Time for a stupid question. And appologies in advance as I didn't see this posted, but what sort of power requirements do a pair of these need ? Overkill to run off a receiver at 140 watts per channel ? And if I've understood anything yet, full range driver in this setup NOT requiring any sort of cross-over....... right ?
Ok, one more silly question. Sorry. Anyone running these in a Home Theatre setup and can comment or am I in the wrong part of town here....... these have no place in a Home Theatre setup?
I'm looking to build something and in the last few weeks I've stumbled on this whole horn world (yes, I'm new!!). It started out with need for a subwoofer and the Danley world of low frequency sound reproduction. I continued reading and ........... well, I'm now here trying to absorb as much as possible. I'm concerned I've wandered off the beaten path into an area where no Home Theatre guy should be.
Thoughts/critisms/flaming ??!?!??!
Ok, one more silly question. Sorry. Anyone running these in a Home Theatre setup and can comment or am I in the wrong part of town here....... these have no place in a Home Theatre setup?
I'm looking to build something and in the last few weeks I've stumbled on this whole horn world (yes, I'm new!!). It started out with need for a subwoofer and the Danley world of low frequency sound reproduction. I continued reading and ........... well, I'm now here trying to absorb as much as possible. I'm concerned I've wandered off the beaten path into an area where no Home Theatre guy should be.
Thoughts/critisms/flaming ??!?!??!
Tominizer,
Let me have a go at this with some thoughts
140 watt/channel receiver should be more than enough to run FH3s with any of the driver options - Fostex FE126, Markaudio CHR-70, CHP-70, EL-70, or Alpair 7. Again all amps are not the same, and there is the question of quality (imaging, resoultion, pace etc) one can consider besides the amplifier wattage.
for FH3 no crossovers required. However if you plan to integrate with a sub-woofer then you will need to use a low pass filter or set the crossover frequency through your HT amp/sound card.
FH3 should do well as HT system front speakers. IIRC you will find something on this thread a few pages back on this. For full enjoyment of HT you will definitely need a sub-woofer, center, and rear speakers. For center it is advised that you choose the same driver as that of the fronts i.e. if front speakers are using Alpair 7, use an Alp 7 in the center too - expereinced users say that this maintains vocal purity across the front.
I am a newbie myself - learned a lot from the forums - it's such a rich source of info/knowledge... so keep on reading!
Let me have a go at this with some thoughts
140 watt/channel receiver should be more than enough to run FH3s with any of the driver options - Fostex FE126, Markaudio CHR-70, CHP-70, EL-70, or Alpair 7. Again all amps are not the same, and there is the question of quality (imaging, resoultion, pace etc) one can consider besides the amplifier wattage.
for FH3 no crossovers required. However if you plan to integrate with a sub-woofer then you will need to use a low pass filter or set the crossover frequency through your HT amp/sound card.
FH3 should do well as HT system front speakers. IIRC you will find something on this thread a few pages back on this. For full enjoyment of HT you will definitely need a sub-woofer, center, and rear speakers. For center it is advised that you choose the same driver as that of the fronts i.e. if front speakers are using Alpair 7, use an Alp 7 in the center too - expereinced users say that this maintains vocal purity across the front.
I am a newbie myself - learned a lot from the forums - it's such a rich source of info/knowledge... so keep on reading!
I have powered my FH1s/FE126eN off a Miniwatt 2.5 watt tube amp before, so 140 watts is certainly enough. I have also used them for home theater, although powered by either a 10w chip amp or a 50w receiver. No center channel was used but they needed a subwoofer. I'd say the FE126eN handles music better than cinema, but it'll get the job done.
I just built a new set of speakers for the living room so my FH1s are going to move to the office. I plan to build some FH3 cabinets for the FE126eNs so I can compare. Really, its just an excuse to build something...plus I want to have them match the furniture in the room.
I just built a new set of speakers for the living room so my FH1s are going to move to the office. I plan to build some FH3 cabinets for the FE126eNs so I can compare. Really, its just an excuse to build something...plus I want to have them match the furniture in the room.
There is at least 1 member here with 4 FH3 serving HT duty (reminds me i need to draw up the little FE126 BR for centre duty).
Power requirements depend on the driver choosen. 140w is certainly lots with any. I will opine that with the typical HT receiver, EL70/CHP/CHR might well be the best choice, as they tend not to show an amplifiers warts as much as FE126 or A7. EL70 would make a killer HT (i can come up with a centre for those too)
dave
Power requirements depend on the driver choosen. 140w is certainly lots with any. I will opine that with the typical HT receiver, EL70/CHP/CHR might well be the best choice, as they tend not to show an amplifiers warts as much as FE126 or A7. EL70 would make a killer HT (i can come up with a centre for those too)
dave
Tominizer - is that a 140W 2 channel receiver or one with full surround capabilities?
