I just got whatever was cheapest - not a big deal. It's for fun so look for power rating, easy to attach, etc. Get cheapest available to try out. Mounting on wall ruins the bass and spaciousness of the open baffle. Best suspended in the air from two strings. Or mounted on a stand. Good luck.
You might try these units from Dayton: https://www.parts-express.com/dayton-audio-daex25fhe-4-framed-high-efficiency-25mm-exciter-24w-4-ohm--295-224
They are 4 ohms and seem to be designed to handle some power.
They are 4 ohms and seem to be designed to handle some power.
that exciter in conjunction with foam kind of reminds me of the polyplanar speakers I had 50 years ago - these single drivers had some treble but also a somewhat peaky sound up high due to their thin flat metal "dustcap" - IIRC, there were a set or two of concentric ring decouplers from the the main frame.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
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Unfortunately I'd ordered a pair of these:
Dayton Audio DAEX13CT-8 Coin Type 13mm Exciter 3W 8 Ohm | 295-216
before you'd had a chance to respond, xrk971!
I attached them 6 inches from each end of the foam board, and then super glued the back of the transducers to a pair of old floor standing lamps that we weren't using.
They sound good! I've not done any EQing, but as they are their strengths are definitely in the midrange, so they could become a nice part of a multi-way system.
To add the 'air', I could cut a hole in the baffle for a tweeter, and affix that to the stands too.
Dayton Audio DAEX13CT-8 Coin Type 13mm Exciter 3W 8 Ohm | 295-216
before you'd had a chance to respond, xrk971!
I attached them 6 inches from each end of the foam board, and then super glued the back of the transducers to a pair of old floor standing lamps that we weren't using.
They sound good! I've not done any EQing, but as they are their strengths are definitely in the midrange, so they could become a nice part of a multi-way system.
To add the 'air', I could cut a hole in the baffle for a tweeter, and affix that to the stands too.
unaHM,
Cool - do have any photos? I am not sure if those exciters were meant to be used with their backs glued to a support. You may get better high freq response with them free floating. Did you try supporting the foam core board from the edges? Are you using the full 20x30 inches in stereo?
Cool - do have any photos? I am not sure if those exciters were meant to be used with their backs glued to a support. You may get better high freq response with them free floating. Did you try supporting the foam core board from the edges? Are you using the full 20x30 inches in stereo?
Thanks!
I did try supporting them from the edges beforehand, and they sounded about the same. I suppose I was stuck on a mindset about enhancing the Bass output by adding resistance for larger excursions, and hadn't thought about how fixing them could hamper the smaller ones!
Depending on the recording though, they do well in terms of frequency coverage! Maybe I don't notice the low and high frequencies as much because of the impressive midrange output!
I am using the full 20x30" panels in stereo
Following the stereo placement of sounds is natural - not interfering with the mix.
I did try supporting them from the edges beforehand, and they sounded about the same. I suppose I was stuck on a mindset about enhancing the Bass output by adding resistance for larger excursions, and hadn't thought about how fixing them could hamper the smaller ones!
Depending on the recording though, they do well in terms of frequency coverage! Maybe I don't notice the low and high frequencies as much because of the impressive midrange output!
I am using the full 20x30" panels in stereo
Following the stereo placement of sounds is natural - not interfering with the mix.
Hi all,
I think we need a thicker panel to make more bass. Using 20 mm thickness, it's work well.
The panel are 50 cm X 70 cm, "moving" by a driver without cone.
With 6 db xover near 120 hz :
Phil.
I think we need a thicker panel to make more bass. Using 20 mm thickness, it's work well.
The panel are 50 cm X 70 cm, "moving" by a driver without cone.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
With 6 db xover near 120 hz :
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Phil.
Philfr,
That response looks very impressive - how far away and what drive power are you using? The front of the panel shows it is very light foam bead board and I see lots of mounting points. Do you have a frame or stiffer board behind the front? Some photos of the back side mounting would be nice. What driver did you cannibalize to make the actuator? The frequency response is reaching into what I would call sub woofer territory.
That response looks very impressive - how far away and what drive power are you using? The front of the panel shows it is very light foam bead board and I see lots of mounting points. Do you have a frame or stiffer board behind the front? Some photos of the back side mounting would be nice. What driver did you cannibalize to make the actuator? The frequency response is reaching into what I would call sub woofer territory.
More picts :
Driver is Advent W1610, but I can use any other driver for same results, only two things acts : BL and Xmax..
For a big panel BL above 8 work's well, and 2 or 3 mm displacement are sufficient..
This speaker work like non pistonic mode, that's the big difference..
Panel move in all directions.
TS mesurement :
f(s)= 29.61 Hz
R(e)= 5.05 Ohms
Q(ms)= 9.832
Q(es)= 2.652
Q(ts)= 2.089
V(as)= 3443.000 liters (121.600 cubic feet)
SPL= 97.17 1W/1m
M(ms)= 107.40 grams
BL= 6.17
Phil.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Driver is Advent W1610, but I can use any other driver for same results, only two things acts : BL and Xmax..
For a big panel BL above 8 work's well, and 2 or 3 mm displacement are sufficient..
This speaker work like non pistonic mode, that's the big difference..
Panel move in all directions.
