40hz Target
If I run the pensils full range the cone movement as very dramatic but with the 40hz high pass it settles down to almost nothing but the sound is about the same. This must be because the cabinet design results in a very steep roll off starting around 45hz but has no way to restrict cone travel below that range.
The Mar-Ken's may not be as efficient at producing the low notes, if that's the case I'll settle for the 60hz high pass. (I don't have any options in between with my gear)
Relieved of the low notes the 10.2 is amazingly graceful even with the calibration system forcing a flat response to 40hz in my large room. They sound excellent with a 60hz high pass as well. Sub integration is excellent either way. It also seems to smooth out the top end of these drivers a great deal and extends the top range even further which is not audible to me but may satisfy those who add super tweeters to these full rangers. You can't shape response like that with equalizers that's for sure.
Here's a picture to explain it.
Microphone calibration works on each channel independently including the sub woofer.
If I run the pensils full range the cone movement as very dramatic but with the 40hz high pass it settles down to almost nothing but the sound is about the same. This must be because the cabinet design results in a very steep roll off starting around 45hz but has no way to restrict cone travel below that range.
The Mar-Ken's may not be as efficient at producing the low notes, if that's the case I'll settle for the 60hz high pass. (I don't have any options in between with my gear)
Relieved of the low notes the 10.2 is amazingly graceful even with the calibration system forcing a flat response to 40hz in my large room. They sound excellent with a 60hz high pass as well. Sub integration is excellent either way. It also seems to smooth out the top end of these drivers a great deal and extends the top range even further which is not audible to me but may satisfy those who add super tweeters to these full rangers. You can't shape response like that with equalizers that's for sure.
Here's a picture to explain it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Microphone calibration works on each channel independently including the sub woofer.
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Today was a lucky break. The install I was supposed to do got pushed until Friday. My boss let me build the Mar-Ken 10.2 off the clock. I got one heavy coat of finish on the cabinet before leaving so I should be able to finish it tomorrow. Mine was made out of entirely 18mm baltic birch ply and 7mm thick pieces of solid maple.
Lucky would be on the clock.What is the calibration system you have?
probably more fun than pushing a broom or scrubbing the toilets
Ryan - looking forward to some glamour shots - the fluorescent shop lighting is always so flattering
Buzz,
I'm using a Denon Receiver that features Audyssey MultEQ calibration. Specifically I have the AVR-591 Nothing too fancy, but it really works. It's an automated calibration procedure too, you just plug in the mic, press next a lot then tweak a few settings like crossover points and your done. Also, the high/low pass seems like the brick wall type and not a sloped type.
It is pretty cool to build speakers at work. Since I am there so much I don't want to be there any more than necessary but if anything can get me to do it, these MA drivers can. This is the slowest time of year for the shop so I will try and crank them out while I can.
I'm using a Denon Receiver that features Audyssey MultEQ calibration. Specifically I have the AVR-591 Nothing too fancy, but it really works. It's an automated calibration procedure too, you just plug in the mic, press next a lot then tweak a few settings like crossover points and your done. Also, the high/low pass seems like the brick wall type and not a sloped type.
It is pretty cool to build speakers at work. Since I am there so much I don't want to be there any more than necessary but if anything can get me to do it, these MA drivers can. This is the slowest time of year for the shop so I will try and crank them out while I can.
Shop Pictures
Some Pensil pics I left out.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Some Pensil pics I left out.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
It looks faster than it is.
I probably take my situation for granted - you're certainly right about that
Nice work Ryan - don't you just love the way the mahogany veneer pops with a nice NC lacquer or conversion varnish? - none of that enviro-friendly water borne acrylic crap for me
Another favorite of mine is Black WalnutThere must be a shop music system? If you can manage to play either of these at a Friday afternoon 24pack safety meeting, it'd be interesting to see your fellow worker's reactions.
Shop audio system
Chris,
You can actually see the shop speakers if you look through one of the holes on the right side of the holey brace. They are a pair 1/4 wave cabinets that Bob Brines helped cook up ages ago. They are 2 way with 3rd order crossover designed by the LEAP service at madisound. The source is a PC that I used to equalize the response in the giant room.
We only use lacquer and conversion varnish in our shop. The EPA will have to pry it out of my cold dead hands.
They guys in the shop will have to hear the stuff at my house. When they do the drivers will be broken in. They have always been more impressed with the subwoofer than anything else. Perhaps that will change now.
