Nope, haven't done that - but I do have a Kevlar-cone Tymphany 03W06O with a damaged dust cap which I can remove and audition. However, I think it may not be a significant contributor to back pressure, because the pole piece has an air ventilation duct at the rear.
You're right about that! No way I'm cutting up anything yet, I'll experiment with a lot of things before I do that.
The thing is, I've listened to so many house curves and processing settings that I don't even know if my high frequency output is the best it can be right now.
I've had moments where it was lush sounding and very pleasing. Right now I'm listening with a conjugation network on one array and not on the other. Maybe that's what I'm hearing. I can see the difference in phase between left and right in the top octave.
The thing is, I've listened to so many house curves and processing settings that I don't even know if my high frequency output is the best it can be right now.
I've had moments where it was lush sounding and very pleasing. Right now I'm listening with a conjugation network on one array and not on the other. Maybe that's what I'm hearing. I can see the difference in phase between left and right in the top octave.
According to what waterfall plots? And what kind of break up? Cone diffraction effects or cone modes?
Audophile salesman? Wouldn't this be like asking P10 to give you advice?
Hahaha, you're probably right. I remembered a bigger difference and other plots, on this thread: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/268626-vifa-tc9fd18-08-best-bang-buck-21.html#post4247669 the difference is very small indeed.
I shouldn't judge anything yet. Due to still having a cold that's got both my ears plugged up. But I can't resist playing with the lines and it's settings. It's probably all in my head (lol). I do recall having heard better results from my speakers, so it's probably me.
He didn't try to sell me anything, that was cool though
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A nice Vifa TG9 vs TC9 frequency comparison here:
http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php?42482-Pondering-an-IDS-25-Clone-(sort-of)-for-HT&p=604118&viewfull=1#post604118
http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php?42482-Pondering-an-IDS-25-Clone-(sort-of)-for-HT&p=604118&viewfull=1#post604118
Timothy Felepa did a great comparo job there on his site. Look at what got a 1 rating for performance. Really surprising to see the FOuntek FR88EX get a 10.
Timothy Feleppa's Pages
Look at the one that got a 10 on value. TC7FD. Maybe those would be good for line arrays. Certainly tight ctc.
I do want to add that I think taking the dust cap off the TC9 is bad for business. I could try this out myself as I can sacrifice one of my drivers with a crushed dustcap, courtesy of a curious 2 yr old boy
I think it serves as the dome tweeter of the TC9. Easy enough to try but where it matters is probably the polar response which is a pain to take.
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I just looked, the Fountek FR88EX has a 9 on performance. Maybe he revised it?
FE83eN is showing 3.5 on performance now. 1 on value.
I forget (there's so many drivers), is the FR88EX in your subjective testing? And if so how has it been doing?
I have the FF105WK and can't use it without EQ - nasty 7kHz spike. Good bass extension though.
I would Jim. It is the basis of a very good driver.
From someone who has actually listened to them:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/club...ver-island-diyfest-2015-a-18.html#post4429471
dave
Removing the dust cap on the TC9 probably won't do much for the top octave, since the TG9 uses the exact same dust cap and doesn't have issues in the top octave. If the dust cap had a breakup problem you'd expect to see nulls in the off-axis response but that isn't the case with the TG9.
The TG fibreglass cone is a fair bit stiffer than the TC's paper cone, which should push cone breakup modes higher in frequency. The fibreglass weave probably helps disrupt cone breakup modes as well. A light coat of PVA glue may stiffen the TC enough to make it a bit more like the TG - no guarantees though
My "performance" rating is based on how well the driver performs as a midrange, not as a full range. I may rate the FR88EX as the highest performing, but that doesn't mean if you slap it in a box and run it full range that it would sound subjectively better than everything else.
I'm willing to overlook bulk non-linear distortion below 400Hz or a rough frequency response above 8kHz since none of the drivers tested excel in those areas, and neither is overly important if the driver is going to be run with a larger woofer and a tweeter.
Frequency response issues that can be fixed easily, such as a gentle rise over several octaves are generally not penalised. Severe frequency response issues that are beyond fixing or would require a DSP to fix result in severe penalty. An example of something that isn't so easy to fix without a DSP would be the steps in the Fountek FE85 at 1K and 4K. An example of something that can't be fixed without compromise, even with a DSP, is the cone breakup of the W3-1335SB, or the null in the response of the Fostex FE83En.
Non-linear distortion issues usually can't be fixed either and have to be avoided instead, therefore I penalise drivers with unavoidable NLD issues more heavily than drivers with fixable frequency response issues.