TS mesurement :
f(s)= 29.61 Hz
R(e)= 5.05 Ohms
Q(ms)= 9.832
Q(es)= 2.652
Q(ts)= 2.089
V(as)= 3443.000 liters (121.600 cubic feet)
SPL= 97.17 1W/1m
M(ms)= 107.40 grams
BL= 6.17
Phil.
You know it cheating when you have a dedicated Maple top bench
to build stuff. ; )
I like the black foam. The black foam that I got has bright white core
and I like the look of the black core foam. Where does one find it?
X - FYI, I've been negociating with the wife to use the table again
to finish my mini Ks. And, convincing my assistant to keep honing her
skills so she won't get glue all over the drivers and tweeters.
...coming soon to a living room near me.
Philfr,
These measurements of the T/S params are indeed very interesting - never have I seen a Vas and Qts as large - and this makes it perfectly suited as an OB. That is very impressive efficiency. The problem is with it moving in non-pistonic mode how do you get the T/S parameters because there is probably more than one impedance peak for the software to try and fit? Did you use added mass method?
If you can post the impedance measurement that was used to get the T/S that would be great. I got like 50 peaks from bass to high freq when I did mine.
These measurements of the T/S params are indeed very interesting - never have I seen a Vas and Qts as large - and this makes it perfectly suited as an OB. That is very impressive efficiency. The problem is with it moving in non-pistonic mode how do you get the T/S parameters because there is probably more than one impedance peak for the software to try and fit? Did you use added mass method?
If you can post the impedance measurement that was used to get the T/S that would be great. I got like 50 peaks from bass to high freq when I did mine.
Xrk,
You are right, I use WT3 with added mass method..
In fact, TS are not reality, but it gives only an idea of the reality, and explain why it's work..
Impedance curve :
Peaks are probably due to poor centering of the "motor" on the panel, this curve show impedance when "motor" is centered. If I place it lower, curve is different and TS too, but response are more linear and smooth..
Only one guy (my knowledge) build a circular (80 cm diameter)..
Phil.
You are right, I use WT3 with added mass method..
In fact, TS are not reality, but it gives only an idea of the reality, and explain why it's work..
Impedance curve :
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Peaks are probably due to poor centering of the "motor" on the panel, this curve show impedance when "motor" is centered. If I place it lower, curve is different and TS too, but response are more linear and smooth..
Only one guy (my knowledge) build a circular (80 cm diameter)..
Phil.
About unaHm speaker..
I try this with daex25 Dayton, and 3 panels, one raw (3 mm thickness), sandwich (paper/foam/paper) and raw with adding a little piece of aluminium sheet..
With paper sandwich, sound is more smooth and I have a more linear response, with aluminium hight frequencies are better. But (in my case and for my taste), it 's only good with mid range, maybe 200 hz to 3000 hz..
So I'm not going any further and don't save mesurements.
Maybe with study NXT articles, It's possible to get better..
Phil.
I try this with daex25 Dayton, and 3 panels, one raw (3 mm thickness), sandwich (paper/foam/paper) and raw with adding a little piece of aluminium sheet..
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
With paper sandwich, sound is more smooth and I have a more linear response, with aluminium hight frequencies are better. But (in my case and for my taste), it 's only good with mid range, maybe 200 hz to 3000 hz..
So I'm not going any further and don't save mesurements.
Maybe with study NXT articles, It's possible to get better..
Phil.
Thanks for the research Phil! I agree - the midrange with this style of speaker is very desirable, and because it's so even it's easy to control.
I'm intrigued by your panel speaker design too! It looks very good! I'll have to see if I can find any speakers that match the BL/Xmax requirements you have mentioned.
Just for clarity, is the panel 'non-pistonic' because it's fixed at the edges? Does the panel flex in more of a dome pattern (i.e. more where the motor is mounted, and less as we get to the edges of the panel)?
I'm intrigued by your panel speaker design too! It looks very good! I'll have to see if I can find any speakers that match the BL/Xmax requirements you have mentioned.
Just for clarity, is the panel 'non-pistonic' because it's fixed at the edges? Does the panel flex in more of a dome pattern (i.e. more where the motor is mounted, and less as we get to the edges of the panel)?
Hi,
When the panel is fixed at frame, that created more bass..
The best shape is square ou circular, in fact this panel act like a big drum, maybe a Daiko, japanese drum :
Kodo - "O-Daiko" - HD (japanese drummers - Taiko - tambours géants Japon) - YouTube
See some close up like at 30 secondes.
This panel are not new, see history :
History and Types of Speakers
Article about NXT :
http://www.fujitsu-ten.com/business/technicaljournal/pdf/14-3.pdf
I'm not gone further, cause waf !! Any chance to place it in my living room, except divorce..
For exemple, a 1m x 1m panel go down 15/20 hz.
Phil.
When the panel is fixed at frame, that created more bass..
The best shape is square ou circular, in fact this panel act like a big drum, maybe a Daiko, japanese drum :
Kodo - "O-Daiko" - HD (japanese drummers - Taiko - tambours géants Japon) - YouTube
See some close up like at 30 secondes.
This panel are not new, see history :
History and Types of Speakers
Article about NXT :
http://www.fujitsu-ten.com/business/technicaljournal/pdf/14-3.pdf
I'm not gone further, cause waf !! Any chance to place it in my living room, except divorce..
For exemple, a 1m x 1m panel go down 15/20 hz.
Phil.
