only, no? The grandaddy 3545 was only rated at 250W/ch. I've got a spec sheet for it at the house...
Wanna bet we see it relisted?
"RMS per channel @ 12 Volts:
150W @4-ohms stereo
200W @2-ohms stereo
400W @4-ohms mono
RMS per channel @ 14.4 Volts:
230W @4-ohms stereo
315W @2-ohms stereo
630W @4-ohms mono"
Umm, I do believe the 14.4V power a figment of the seller's imagination. Alpine quoted 12V figures only, no? The grandaddy 3545 was only rated at 250W/ch. I've got a spec sheet for it at the house...
Wanna bet we see it relisted?
I'd bet that is wishful thinking. Dug out my 3555 manual and that amp is commonly said to be 4x50rms, it is spec'd at 4x45/65@4/2ohm at 14.4v, so 2x130rms bridged. IIRC the 3544 is a model older, but I also have 🙂 a much older manual for both a 3517 and 3518 that state 14.4v rated power, plus a 3542 manual that also states 14.4v rated. I would guess the 3544 is 2x150 at 14.4v or maybe less. I had thought it was the same size as a 3555 but 2ch, thus 2x100@4ohm or actually 2x90....but who knows most people say 2x150 like the 3555 is 4x50. There is a thread here about 3544 some like them as that is one of the largest aside from the 3545, I prefer to go to a mrv for more power if a alpine.
Lets face it, no old black alpine is endowed with much power. I like them and certainly power is not why, but I've never had a 3544.
photo 3544:
Alpine 3544 inside - Amp Guts
Is listed at 2x150rms
photo 3555:
Alpine 3555 inside - Amp Guts
Is listed as 4x50rms
Here I found his info: http://74.125.95.132/search?q=cache...o+630W+@4-ohms+mono"&cd=2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us
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Old amps and 2nd chance offers
I certainly wouldn't pay $280 for that amp. I got taken once on a A-600 in my e-bay virgin days. Not by a lot but it won`t happen again. Even though it was mint and worked perfect (still is and does) it was overpriced. Just say no to second chance offers if it`s too pricey. I missed out on a 2nd gen 225 HCCA at the pawn shop recently that went for $75... Canadian. That was a decent deal.
I certainly wouldn't pay $280 for that amp. I got taken once on a A-600 in my e-bay virgin days. Not by a lot but it won`t happen again. Even though it was mint and worked perfect (still is and does) it was overpriced. Just say no to second chance offers if it`s too pricey. I missed out on a 2nd gen 225 HCCA at the pawn shop recently that went for $75... Canadian. That was a decent deal.
3555 topped out around 100+, 280 is amazing if true. There are some HK 260s on there for crazy prices too. I could have bought a few a couple years ago for less than 100 shipped and suddenly they are double yeah right. But whatever, there are so many amps out there.
Any one happen to know what this amp is, guy was recommending it and I don't recall who made it or what it is: 390123754307 planet audio usa class d 4ch.
Any one happen to know what this amp is, guy was recommending it and I don't recall who made it or what it is: 390123754307 planet audio usa class d 4ch.
The Duo-Beta designs were never my favorite. I have some high end Luxman Duo home stuff. While I like the looks, the performance and sound always makes me wish for more.
Also, the EarthQuake CA ads clearly show the Alpines were already at their peak. I doubt the 14V ratings where much if any higher.
Also, the EarthQuake CA ads clearly show the Alpines were already at their peak. I doubt the 14V ratings where much if any higher.
That's a poor Zed copycat design. Solid and plays well, but I doubt it has a long lifespan. Especially if you live in Texas 😉
Agreed. They were nice sounding amps, and a decent value.
But the 3544 was no Orion 2150, Autotek 7300, etc.
camusmuse: are you looking for a 7600?
Thanks for the info Damage!
Yeah older Alpine could never compete on power, but I like the sound some of them make. I wonder if the SIP IC they use to drive the outputs has anything to do with how they work.
To me it looks like the MRV were much more amp with significant noise protection, features, mosfet PS, and built like a brick for the most part. They are kind of big and heavy compared to the more compact 35xx. Even then the other makers went even larger than the MRV, the 1507 is the largest right?
Depends on what you need in your install, I don't reach for one of my black alpines when I want more power. One time not long ago I ran a few amps (150-300rms) on a 12, had bought a nice rub302 and thought man I need to test/try that. Whoa, I refreshed my memory that thing hammered me.
The only Alpine I had to compare is a mrv1002, but it is much larger in size. I didn't have one terminal screw at the time so didn't do it.
Yeah older Alpine could never compete on power, but I like the sound some of them make. I wonder if the SIP IC they use to drive the outputs has anything to do with how they work.
To me it looks like the MRV were much more amp with significant noise protection, features, mosfet PS, and built like a brick for the most part. They are kind of big and heavy compared to the more compact 35xx. Even then the other makers went even larger than the MRV, the 1507 is the largest right?
Depends on what you need in your install, I don't reach for one of my black alpines when I want more power. One time not long ago I ran a few amps (150-300rms) on a 12, had bought a nice rub302 and thought man I need to test/try that. Whoa, I refreshed my memory that thing hammered me.
The only Alpine I had to compare is a mrv1002, but it is much larger in size. I didn't have one terminal screw at the time so didn't do it.