Chris,
You can actually see the shop speakers if you look through one of the holes on the right side of the holey brace. They are a pair 1/4 wave cabinets that Bob Brines helped cook up ages ago. They are 2 way with 3rd order crossover designed by the LEAP service at madisound. The source is a PC that I used to equalize the response in the giant room.
We only use lacquer and conversion varnish in our shop. The EPA will have to pry it out of my cold dead hands.
They guys in the shop will have to hear the stuff at my house. When they do the drivers will be broken in. They have always been more impressed with the subwoofer than anything else. Perhaps that will change now.
Smooth Sound
It's still hard to believe that the high frequencies actually sound better and more open on the 10.2 vs the magnepans I was using before. Even my best friend and wife agree with that. I'm not sure how much of that is the calibration smoothing out the response, regardless it's quite amazing. Really Mark? How can this be? The moving mass is almost 8 grams for god's sake.
It's still hard to believe that the high frequencies actually sound better and more open on the 10.2 vs the magnepans I was using before. Even my best friend and wife agree with that. I'm not sure how much of that is the calibration smoothing out the response, regardless it's quite amazing. Really Mark? How can this be? The moving mass is almost 8 grams for god's sake.
Fair enough - the domestic environ is where a FR truly shines - just make sure they get to listen to the 10.2s unassisted for at least a little bit - I had another session with a pair of these in MarKen enclosures over the holidays, and the bottom end is quite silly good for the size of driver and boxes.
yup, something interesting going on with Mark's 7 - 10 cm drivers
Ryan, VERY nice work on your cabinets, and I appreciate you sharing your suggestion of beveling AFTER you have veneered. Ryan or others, Dave suggested the veneer could be formed over the bevel edge with an iron...have you tried this yet? I assume this would work with a backed veneer rather than raw? Pete
I've certainly found when using the iron-on glue method that thin paper backed veneer can be folded over the 45dg corner of the bevel - in the long grain direction, but not cross grain.
I use paper backed veneer as it's so much easier to lay out and grain match the wrapping of larger enclosures (or multiple smaller pairs) with a 4x8 or 4x10ft sheet and is also easier to cut ( sharp scissors and Olfa utility knife) and handle (far fewer slivers) than raw veneers.
I always cut / bevel all parts before assembly, but once any of the side panels are attached to the baffle, the "easiest" way would probably be with a curved farrier rasp, "rat-tail" file, or 60G PSA sand paper glued to 1 1/2" closet rod dowel.
Take your time, and watch out for your knuckles
In the case of a rebated driver cut-out as in Ryan's photos, when ironing on the veneer over the pre-machined cut-out, the iron can do a pretty good job of outlining the edge - here's where a little bit of scorching, which is easily sanded out, will actually provide your trim line. In fact with some careful technique, you can follow the inside of the recessed opening with the nose of the iron in a light rocking motion and crease or even rough cut the entire piece. Since I post veneer the enclosure after complete assembly and installation of damping materials, I leave the waste trim in place to make a spray mask, and fine trim and sand the internal edge of cut-out. This technique works equally well for rebated non circular patterns such as with Fostex, Eminence, etc.
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Cutting the speaker hole
This time I tried wrapping the veneer over the bevel as others suggested in the thread. It worked just fine.
I cut the hole through the veneer in the mostly completed box for three reasons. First I want the hole to be dead on center, there is not much room for error on the Mar-Kens. Second, my sharp spiral router bit will cut through the veneer very cleanly. The third reason is that the MA drivers have such a thick flange that the remaining ledge is thin enough to easily sand the inner bevel by hand with coarse sandpaper. The dowel idea is great, I will adopt that one for next time.
I use the jasper circle jig from Parts Express and a 1/4" wide bit to do the driver cut outs.
This time I tried wrapping the veneer over the bevel as others suggested in the thread. It worked just fine.
I cut the hole through the veneer in the mostly completed box for three reasons. First I want the hole to be dead on center, there is not much room for error on the Mar-Kens. Second, my sharp spiral router bit will cut through the veneer very cleanly. The third reason is that the MA drivers have such a thick flange that the remaining ledge is thin enough to easily sand the inner bevel by hand with coarse sandpaper. The dowel idea is great, I will adopt that one for next time.
I use the jasper circle jig from Parts Express and a 1/4" wide bit to do the driver cut outs.
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