I haven't read the thread, so this might have appeared elsewhere. Apologies.
Dialectric, inductance, capacitance, resistance e.t.c. (all included here!).
I just hapenned to have a lot of enamelled wire from winding back an inductor to a new value.
I normally use Naim speaker wire- nothing special except Naim claims a reasonable length compensates for the lack of an inductor in the output of their power amps.
The system is active, so just for an experiment, I replaced the multistranded Naim (not many, but thick strands), with some sort of plastic insulation, to the tweeters, with this single strand enamelled 2mm diameter wire. Same type of banana plugs one end, and alligator clips! the other. Good clean removal of the enamel. Cable loosely laid. Not twisted.
The difference wasn't subtle- much worse.
My wife asked where the treble had gone.
I can't make definitive claims from this one experiment (have I really kept all other variables constant?).
Maybe there are no differences between cables above a certain quality and set of parameters. But from this experience, I would certainly claim things can be made worse.
Interestingly, at one stage in the temporary set-up, one 3-way channel was supplied by 6 wires from a 7 lead car trailer flex. Replacing with the Naim didn't make heck of a difference. Go figure?!!.
David
Dialectric, inductance, capacitance, resistance e.t.c. (all included here!).
I just hapenned to have a lot of enamelled wire from winding back an inductor to a new value.
I normally use Naim speaker wire- nothing special except Naim claims a reasonable length compensates for the lack of an inductor in the output of their power amps.
The system is active, so just for an experiment, I replaced the multistranded Naim (not many, but thick strands), with some sort of plastic insulation, to the tweeters, with this single strand enamelled 2mm diameter wire. Same type of banana plugs one end, and alligator clips! the other. Good clean removal of the enamel. Cable loosely laid. Not twisted.
The difference wasn't subtle- much worse.
My wife asked where the treble had gone.
I can't make definitive claims from this one experiment (have I really kept all other variables constant?).
Maybe there are no differences between cables above a certain quality and set of parameters. But from this experience, I would certainly claim things can be made worse.
Interestingly, at one stage in the temporary set-up, one 3-way channel was supplied by 6 wires from a 7 lead car trailer flex. Replacing with the Naim didn't make heck of a difference. Go figure?!!.
David
hehehe but it wasn't just a once off... it worked again and again.... where other treatments failed... some things just don't seem to make sense... the same brand's teething drops worked wonders as well... much better than bonjella (which has now been shown to be rather bad for babies)... the only plausible explanation I can come up with (if it isn't the homoeopathic itself) is that the baby can sense your want for it to work and settles down.. this seems very unlikely!
I have also had a homoeopathic treatment myself (for suppressed grief) and the effect was quite staggering. The fact that I was very sceptical about it made the result even more surprising, but I can't rule out the power of suggestion in that case... however one thing I will say about homoeopathy, even if it is patently untrue, if it gets the desired results (whether by placebo effect or other powers of suggestion) then isn't that a good thing? Doctors will routinely prescribe placebos for the same reasons
I know this has nothing to do with cables, but it is still relevant, from an observation without proof point of view, and also from the other side of the fence form a psychological point of view
And thanks for the compliment BTW! digressing even further, one thing I will always remember is a certain writer (can't remember the name) who used to write for Electronics Australia back in the 80's, who was adamant that there was NO difference in quality between one CD player and the next and that we should all go out and buy the cheapest unit available because the expensive ones had no advantage. The reasoning behind this claim was that because the media was digital and was only either a zero or one, there could be no difference in quality between one unit and the next... The fact there was a transition from digital back to analog must have escaped his attention, I'm sure however for a time there were a whole pile of EA readers (myself included) who didn't understand how a CD player worked that actually believed this claim... it wasn't until quite a long time later when I bought a new player for my parents and compared it to my own that I heard for myself just how wrong his claims were.. the difference was like chalk and cheese (the new player was far superior).
Tony.
Ah homeopathy.... Who remembers the "Memory of Water?" (la memoire de l'eau)
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mémoire_de_l'eau
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mémoire_de_l'eau
OT, but someone started it anyway.
Attended a homeopathic seminar one day.
Enquiring, if not open, mind.
Relationship to a para-medical area.
Lots of slides of x-rays, tissue samples, histology, patient histories e.t.c
No studies. No double blind studies. No peer reviewed journals.
After a while, a lot of murmuring amongst the experienced practitioners there.
BUT ALL THIS HEALING WAS GOING TO HAPPEN ANYWAY!!!
At the same rate. In the same way. No converts.
David
Attended a homeopathic seminar one day.
Enquiring, if not open, mind.
Relationship to a para-medical area.
Lots of slides of x-rays, tissue samples, histology, patient histories e.t.c
No studies. No double blind studies. No peer reviewed journals.
After a while, a lot of murmuring amongst the experienced practitioners there.
BUT ALL THIS HEALING WAS GOING TO HAPPEN ANYWAY!!!
At the same rate. In the same way. No converts.
David
I agree with you here.
And I agree with this. My first piece of my own audio gear was a Marantz 2285B receiver and some Sennheiser cans. I went back and bought some better gear over time (mainly after I left HS).
