Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: definition of 'rock solid'
Hi Glen,
In addition to my reply #676, please have a look at the picture below, to make sure that we are not talking on cross purposes again.
Also, I have fiddled a bit with the "blameless" amp on my simulator. If R1 = 2k and C2 = 470pF, then the phase margin of the global feedback loop is 80 deg. If C2 = 0, then it becomes 75 deg. So there is a difference, admittedly, not that large, but I wouldn't call it "negligibly small". With your method, this difference would never be revealed.
Next, I made C4=2.7pF. Now, the phase margin is 92 deg. With your method we would still get 80 deg.
As said before, it is just as easy to do it the other (my) way, and (of course) it can be measured with the same equipment.
Cheers, Edmond.
G.Kleinschmidt said:
Hi Glen,
In addition to my reply #676, please have a look at the picture below, to make sure that we are not talking on cross purposes again.
Also, I have fiddled a bit with the "blameless" amp on my simulator. If R1 = 2k and C2 = 470pF, then the phase margin of the global feedback loop is 80 deg. If C2 = 0, then it becomes 75 deg. So there is a difference, admittedly, not that large, but I wouldn't call it "negligibly small". With your method, this difference would never be revealed.
Next, I made C4=2.7pF. Now, the phase margin is 92 deg. With your method we would still get 80 deg.
As said before, it is just as easy to do it the other (my) way, and (of course) it can be measured with the same equipment.
Cheers, Edmond.
Attachments
John,
is the Blowtorch case milled from one piece of aluminium, or is it milled from plates say 10mm thick? I am asking because not long ago I was designing a case made from milled 8mm thick aluminium plates (for shielding purposes). The result was exclellent, milling perfectly smooth and clean. But quite cheaper than you are saying.
(We are OT here, I know, but I have already recommended to split to separate thread on individual component's price).
is the Blowtorch case milled from one piece of aluminium, or is it milled from plates say 10mm thick? I am asking because not long ago I was designing a case made from milled 8mm thick aluminium plates (for shielding purposes). The result was exclellent, milling perfectly smooth and clean. But quite cheaper than you are saying.
(We are OT here, I know, but I have already recommended to split to separate thread on individual component's price).
There is good reason to mill it from a single block, but I won't be the person bring such understandings to the DIY table. Not my job. Even then, if attempted, derision would be the result, and those who understand it..would be silent and run off and start using it..themselves.
For example, on this forum (somewhere, penned by your truly) is the explaination of how Linn manufactures the LP12 platter. And exactly why it costs..what it does.($1000) No-one else does it Linn's way. Linn does it their way--for a reason. The big trick..is if one 'gets it', at all. The idea is to open one's mind, not close it..or attempt to force another to conform to one's desire of how the universe works. A long story of psychology, if there ever was one. As usual, only those who tend to interpret the universe in a literal/linear fashion will potentially take offence at my attempt at penning an obvious point of observation of humanity 'at large'. Some people get angry when their cranium gets scratched.....
Suffice it to say that understanding of 'exactly what is going on' on all technical levels is 'in there somewhere', and that doing so (single block milling) has it's advantages. It simply ends up costing --- what it does. Iffin' yah don't understand why, then yah don't. Iffin you think yah gotta attack such an unexplained point, then go ahead and do so. It's no skin off my backside.
Regardless, back to your regularly scheduled program.
For example, on this forum (somewhere, penned by your truly) is the explaination of how Linn manufactures the LP12 platter. And exactly why it costs..what it does.($1000) No-one else does it Linn's way. Linn does it their way--for a reason. The big trick..is if one 'gets it', at all. The idea is to open one's mind, not close it..or attempt to force another to conform to one's desire of how the universe works. A long story of psychology, if there ever was one. As usual, only those who tend to interpret the universe in a literal/linear fashion will potentially take offence at my attempt at penning an obvious point of observation of humanity 'at large'. Some people get angry when their cranium gets scratched.....
Suffice it to say that understanding of 'exactly what is going on' on all technical levels is 'in there somewhere', and that doing so (single block milling) has it's advantages. It simply ends up costing --- what it does. Iffin' yah don't understand why, then yah don't. Iffin you think yah gotta attack such an unexplained point, then go ahead and do so. It's no skin off my backside.
