The four binding posts are there because some people think bi-wiring does something other than drive up your costs for speaker cables and will pass over a speaker that doesn't have them in favor of one that does.
Binding posts are cheap, as are the jumpers. So it's worth while for them to do that, rather than just having a single set despite the fact that bi-wiring does nothing except in the mind of the user.
If there really was something to this, then why aren't there 3 for the tweeter/mid/woofer or heck individual drivers where you have more than one driver in the mid/woofer?
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Well the questions is - What does the CROSSOVER do differently?
The answer is nothing, assuming we are talking about speaker using common passive crossovers.
The jumper between the High and Low section of the crossover, is either on the crossover itself, or it on the four speaker terminals of the speaker, or in the case of Bi-Wiring, the jumper has simply been moved back to the amp.
In the case of Bi-Wiring, you have simply traded a 1 inch jumper for an 8 foot jumper. Not sure how that helps.
Next a misconception. When Bi-Wiring, low are not sent to the woofer, and highs are not sent to the tweeter. From a Signal (voltage) perspective, regardless of where the jumper is, both sections of the crossover get the full full-range signal.
However, because of the crossover, while full signal is applied, current only flows at the appropriate frequencies.
At blocked frequencies, the Crossover represents a high impedance that stop current from flowing at the effected frequencies.
At the pass frequencies, the crossover in short, for simplicity, is not there, and current flows freely. But regardless of the flow of the current, the full-range voltage is always presented to the Input of the Crossover Sections.
However, the applied signal is not lost, it is simply drop across the Crossover rather than across the Driver.
There are all kinds of pseudo-justifications for how and why bi-wiring works. But in my opinion, for the average user with typical equipment, it simply doesn't work.
Still, if you have spare wire laying around, it is worth a try. Who knows you might like what you hear. But I would not spend a penny on it, until I knew I felt it had some benefit. Though I always have rolls of spare wire laying around. But, despite that, I have never bothered to try.
The effort does have some experimental value. Knowledge is always power. So, I would never discourage anyone from trying, beyond saying, don't lay out any significant money in the effort.
Steve/bluewizard
The answer is nothing, assuming we are talking about speaker using common passive crossovers.
The jumper between the High and Low section of the crossover, is either on the crossover itself, or it on the four speaker terminals of the speaker, or in the case of Bi-Wiring, the jumper has simply been moved back to the amp.
In the case of Bi-Wiring, you have simply traded a 1 inch jumper for an 8 foot jumper. Not sure how that helps.
Next a misconception. When Bi-Wiring, low are not sent to the woofer, and highs are not sent to the tweeter. From a Signal (voltage) perspective, regardless of where the jumper is, both sections of the crossover get the full full-range signal.
However, because of the crossover, while full signal is applied, current only flows at the appropriate frequencies.
At blocked frequencies, the Crossover represents a high impedance that stop current from flowing at the effected frequencies.
At the pass frequencies, the crossover in short, for simplicity, is not there, and current flows freely. But regardless of the flow of the current, the full-range voltage is always presented to the Input of the Crossover Sections.
However, the applied signal is not lost, it is simply drop across the Crossover rather than across the Driver.
There are all kinds of pseudo-justifications for how and why bi-wiring works. But in my opinion, for the average user with typical equipment, it simply doesn't work.
Still, if you have spare wire laying around, it is worth a try. Who knows you might like what you hear. But I would not spend a penny on it, until I knew I felt it had some benefit. Though I always have rolls of spare wire laying around. But, despite that, I have never bothered to try.
The effort does have some experimental value. Knowledge is always power. So, I would never discourage anyone from trying, beyond saying, don't lay out any significant money in the effort.
Steve/bluewizard
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Never tried it, yet you already know it doesn't work. Open-mindedness. Have you ever had a situation where you were certain you were right, but found you were wrong? Sometimes, if something is not working properly or as expected, I have tried something totally opposite of what I figure would work. Works more often than I would like. Audio is not something set in stone.
Yes I know it doesn't work, because I understand the basics of electricity and circuits.
Have you tried educating yourself on such topics?
I'll take that as a no then.
I use this obscure thing called science and experimentation as my guide as opposed to blindly believing things that people who want to sell me $1,000/ft speaker wire, tell me.
If you can point me towards a scientific paper that proves the efficacy of bi-wiring, I'll happily peruse it. Until then I'll put my faith in what my engineering classes taught me about
-----------/-----
\-----
being exactly the same as
-/------
\------
Aside from the obvious difference in the length of wire involved.
I apologize in advance for the poor asci art. It wasn't my major.
