if someone could actually measure burn in and, with measurements in hand explain the "difference in sound" after burn in, that someone would probably be hung by his toes in the audiophile world 
I've often found my ears deceiving me, and imho "getting used to a different sound" is more often the cause of perceived differences in sound after "burn in" than I think is anything else.
Do note that capacitors (alu) are "aged" by their manufacturers:
http://electrochem.cwru.edu/encycl/misc/c04-appguide.pdf
page 4, top. Maybe that after a while in operation, this does change some behavior in the caps and this may influence sound. Especially since an amp is in theory no more than a (in this case "switched") modulated power supply.
r
I've often found my ears deceiving me, and imho "getting used to a different sound" is more often the cause of perceived differences in sound after "burn in" than I think is anything else.
Do note that capacitors (alu) are "aged" by their manufacturers:
http://electrochem.cwru.edu/encycl/misc/c04-appguide.pdf
page 4, top. Maybe that after a while in operation, this does change some behavior in the caps and this may influence sound. Especially since an amp is in theory no more than a (in this case "switched") modulated power supply.
r
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No, StigErik. I did not. But I didn't need to do an A/B test.
Look, I don't want to get in to this age old debate too deeply. If you don't believe in break in, no problem. I know what I have personally heard and that's all that matters to me. I just went through a dramatic break in with the PS Audio Perfect Wave DAC MKII upgrade. This upgrade was so unlistenable and fatiguing early on that I couldn't listen more than 3 minutes at a time. I currently have several hundred hours on the MKII upgrade and the sound is so dramatically different now a deaf man would hear the difference.
Look, I don't want to get in to this age old debate too deeply. If you don't believe in break in, no problem. I know what I have personally heard and that's all that matters to me. I just went through a dramatic break in with the PS Audio Perfect Wave DAC MKII upgrade. This upgrade was so unlistenable and fatiguing early on that I couldn't listen more than 3 minutes at a time. I currently have several hundred hours on the MKII upgrade and the sound is so dramatically different now a deaf man would hear the difference.
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obviously, break in is measurable with some parts and it may be audible."...at any rate this is anything but reliable."
It may not be reliable, but that doesn't, in and of itself, refute the possibility.
I had an old Chey Impala that wasn't always reliable either, but it clearly did run on certain days!
we're straying from the subject again but here's another thing I noticed. when I return home after being out for a while it takes a few minutes or even more until my ears/brain really get into the listening state. being exposed to street noise or any other different sonic environment clearly has temporary effects.
and I didn't even mention health, time of the day mood and the fact that up to a point we tend to get accustomed to whatever is being served to us. but the worst is still auditory memory, I found that as soon as the perception is transferred to the cognitive level it'll force me to actually remember the interpretation of what I heard, not what I actually heard. not sure I'm making any sense...
mr_push_pull there is no doubt our changing physiology and external factors from day-to-day affect our listening experience. Clearly, some days our systems sound much better than others, but a characterisic hardness in the upper mid-range that was 100% consistent and so irritating during the early hours of break in on the MK II upgrade was not something I got used to over time. The component clearly changed.
If our aural memory isn't consistent enough to hear changes in break in without A/B testing, then neither is our aural memory consistent enough to to "get used to" something.
And BTW, my comments aren't necessarily directed at you or StigErik. In some instances I am merely relating my "personal" opinions.
If our aural memory isn't consistent enough to hear changes in break in without A/B testing, then neither is our aural memory consistent enough to to "get used to" something.
And BTW, my comments aren't necessarily directed at you or StigErik. In some instances I am merely relating my "personal" opinions.
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I don`t understand this at all
My experience (
35years) with audio amplifiers has always been without any exception, that they all get better after a certain amount ofbreaking in !
I doubt that the NC400 is any different !
Some amps reach their optimal potiental within a few days and some don`t. But I do believe that a breaking in period is absolutely nessesary !
The audio components need some amount of time to settle in and reach their peak level
I`ve tried these class D amps in my own setup :
Acoustic Reality amp EAR 2 with Ice power A500.
Hypex UCD400.
Lyngdorf SDA2175.
LC Audio Zappulse 2.3SE.
Regards Gonzax
PS: review to come at the end of this weekend
you can't get people to agree on things that are way less subtle.I don`t understand this at all
if barely measurable differences accounted for night-and day sonic improvements all audio designers would be in trouble. I'm not saying that break-in is definitely a myth but I wouldn't swear to it either. the weirdest thing with break-in is that, according to reviewers, it always improves sound, never the opposite.
anyway waiting for the review but a few initial impressions wouldn't hurt
There are indeed things that settle to the better with time like driver suspensions that are stiffer when coming directly from manufacturing.
I am convinced that this amp design is very stable regarding ageing. Keep in mind that the frequency response is better than our ear's. Distortion is so low that it could be regarded as not perceivable. In what direction should the amp improve then ?
Did anyone ever notice that the changes achieved by break-in are almost always to the better ? ;-) ;-) ;-)
Regards
Charles
Edit: just saw that the preceding post is telling almost the same - think I should learn to type faster.
I am convinced that this amp design is very stable regarding ageing. Keep in mind that the frequency response is better than our ear's. Distortion is so low that it could be regarded as not perceivable. In what direction should the amp improve then ?
Did anyone ever notice that the changes achieved by break-in are almost always to the better ? ;-) ;-) ;-)
Regards
Charles
Edit: just saw that the preceding post is telling almost the same - think I should learn to type faster.
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yes, I did
I think I once read one review which said that some component actually got worse in time.oh and I didn't even mention all the EMI that "floats" around us, and the fact that it varies during the day. or the quality of the power...
but returning to the "subject" (whatever that is) is it possible that the hifi2000 people got sick with customizing requests? I wouldn't want to manually carve through aluminum face plates. or did I misread that post?
Me neither, not with with a gouge /curved chisel!
I do suspect they use a (cnc) router.
Maybe use something like Schaeffer (Home- Schaeffer AG - Frontplatten, Front Panels, Faces Avant). Expensive, but very good.
For the creation an engraving template file from a vector file, we charge a flat rate of € 20 per file and size. For vectorizing a bitmap image, we charge a flat rate of € 80 per file.
I think I'll pass
Dynamic loudspeaker break-in takes about 1 minute with a LF sinewave signal large enough to drive the speaker to Xmax. Then all T/S parameters are usually settled, and do not change over time. Or..... in fact they do when the room temperature changes.
Most of the benefits - not all.
In the case of NC400's input stage the "pseudo-balanced" connection can be acceptable but certainly a quality transformer (see Lundahl, Jensen) will not impact the sound in a negative way. Check their specs.
Other than providing a proper symmetrical output we also get "bonuses" (e.g. galvanic isolation) which might or may not be important, depending on the system/application. They certainly can't harm.
Oh, on the negative side, it's impossible to "audition" interconnect cables with a transformer at the input.
Most RCA-XLR converters are nothing but the wiring trick Bruno suggests, just ready made for you (at best - I recall examining a pair of "converterts" which were wired differently). Since we're talking DIY here, I see no point in buying something which we can easily make ourselves - not to mention it'll be neater to accommodate for this inside the enclosure rather than mess with adapters.
I'll be waiting for Bruno's article (white paper?) on these topics, but I've never had an issue with proper input transformers.
It's even better to have a fully balanced source, of course. They used to be a rarity, a "luxury" even, but not anymore.
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