That's the stuff.
If you can get fleece, make a quilt using muslin cloth or similar and
attach that to the sides. If the cabinet doesn't need a lot of damping,
you can run some over the rear of the driver.
You are right Suzy. Fleece is fluffy stuff. I am trying to refrain from the sheip jokes, are you?
Geoff.
If you can get fleece, make a quilt using muslin cloth or similar and
attach that to the sides. If the cabinet doesn't need a lot of damping,
you can run some over the rear of the driver.
You are right Suzy. Fleece is fluffy stuff. I am trying to refrain from the sheip jokes, are you?
Geoff.
Thanks for letting me know D1GGY as it's nice to know they arrived safely. I'll be interested to hear what you think of them and please remember they have bass limitations.
My main speakers are out of action as I'm doing some testing for a new design, so the little Vifa is in there with stereo plate amp powered M22WR woofers and not too shabby at all..... an enjoyable listen. Very versatile little speakers to have around.
FWIW the only thing I would change to improve them is maybe (I haven't tried it so it's a big maybe) change the tweeter to one of my favourites, the SEAS 27TDFC as could be a tad smoother on the top end. The Vifa D27TG-35-06 can vary in sound quality from what I've read.... and no, mine aren't being changed as I'm quite happy with them. This is only an advice for builders for an alternative tweeter that can drop right in with no changes.
My main speakers are out of action as I'm doing some testing for a new design, so the little Vifa is in there with stereo plate amp powered M22WR woofers and not too shabby at all..... an enjoyable listen. Very versatile little speakers to have around.
FWIW the only thing I would change to improve them is maybe (I haven't tried it so it's a big maybe) change the tweeter to one of my favourites, the SEAS 27TDFC as could be a tad smoother on the top end. The Vifa D27TG-35-06 can vary in sound quality from what I've read.... and no, mine aren't being changed as I'm quite happy with them. This is only an advice for builders for an alternative tweeter that can drop right in with no changes.
Finished
Hi guys,
I finished my versions of Rabbitz monitors last night. I used crown-cut birch veneer, applied with the PVA/iron method. The hardest bit was trimming the driver cutouts.
I've put a couple of coats of carnauba wax on them, and will probably do a couple more. I'm really happy with the look - they're very Scandinavian. The radius on the sides of the baffle was well worth the effort.
I've settled on a 6dB series crossover using a 6u8 MKT cap across the woofer, and a 4m7 16ga inductor across the tweeter, with a 5 Ohm resistor to pad out the tweeter. It sounds neutral when compared with my Infinities, but so far I don't have a calibrated microphone to check. Anyway, they sound great, especially for such a small speaker.
Thanks for the help, and thanks for sharing the design.
Cheers,
Suzy
Hi guys,
I finished my versions of Rabbitz monitors last night. I used crown-cut birch veneer, applied with the PVA/iron method. The hardest bit was trimming the driver cutouts.
I've put a couple of coats of carnauba wax on them, and will probably do a couple more. I'm really happy with the look - they're very Scandinavian. The radius on the sides of the baffle was well worth the effort.
I've settled on a 6dB series crossover using a 6u8 MKT cap across the woofer, and a 4m7 16ga inductor across the tweeter, with a 5 Ohm resistor to pad out the tweeter. It sounds neutral when compared with my Infinities, but so far I don't have a calibrated microphone to check. Anyway, they sound great, especially for such a small speaker.
Thanks for the help, and thanks for sharing the design.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Cheers,
Suzy
Well done Suzy,
They look real neat. Are you taking orders? LOL. I have a tendancy to do what's needed to get the sound, and forget about asthetics.
The grain on top makes them look like they're carved from solid.
Don't worry about the callibrated mike, it's your ears that count.
Cheers
Geoff
They look real neat. Are you taking orders? LOL. I have a tendancy to do what's needed to get the sound, and forget about asthetics.
The grain on top makes them look like they're carved from solid.
Don't worry about the callibrated mike, it's your ears that count.
Cheers
Geoff
Yes , certainly trust the ears as are the best instrument around.
They look awesome and you should be proud. I'm glad they sound good as these are meant to be an entry into the hobby and can be used as a reference point for all that come after. I'm a firm believer that your first DIY speaker should sound good so you feel confident to progess further into the hobby.... looking good doesn't hurt either.
How did you go with the PVA iron menthod? Any tricks you learned along the way? I tend to route the drivers out after the veneer is applied as ends up being easier and cleaner.
Well done
They look awesome and you should be proud. I'm glad they sound good as these are meant to be an entry into the hobby and can be used as a reference point for all that come after. I'm a firm believer that your first DIY speaker should sound good so you feel confident to progess further into the hobby.... looking good doesn't hurt either.
How did you go with the PVA iron menthod? Any tricks you learned along the way? I tend to route the drivers out after the veneer is applied as ends up being easier and cleaner.
Well done
rabbitz said:How did you go with the PVA iron menthod? Any tricks you learned along the way? I tend to route the drivers out after the veneer is applied as ends up being easier and cleaner.
Well done
I'll certainly do that with the next ones. The veneer I used had no backing, as I didn't want to see backing paper on the corners. I guess the main trick I found was to use a scalpel to trim the veneer. I bought a laminate trimming bit for my router from Bunnings, but found it tore the grain rather than cutting cleanly (maybe next time I'll try a decent one, rather than the el-cheapo Bunnings one).