If you are referring to me, I made a very narrow statement within an intentionally narrow context, and I stand by that statement in that context.
I never said it never works for anyone ever.
I also encourage people to go ahead and try for themselves, though I urge them not to spend any significant money on the 'experiment'. I also acknowledged that THEY might like what they hear. But liking what you hear, doesn't necessarily make it true.
And I stand by that statement.
As to the central question which, intentionally or not, was, what does the CROSSOVER do different, the answer is nothing. The crossover does nothing different. And I stand by that statement.
Steve/bluewizard
Too bad there is no Thumbs Up button.
At best any justification for Bi-Wiring is pseudo-logic.
But I still encourage people to give it a try, as long as they don't break the bank in the process. Still, their money, if they want to spend a bundle on extra wire, who am I to say no. But I urge them to try it on the cheap as proof of concept before spending money.
I generally find that the more money you spend, the more likely you are to like what you hear. But that is confirmation bias, not necessarily reality.
Steve/bluewizard
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You guys are either crazy, or have some type of systems I've never seen. I found very early on that I have to bi-wire. Running just a single wire to the speaker didn't make much sound. Someone told me it has something to do with "circuits" and current flow or something. I could be remembering wrong. 
Not exactly a paper, but has plenty of real-world measurements of the effects of speaker cables : Loudspeakers: Effects of amplifiers and cables - Part 5 | EE Times
If you don't think that bi-wiring would help, then must you also not believe that star grounding would help? (And there we're only talking inches, not feet.)
Of course, if the speakers in question do not have separate bass and treble (or more) connections, then they are not ready for bi-wiring. (Some here seemed to think that it only meant two parallel runs of cables.)
"The signal" is current; time-varying current.
The inductances (and resistances) of the wires, alone, will cause voltages to be induced across them.
Why would you want the voltages induced by the bass to be presented to your tweeters (and vice versa)?
With bi-wiring, the crossover networks will prevent high currents at frequencies that are not meant for the driver connected with that pair of the bi-wiring, eliminating (greatly attenuating) the voltages they might otherwise create.
The only real question is: Could the effects be significant, i.e. audible?
I just modified an existing LT-Spice simulation that I had handy, which includes a power supply with rectifiers, reservoir caps, and a model of a BJT class AB output stage from Bob Cordell, with a 4 Ohm resistor as the load.
For the input, I used a WAV file of the intro from "Highway to Hell", by AC/DC.
The output peaks across the load were up to +/-45 Volts, and +/-10 Amps or so.
Using jneutron's plot of the wire inductance (120 nH per foot), I simulated a six-foot pair of speaker wires by inserting a series inductor of 360 nH, with ESR of 36 mOhms, in both the + and - speaker wires.
The peaks of the voltages induced across each simulated wire impedance were about 0.5 Volt.
Would it be audible if there was 0.5 Volts of unwanted wrong-frequency "junk" that was removed from the input to each of the crossover networks? I don't actually know. But it seems possible.
I've got spice models for speaker drivers and crossover circuits, too, somewhere. But this was supposed to be a ten minute job. I could also simulate a bi-wired setup and just use different sine frequencies to see what magnitude the effect might have. But again, I don't want to spend too much time on it, at the moment.
When I bought some used Vandersteen 2Ce speakers, the Vandersteen manual highly recommended bi-wiring. And Vandersteen sells speakers, not speaker cables. And they're very sharp people. So I had no reason to doubt that it would make a difference. And using #14 AWG bulk zip cord that I had on a spool, it sure didn't cost much. I have never listened to those speakers with any other cable configuration. So I guess that story isn't as helpful as it could have been. (But they do sound exquisitely accurate, especially for under $600 a pair, used.)
Of course, if the speakers in question do not have separate bass and treble (or more) connections, then they are not ready for bi-wiring. (Some here seemed to think that it only meant two parallel runs of cables.)
"The signal" is current; time-varying current.
The inductances (and resistances) of the wires, alone, will cause voltages to be induced across them.
Why would you want the voltages induced by the bass to be presented to your tweeters (and vice versa)?
With bi-wiring, the crossover networks will prevent high currents at frequencies that are not meant for the driver connected with that pair of the bi-wiring, eliminating (greatly attenuating) the voltages they might otherwise create.
The only real question is: Could the effects be significant, i.e. audible?
I just modified an existing LT-Spice simulation that I had handy, which includes a power supply with rectifiers, reservoir caps, and a model of a BJT class AB output stage from Bob Cordell, with a 4 Ohm resistor as the load.
For the input, I used a WAV file of the intro from "Highway to Hell", by AC/DC.