If a 3" driver has a severe NLD problem at say 2kHz then it's pretty much useless. No one wants to have to use a 3" driver only above or only below 2kHz. A problem at 500Hz won't be looked down upon so badly.
Build and construction is my subjective opinion of how well designed and put together the driver looks to be at first sight. Subtract points for something that looks like off the shelf parts slapped together, messy glue application. Add points for tidy glue application, sturdy terminals, quality cast frame, etc. A driver can score 10/10 here and still perform like a steaming pile of turd, so this rating is just a bit of fun really.
Value is my opinion of how well the driver performs relative to other drivers of a similar price. To score 10 it must blow everything of a similar price range out of the water. 6/10 is about average.
The TG fibreglass cone is a fair bit stiffer than the TC's paper cone, which should push cone breakup modes higher in frequency. The fibreglass weave probably helps disrupt cone breakup modes as well. A light coat of PVA glue may stiffen the TC enough to make it a bit more like the TG - no guarantees though
To be fair the FF85WK has pretty good frequency response - if the peak at 9.5K is notched down then it becomes almost ruler flat apart from a roll off in the top octave. It is also high sensitivity which may be seen as a positive for fans of gutless amplifiers. The motor designs on the Fostex drivers are really basic and it shows with merely average non-linear distortion even at high frequencies.
My "performance" rating is based on how well the driver performs as a midrange, not as a full range. I may rate the FR88EX as the highest performing, but that doesn't mean if you slap it in a box and run it full range that it would sound subjectively better than everything else.
I'm willing to overlook bulk non-linear distortion below 400Hz or a rough frequency response above 8kHz since none of the drivers tested excel in those areas, and neither is overly important if the driver is going to be run with a larger woofer and a tweeter.
Frequency response issues that can be fixed easily, such as a gentle rise over several octaves are generally not penalised. Severe frequency response issues that are beyond fixing or would require a DSP to fix result in severe penalty. An example of something that isn't so easy to fix without a DSP would be the steps in the Fountek FE85 at 1K and 4K. An example of something that can't be fixed without compromise, even with a DSP, is the cone breakup of the W3-1335SB, or the null in the response of the Fostex FE83En.
Non-linear distortion issues usually can't be fixed either and have to be avoided instead, therefore I penalise drivers with unavoidable NLD issues more heavily than drivers with fixable frequency response issues.
If a 3" driver has a severe NLD problem at say 2kHz then it's pretty much useless. No one wants to have to use a 3" driver only above or only below 2kHz. A problem at 500Hz won't be looked down upon so badly.
Build and construction is my subjective opinion of how well designed and put together the driver looks to be at first sight. Subtract points for something that looks like off the shelf parts slapped together, messy glue application. Add points for tidy glue application, sturdy terminals, quality cast frame, etc. A driver can score 10/10 here and still perform like a steaming pile of turd, so this rating is just a bit of fun really.
Value is my opinion of how well the driver performs relative to other drivers of a similar price. To score 10 it must blow everything of a similar price range out of the water. 6/10 is about average.
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Removing the dust cap on the TC9 probably won't do much for the top octave, since the TG9 uses the exact same dust cap and doesn't have issues in the top octave. If the dust cap had a breakup problem you'd expect to see nulls in the off-axis response but that isn't the case with the TG9.
The TG fibreglass cone is a fair bit stiffer than the TC's paper cone, which should push cone breakup modes higher in frequency. The fibreglass weave probably helps disrupt cone breakup modes as well. A light coat of PVA glue may stiffen the TC enough to make it a bit more like the TG - no guarantees though
That's what I figured as well. The stiffer cone on the TG does help.
I have no intention of cutting the domes. But I did wonder if anyone had tried that. If Isopunkt was still available I would have tried that on a test pair.
I hope you will get the opportunity to test the Scanspeak 10F 8424G00 at some point. I bet we can't pry the 10F out of X's hands though to send it to you for testing.
I was thinking of buying some 10F a while ago but couldn't bring myself to pull the trigger on them, also because Zaph-Audio has already measured them and I knew exactly what to expect lol. Now the AUD/USD exchange rate has fallen off a cliff their value has gone way down.
I'd rather buy 'unknown quantities' like the W3-1878, it's more exciting that way
I'd rather buy 'unknown quantities' like the W3-1878, it's more exciting that way
What about this TEBM46C20N-4B ? Pretty impressive FR plot.
https://www.parts-express.com/pedocs/specs/297-2157--temb46c20n-4b-2-spec-sheet.pdf
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