Anyway, what I did instead was just lay the speaker down on my cutting board (having control of the kitchen is a good look, especially when it comes to using irons and suchforth) so that the back of the veneer is supported, then run a scalpel lightly along the edge to cut it. It takes 8 or 10 cuts to get through the veneer, but the smoothness of the cut is worth it. I went through about four scalpel blades.
The bits around the radiused part were the hardest, as I couldn't support them. I just cut them a millimetre or so away from the side of the speaker, and used some 400 grit emery to bring them flush.
Oh, one other thing. Tapping the veneer with a fingernail is a really good way to find bits that aren't anchored down properly. Just running the iron over the stubborn bits again was enough to get them to stay put.
Actually I think for the next lot, I'll make a compass fixture to hold a scalpel blade, and use that to cut through the veneer before routing the driver recesses, that way I'll eliminate any tearing.
Cheers,
Suzy
The only thing better than looking at a completed speaker (with pride) is listening to them while looking
Nice idea using a scalpel blade in a compass arrangement to score the veneer first. I wonder how the spiral cutters in a router would do as the spiral causes a slicing action more than a cutting action. I'll look into them and post here about it. May be good, may not. Something to note is that if you've used a heat treated adhesive the heat from the router bit friction may weaken the bond at the time of trimming.
*edit: It may be worth experimenting with some good masking tape to prevent blowout. Bear or 3M would be my pick as its not too sticky that it'd tear the grain itself when removed. Once the router is setup place the tape half and half and see what happens.
Do they sound any different upside down?
Nice job
Nice idea using a scalpel blade in a compass arrangement to score the veneer first. I wonder how the spiral cutters in a router would do as the spiral causes a slicing action more than a cutting action. I'll look into them and post here about it. May be good, may not. Something to note is that if you've used a heat treated adhesive the heat from the router bit friction may weaken the bond at the time of trimming.
*edit: It may be worth experimenting with some good masking tape to prevent blowout. Bear or 3M would be my pick as its not too sticky that it'd tear the grain itself when removed. Once the router is setup place the tape half and half and see what happens.
Do they sound any different upside down?
Nice job
I'd imagine that the upcut bits would suit tables where the veneered face is down and vice-versa for the downcut in a hand router - always have the bit 'pulling' towards the work. Something else that would help is to make a new base for the router that has a clearance hole just large enough for the bit. The added weight and support of the base would help prevent tearing.
No experience with either of them here but I'm looking for solutions to common tasks and their associated problems
No experience with either of them here but I'm looking for solutions to common tasks and their associated problems
I have replaced the Vifa tweeters by Scan Speak tweeters: model D2905/9900 'Revelator' in a special german edition with a 104mm frontal mounting plate:
http://img242.imageshack.us/img242/6493/pb220068dp3.jpg
For now I have left the AR series filter the same. These SCan Speaks are surely an improvement on the Vifa filters, but, the Scan Speaks are expensive (I managed to get a pair for a very low price).
When it comes to price/performance I think the Vifa's do better but when it comes to absolute best sound quality the Scan Speak is better in my opinion.
Best regards,
Walt
http://img242.imageshack.us/img242/6493/pb220068dp3.jpg
For now I have left the AR series filter the same. These SCan Speaks are surely an improvement on the Vifa filters, but, the Scan Speaks are expensive (I managed to get a pair for a very low price).
When it comes to price/performance I think the Vifa's do better but when it comes to absolute best sound quality the Scan Speak is better in my opinion.
Best regards,
Walt
Yes this can be interesting. I have tried several bookshelf speakers upside down . Most sounded better !
Check it out. Must keep the bass/mid at ear level.
It kind of approaches Missions arrangement ( and a few others ).
Cheers.
Would it be a logical observation that 'most' HF sounds are generated below the level ( in feet ) where vocals are produced ?
So shouldn't the tweeter be below the mid ?
I tried flipping mine upside down, but they sound much the same. I suspect any difference would depend a lot on what they're sitting on. I have mine sitting on top of another pair of speakers - approximately 1m from the floor.
I have noted some difference in sound depending on where I put them on the speakers they're sitting on. They sound best when they're aligned with the front of the speakers underneath. If I push them back, it affects the mid-bass.
I'm toying with bolting them to the wall in my study (spaced away from the wall with some speaker mounts), rather than sitting them on the desk.
Cheers,
Suzy
I have noted some difference in sound depending on where I put them on the speakers they're sitting on. They sound best when they're aligned with the front of the speakers underneath. If I push them back, it affects the mid-bass.
I'm toying with bolting them to the wall in my study (spaced away from the wall with some speaker mounts), rather than sitting them on the desk.
Cheers,
Suzy
contour said:
It's good to have a report on a tweeter change and would expect the Scan Speaks to be an improvement on the Vifa. Glad you got them at a good price as I wouldn't even consider them for this little speaker and would go for a SEAS 27TDFC as the most expensive upgrade I would consider.
Nice to see you're playing with them to get the max... that's cool and is the idea of the project and this thread.
Keep going
ashok said:
The inverted woofer can work well with 1st order crossovers with normal polarity and 3rd order crossovers with reversed polarity as those crossovers have a downward tilt. Invert the drivers give an upward tilt and presto, psuedo time alignment... sort of. All to do with driver acoustic centres and ZDP and blah blah
The little Vifa project is reversed polarity on the tweeter so would be best with tweeter on top.