The output peaks across the load were up to +/-45 Volts, and +/-10 Amps or so.
Using jneutron's plot of the wire inductance (120 nH per foot), I simulated a six-foot pair of speaker wires by inserting a series inductor of 360 nH, with ESR of 36 mOhms, in both the + and - speaker wires.
The peaks of the voltages induced across each simulated wire impedance were about 0.5 Volt.
Would it be audible if there was 0.5 Volts of unwanted wrong-frequency "junk" that was removed from the input to each of the crossover networks? I don't actually know. But it seems possible.
I've got spice models for speaker drivers and crossover circuits, too, somewhere. But this was supposed to be a ten minute job. I could also simulate a bi-wired setup and just use different sine frequencies to see what magnitude the effect might have. But again, I don't want to spend too much time on it, at the moment.
When I bought some used Vandersteen 2Ce speakers, the Vandersteen manual highly recommended bi-wiring. And Vandersteen sells speakers, not speaker cables. And they're very sharp people. So I had no reason to doubt that it would make a difference. And using #14 AWG bulk zip cord that I had on a spool, it sure didn't cost much. I have never listened to those speakers with any other cable configuration. So I guess that story isn't as helpful as it could have been. (But they do sound exquisitely accurate, especially for under $600 a pair, used.)
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You guys are either crazy, or have some type of systems I've never seen. I found very early on that I have to bi-wire. Running just a single wire to the speaker didn't make much sound. Someone told me it has something to do with "circuits" and current flow or something. I could be remembering wrong.
You see, that is a problem, the absolute certainty that you MUST bi-wire is as fanatic as the counter statement that it is impossible for Bi-wire to make any difference ever.
This is not a point that needs to be argued. Though, it could be argued on technical merits. However, the solution is simply - Try it. You will either see the value or you won't. Even at its most expensive, it is not really excessively expensive.
Though I heartily recommend trying it with some spare wire first. If you like what you hear and see the potential, then feel free to spring for some good wire.
I honestly think for the average consumer, this has little to no value. But that does not mean it never has any value to anyone ever.
Just the experience alone makes the experiment worth while; knowledge gain is never wasted. I am content to let people decide for themselves.
But there is little logic or science to back up the idea that it works. But that still should not stop people from trying.
Steve/bluewizard
There are 10000+ posts in some Wire thread ( and also Speakers and many more), even if most of the conjectures
are based on many 'something'
I think you misinterpreted Pano's view and you made an objectionable post. You save yourself in the end, and save the DIY crowd when saying to give the chance to try....
The sound you heard was the joke whizzing over your head.
Tom, the analogy to star grounding is not apt, I think. Speaker systems have crossovers.
bi-wiring B&W N803s
I also think that bi-wiring only moves the jumper connection back to the amp. But I wonder, if the increase in distance could have some effect on emf or, if different gage wires, larger to the LF and smaller to the HF, could have some effect. Any thoughts on those possibilities?
henrylrjr
I also think that bi-wiring only moves the jumper connection back to the amp. But I wonder, if the increase in distance could have some effect on emf or, if different gage wires, larger to the LF and smaller to the HF, could have some effect. Any thoughts on those possibilities?
henrylrjr
Yes, and they all go the way that this thread is going -
Yes it does.
No it doesn't.
Yes it does.
No it doesn't.
Yes it does.
No it doesn't.
I beleive they are called Ping-Pong Posts.
This is one of the most contentious issues in audio and has been argued to death. Which is precisely why I said there is nothing to argue about. Try Bi-Wiring and you will either like it or not. If it works for you, then fine, problem solved.
Steve/bluewizard
Hmmmm, not really solved. If it does work for you, many will want to know why. From an electrical standpoint, it doesn't seem to make much sense. If it really is different (and maybe better) then why? What have we missed?
I still think that measurements at the crossovers and at the drivers themselves are worthwhile.
I still think that measurements at the crossovers and at the drivers themselves are worthwhile.
Fair enough. To resolve the Yes or No aspect in your mind is as simply as - Try It.
However, resolving the Why is more difficult.
Then we must consider that what we may demonstrate in extreme tests does not necessarily apply to common people with common equipment with common distances of common wire.
With exceptionally revealing equipment, small things, even the smallest of things, can make a noticeable difference. Which is why I carefully added limited context to my statements.
Steve/bluewizard
However, resolving the Why is more difficult.
Then we must consider that what we may demonstrate in extreme tests does not necessarily apply to common people with common equipment with common distances of common wire.
With exceptionally revealing equipment, small things, even the smallest of things, can make a noticeable difference. Which is why I carefully added limited context to my statements.
Steve/bluewizard
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