In a DIY system with current or future center channel you'll likely find the most seamless integrated front row performance (dynamics, tonal voicing, etc) by using the same model of driver(s if multi-way) in all 3 locations. In the ( up to 4?) surround channels, you can very likely get away with smaller / different drivers.
Modern surround processing equipment (in my own case an entry level Denon AVR) have the distinct advantage of bass management and EQ/level calibration utilities that make setting levels and XO a very simple operation, and moreover of fine-tuning to allow for even modest cost and compact DIY speakers to deliver excellent performance.
Of the drivers that are know to work well in the FH3, as well as the smaller enclosures typically implemented for center channel, I'd concur with the suggested EL/CHR/CHP70 family. Personally I'm using Alpair 7 in different enclosures (Pensil) for the front row, with Alpair6M for rear surrounds. The 7s are know to work very well in FH3, but as Dave noted both they and the FE126E are not as forgiving as the others named.
In a DIY system with current or future center channel you'll likely find the most seamless integrated front row performance (dynamics, tonal voicing, etc) by using the same model of driver(s if multi-way) in all 3 locations. In the ( up to 4?) surround channels, you can very likely get away with smaller / different drivers.
Modern surround processing equipment (in my own case an entry level Denon AVR) have the distinct advantage of bass management and EQ/level calibration utilities that make setting levels and XO a very simple operation, and moreover of fine-tuning to allow for even modest cost and compact DIY speakers to deliver excellent performance.
Of the drivers that are know to work well in the FH3, as well as the smaller enclosures typically implemented for center channel, I'd concur with the suggested EL/CHR/CHP70 family. Personally I'm using Alpair 7 in different enclosures (Pensil) for the front row, with Alpair6M for rear surrounds. The 7s are know to work very well in FH3, but as Dave noted both they and the FE126E are not as forgiving as the others named.
I too am new to this and was intending to build a pair of microtowers till i came across these. A very fine design very sleek looking they could be made to look very classy with the right clothes on.........just getting that curve right at the back might pose a challenge though like the pictures elsewhere of these with spikes they look neat. should tighten the sound up too. Im gonna drive them with a rotel pre/power combo.
You might find it worth trying some thinner cables: many here use valve amps that have a high output impedance, which can alter the frequency response a little, through the lower midrange and bass.
Thinner cables (such as cat5) will add that resistance back in, giving a warmer sound.
Just something to try if it's not quite right: playing with room positioning will change the sound too.
Good luck.
Finished building the F3 about three weeks ago.
At first I loaded them with the fe126en fostex, but that wasn't doing it for me. Picked up a pair of the A7's, With about 75 hours on them they stand head and shoulders above the Fostex's. Very nice speakers, I would recommend them. For the moment I threw a couple coats of shellac on them, I'll shoot some paint on them after I'm sure I'm done futzing with them.
I'm currently driving them with a HK 3490 and using the Fm and a Pure Ipod dock as a source. The Pure is a fantastic value that I would recommend.
I'll probably throw the 126's in a small box for the bedroom. If anyone has any idea's or is thinking about testing something new let me know.
Chris/Dave thanks for your effort on the F3's,
At first I loaded them with the fe126en fostex, but that wasn't doing it for me. Picked up a pair of the A7's, With about 75 hours on them they stand head and shoulders above the Fostex's. Very nice speakers, I would recommend them. For the moment I threw a couple coats of shellac on them, I'll shoot some paint on them after I'm sure I'm done futzing with them.
I'm currently driving them with a HK 3490 and using the Fm and a Pure Ipod dock as a source. The Pure is a fantastic value that I would recommend.
I'll probably throw the 126's in a small box for the bedroom. If anyone has any idea's or is thinking about testing something new let me know.
Chris/Dave thanks for your effort on the F3's,
Finished building the F3 about three weeks ago.
At first I loaded them with the fe126en fostex, but that wasn't doing it for me. Picked up a pair of the A7's, With about 75 hours on them they stand head and shoulders above the Fostex's. Very nice speakers, I would recommend them. For the moment I threw a couple coats of shellac on them, I'll shoot some paint on them after I'm sure I'm done futzing with them.
I'm currently driving them with a HK 3490 and using the Fm and a Pure Ipod dock as a source. The Pure is a fantastic value that I would recommend.
I'll probably throw the 126's in a small box for the bedroom. If anyone has any idea's or is thinking about testing something new let me know.
Chris/Dave thanks for your effort on the F3's,
Frankly I think that if the 126s didn't do it for you in the FH3, that in a smaller enclosure they'll underwhelm you even more, unless assisted with woofers. I use the plural because an enclosure qualifying as small (sealed or ported) will be hard pressed to deliver much below 110-120? Hz with this driver. Further, their famous "aggressively forward" presentation isn't to everyone's taste in any enclosure or room and may certainly be ill suited for a bedroom.
While there are other Fostex drivers I prefer overall, I can understand the appeal of the 126 in a BLH.