Regardless, back to your regularly scheduled program.
john curl said:
John,
Maybe you have noted that most of the flak is directed at you(and a few others, yes). Could it be that your own attitude infuriates people and extracts a craving for revenge? Funny enough, as an example, Bob C doesn't get nearly as much, if any. (Except, coincidentally, from you). Why would that be? Could it have anything to do with the fact that Bob doesn't call us fools, naive, failed designers, paranoid and the like? Just a thought.
Jan Didden
Actually, I called him as he was eating lunch. He has a recording studio, and he does mostly political broadcasts. However, he is a BIG audiophile, and designed his own tube audio equipment and studio. He is also an intellectual, so we can carry out a high level conversation on many things.
I casually mentioned your article in 'Audio Express'. I was rather proud of you doing something like that, but even I wondered how much you had been 'snowed' by the Mundorfians. My associate was adamant about it. I could have told you privately, but would it really matter?
You do my 'inventory' and I do yours. Fair is fair.
I casually mentioned your article in 'Audio Express'. I was rather proud of you doing something like that, but even I wondered how much you had been 'snowed' by the Mundorfians. My associate was adamant about it. I could have told you privately, but would it really matter?
You do my 'inventory' and I do yours. Fair is fair.
"...can't we all just get along?" Rodney King
Remember him?
A couple of things to keep in mind, folks.
Curl's a good egg.
Curl likes to have fun, he's not so very serious about things.
He does tend toward a degree of hyperbole in some respects.
A west coast guy with an east coast attitude??
THIS is diyaudio, and is not "dead serious" stuff nor is it "seriously serious" stuff. It's audio.
Not even a blip of importance to the world at large.
Now, some of us/you on this forum are rather serious people, and maybe are "serious" about themselves, their audio & electronic design. Nothing wrong with being serious per se. Some are, some are not.
Bottom line from where I sit is to not ever take anything said on the internet personally, unless it is actionable in a court of law. And even then, maybe not. That advice is well applied to all.
Ignore the noise, stick to the signal.
* * *
The Blowtorch as done by the late Bob Crump is made from a single milled billet of Aluminum. Crazy wacky gumby stuff there...
Me? I'd have hammered it out of an ingot of gold myself... heh.
<walks off cackling>
_-_-bear
Remember him?
A couple of things to keep in mind, folks.
Curl's a good egg.
Curl likes to have fun, he's not so very serious about things.
He does tend toward a degree of hyperbole in some respects.
A west coast guy with an east coast attitude??
THIS is diyaudio, and is not "dead serious" stuff nor is it "seriously serious" stuff. It's audio.
Not even a blip of importance to the world at large.
Now, some of us/you on this forum are rather serious people, and maybe are "serious" about themselves, their audio & electronic design. Nothing wrong with being serious per se. Some are, some are not.
Bottom line from where I sit is to not ever take anything said on the internet personally, unless it is actionable in a court of law. And even then, maybe not. That advice is well applied to all.
Ignore the noise, stick to the signal.
* * *
The Blowtorch as done by the late Bob Crump is made from a single milled billet of Aluminum. Crazy wacky gumby stuff there...
Me? I'd have hammered it out of an ingot of gold myself... heh.
<walks off cackling>
_-_-bear
At first, we tried to fabricate the case with aluminum sheets. We made our first prototype this way. It is now owned by Jack Bybee, who also has the first knobs that we designed, now referred to as 'Dolly knobs', after Dolly Parton, a big busted western singer.
We cut them back somewhat, because it made to preamp look like it was going to tip over.
Bob Crump worried when the fabricator, who had to do the helium-arc welding kept drinking beer after beer while putting it together. Therefore we decided to use aircraft grade alumium of one large piece and hog it it. We felt that we would get more consistancy that way. At first, the price for the 2 almost identical boxes was about $1500, but after a few years, rose to $3,000, as the machine shop got tired of not making enough on each unit. We usually did 6-10 cases at a time. However, no more, Bob is dead, I don't personally know the people at the machine shop in Texas, and I'm tired.
We cut them back somewhat, because it made to preamp look like it was going to tip over.
Bob Crump worried when the fabricator, who had to do the helium-arc welding kept drinking beer after beer while putting it together. Therefore we decided to use aircraft grade alumium of one large piece and hog it it. We felt that we would get more consistancy that way. At first, the price for the 2 almost identical boxes was about $1500, but after a few years, rose to $3,000, as the machine shop got tired of not making enough on each unit. We usually did 6-10 cases at a time. However, no more, Bob is dead, I don't personally know the people at the machine shop in Texas, and I'm tired.
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