I am not the lest impressed with any of the stores here with pretentions to high end.
In terms of the total sales, it's really trivial though.
A tragic case that concluded in Sydney on Monday removed whatever little interest I had in trying it forever.
Dave there are still a few bastions that have weathered the economy, and I pray that they hang on so that this industry that I love, will still have another day in the sun. You have to admit that the numbers are a mere shell of 20 years ago. The big companies have brought in their media blitzes and taken away the bread and butter of the community audio stores, just has Walmart, Best Buy, etc, have wiped out the smaller "mom and pop" stores.
I long for the days when personal service and professional sales people mean more to a person than price, but that is the times that I live in today. High commercial retail space has makes it extremely difficult for smaller retail to survive and this is showing up everywhere.
Yes that was very very tragic. To try alternatives is one thing, to insist that they are the only option is criminal.
Tony.
I see a dark age comming (I dont think it will last but who knows how long?) Less money into the record labels = less risk talking = less new bands getting signed, so we hear more and more established bands and less new music. Throw in the MTV mentality of a new band every song (the preference of the young for DJs over live music) and the future looks dim. Where will the next generation of bands come from? No gigs to hone your chops, and when you do put out an album, most people steal it.
I recall in the 60's there was what 1/10th the number of bands today (if that), but the music was great! Look at what many of the kids listen today. They are listening to music from the 60's
Amazing how quality stands the test of time.
OT, but here's the Nature investigation of homeopathic claims by the leading "practitioner," Jacques Benveniste and Benveniste's reply. The reply looks oddly familiar. Everyone thought the tests were just fine until they didn't get the results they wanted; that's when the name-calling began. Benveniste did not learn the lesson of Blondlot, sadly.
http://br.geocities.com/criticandokardec/benveniste02.pdf
And for a lighter look:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VIaV8swc-fo (some language warning, but damned funny)
http://br.geocities.com/criticandokardec/benveniste02.pdf
And for a lighter look:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VIaV8swc-fo (some language warning, but damned funny)
Rotel was a real eye opener for many customers for me too
Power supply design made all the difference between them and the mass market stuff.YOU can not use your specific example as a conclusion for the whole industry. You do the same thing with your own listening experience. You really have to start doing some real research.
The industry has been on the decline for a long time. Most here think that is a sad thing but I do not see it that way only because the majority of high end stores premoted subjectivity and not science. I want science to be the priority for anyone wanting to have a better listening experience so the closing of high end stores is okay by me. They never offered what I thought was a common sense appoarch anyways.
Now, this doesnt mean high end products won't exist, they will always exist because there will always be a market. It will be all online, I have been saying this for almost 20 years (I design software for a living). Travel agencies didnt get it and most local audio stores don't get it either. They hang on for dear life instead of evolving possibly into something viable.
As for the social event aspect....people use the internet, Twitter and Facebook for that now. Stores are meaningless in the future, is that sad? Again, it depends on what you do day to day and who you associate with. GTGs can still happen amongst those with common interests.
On a site like this the majority will believe this is a sad point of view but in the real world I stand with the majority. I have no ties, no reason to care if product X, Store Y is gone. There are enough choices out there to always fill the void for me and if there isn't I could always create a company to fill the void.
Its always been clear.
I still want to know what you consider a good amp so I can buy and test one?
Also what do you consider a decent system? I have over 20K in electronics just in my Garage, Full house audio/video distribution system (HD video/Digital audio everywhere) with touchscreens in every room, 7 50" plasma, 92" projection system in my custom HT room with full treatments. DIY speakers, amps, pre/pros that if I was to put a $$$ figure on would be around $20K right now in that room. Closer to $100K for all AV stuff in my house (8 sets of DIY speakers, 10 AVRs or Pre Pros....12 Amps and so on)
All cables are from Monoprice.com or/and BlueJeanCable.com...BJC builds better cables but some cables are fine from Monoprice.com. I did the test with $1000 worth of cables already so I know the measured response does not show a difference. Therefore audibility doesnt exist and all my listening tests confirmed it.
Is that mid-fi?
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Doug where did I use my example as the entire industry? But I did talk to many store owners across the US on a fairly regular basis. You make a lot of friends across the nation after being in the business for all of those years so I did have a good handle on what was happening where pretty easily.
Your opinion is yours Doug. I still believe that once the economy stabilizes, things will come back again. That is my opinion based upon my experience in this industry.
Hi Doug for any of the current Ayre amplifiers are excellent examples of modern and extremely good sounding solid state components. Charles Hansen is a gift circuit designer and they do listen to every design very thoroughly as part of their design process. Great people to work with also!
I use the Monoprice HDMI cables in my video system. I am not a videophile, so these work for me too.
Then why all the tears?
Very nice.
That probably explains why your listening tests confirmed it.
You did not specify anything regarding audio but based on what you've said in a previous post: "I know pro audio amps are as good as high end amps but I still own a Sunfire for many different reasons (I also own about $5K in pro amps)."
Good question, you can get mine for about $15K.
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