That said, the Alpair7 is unquestionably a far more refined and elegant driver in any of the 4 or 5 enclosure designs in which I've heard it to date.
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Thanks for the responses!!! I was really unsure about how people were going to react to the HT topic.
I have a medium size room in the basement. It's about 17 feet wide and 30 plus feet long with 9 foot ceilings. As for amplification, it's nothing special. I'm using a Pioneer Elite SC-35 receiver with that ICE amplification. The room "was" finished previously and I'm *hacking* it up to accommodate the HT for a screen/projector setup (aka. man-cave). So far, the WAF hasn't come into play, although she's been sniffing around more and more as I tear things apart. Oops
I 100% agree about utilizing the same drivers for the centre for sure. I guess my concerns there would be in being able to "keep up" with the mains deisgn wise. I'll assume it's going to be a completely different design (more conventiional ?!?!?) and be on it's side unless the Frugal could be designed to be FAT and short??? Is it possible to do such as long as the cross-sectional areas and tapers of the horn (if I have the terms correct here..... as I mentioned.... I'm new) are consistent with the design ? I don't know. I'm just shooting off the hip here.
Cheers !!
I have a medium size room in the basement. It's about 17 feet wide and 30 plus feet long with 9 foot ceilings. As for amplification, it's nothing special. I'm using a Pioneer Elite SC-35 receiver with that ICE amplification. The room "was" finished previously and I'm *hacking* it up to accommodate the HT for a screen/projector setup (aka. man-cave). So far, the WAF hasn't come into play, although she's been sniffing around more and more as I tear things apart. Oops
I 100% agree about utilizing the same drivers for the centre for sure. I guess my concerns there would be in being able to "keep up" with the mains deisgn wise. I'll assume it's going to be a completely different design (more conventiional ?!?!?) and be on it's side unless the Frugal could be designed to be FAT and short??? Is it possible to do such as long as the cross-sectional areas and tapers of the horn (if I have the terms correct here..... as I mentioned.... I'm new) are consistent with the design ? I don't know. I'm just shooting off the hip here.
Cheers !!
Thanks chris i might just try that. Iv heard good things using that cable for chipamps and passive pre amps. Ill wire the driver to the input connections using this cable then from the speaker to the amp.
the curve is fairly easy steady hand and a jigsaw ,plus theres always plenty of good advice on here .
Tom:
In a word, no you can't morph the dimensions of the FH to fit your space, or relocate driver for aesthetics.
Depending on driver of choice there could well be appropriately sized enclosures well suited to the often cramped locations available for the center. Fortuitously, the bandwidth allocated to this channel can be tailored with the bass management /EQ of most current HT/surround electronics with relative ease - certainly easily enough that I can play around with it and still get back to the starting point.
For the record I can highly recommend the Alpair7 in both the FH and a small vented center channel enclosure
In a word, no you can't morph the dimensions of the FH to fit your space, or relocate driver for aesthetics.
Depending on driver of choice there could well be appropriately sized enclosures well suited to the often cramped locations available for the center. Fortuitously, the bandwidth allocated to this channel can be tailored with the bass management /EQ of most current HT/surround electronics with relative ease - certainly easily enough that I can play around with it and still get back to the starting point.
For the record I can highly recommend the Alpair7 in both the FH and a small vented center channel enclosure
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Frugal Horns W/modified shop plans
Here are the Frugal-Horns completed August 2011.
I used A-1 hardwood veneer plywood - 7 ply veneer core- with a 45 degree lock miter on the front vertical edges. This simplified the finishing process since I only had to cap the top with solid hardwood.
Plans - 5 PDF sheets-
01 Title Sheet
02 Cut Sheet
03 Half Size Plans
04 Sides and Sections
05 Full Size Plans 30x42
With these plans, one sled and two templates, one can come pretty close to the accuracy of the CNC created cabinets.
First run with walnut plywood.
sled to cut the front angle
template to router the curved back
the last template to do the rebate for the internal parts
Second run with cherry plywood.
Some of the best sounding speakers I've come across - really matched up well with a SET Tube Amp.
I may be interested in small runs of 3 to 4 completed pairs to sell if there is enough interest. ?
Here are the Frugal-Horns completed August 2011.
I used A-1 hardwood veneer plywood - 7 ply veneer core- with a 45 degree lock miter on the front vertical edges. This simplified the finishing process since I only had to cap the top with solid hardwood.
Plans - 5 PDF sheets-
01 Title Sheet
02 Cut Sheet
03 Half Size Plans
04 Sides and Sections
05 Full Size Plans 30x42
With these plans, one sled and two templates, one can come pretty close to the accuracy of the CNC created cabinets.
First run with walnut plywood.
sled to cut the front angle
template to router the curved back
the last template to do the rebate for the internal parts
Second run with cherry plywood.
Some of the best sounding speakers I've come across - really matched up well with a SET Tube Amp.
I may be interested in small runs of 3 to 4 completed pairs to sell if there is enough interest. ?