To reiterate what has been said, latest Boxsim 2.0 is here now:
https://www.visaton.de/en/literature-software/software
Sample projects of varying quality which are quickly imported into the BPJ folder of 1.2 and 2.0 are here:
https://boxsim-db.de/kategorie/systeme/zwei-wege/
Gets you up and running in 5 minutes!
I attach a zipped version of Boxsim 1.2, which I actually prefer to 2.0.
Let me know if it doesn't work.
https://www.visaton.de/en/literature-software/software
Sample projects of varying quality which are quickly imported into the BPJ folder of 1.2 and 2.0 are here:
https://boxsim-db.de/kategorie/systeme/zwei-wege/
Gets you up and running in 5 minutes!
I attach a zipped version of Boxsim 1.2, which I actually prefer to 2.0.
Let me know if it doesn't work.
Boxsim 2.0 appears to have been quietly updated!
https://www.visaton.de/en/literature-software/software
It now includes a lot more driver files, up from the mere limited 20 or so at release. These are significantly different from Boxsim 1.2 in many cases, both on acoustic centres and frequency response..
Leading to slightly different solutions. Boxsim 2.0 includes actual off-axis measurements rather than simulating them. Might help sometimes.
I would presume that Boxsim 1.2 projects are still upwards compatible.
https://www.visaton.de/en/literature-software/software
It now includes a lot more driver files, up from the mere limited 20 or so at release. These are significantly different from Boxsim 1.2 in many cases, both on acoustic centres and frequency response..
Leading to slightly different solutions. Boxsim 2.0 includes actual off-axis measurements rather than simulating them. Might help sometimes.
I would presume that Boxsim 1.2 projects are still upwards compatible.
I just found Boxsim before noticing this thread. V2.1 is available but it appears to be only in German.
All I have done is poked around in it under wine on Linux. The wine version is ~3+ a bit years old. It doesn't appear to be limited to Visaton chassis. The additional chassis zip file doesn't increase the numbers by that many. It's all here.
http://www.boxsim.de/
All I have used so far without building is winisd as there are good tutorials for it. Boxsim has additional features so will struggle with that but at least I can find my way around it.
A big help.
All I have done is poked around in it under wine on Linux. The wine version is ~3+ a bit years old. It doesn't appear to be limited to Visaton chassis. The additional chassis zip file doesn't increase the numbers by that many. It's all here.
http://www.boxsim.de/
All I have used so far without building is winisd as there are good tutorials for it. Boxsim has additional features so will struggle with that but at least I can find my way around it.
A big help.The English versionI runs under LInux and can produce very similar results to WinISD 0.7... given the same data on box and vent. It's vent aspects aren't as well coupled as WinISD or not for me so far. There is a separate calculator that uses driver data and box volume that comes up with a box turning frequency and a couple of box volumes and one that can be user entered. The tuning frequency then needs to be transferred to the main program. Once I did that the results matched WinISD pretty closely. WinISD came up with a slightly longer vent. Probably down to rounding. Air velocity higher in WinISD even when set to 1w drive.
Big difference is the frequency response up the range with a woofer. WinISD shows it flat. Boxsim shows what might be expected from the free air response. A better indication of a suitable cross over frequency. It also shows an acoustic power plot. I don't know how that relates to our ears. It's flatter and about 5dB lower at 2KHz than spl which is rising from ~200Hz.
Main problem for me was that I hoped to use a small box and a bass shelf. Box volume and vent dia fixed so all I can change is port length. Not even sure it's possible. I have a boost of about 1dB at ~60Hz for an F3 of about 35.
Big difference is the frequency response up the range with a woofer. WinISD shows it flat. Boxsim shows what might be expected from the free air response. A better indication of a suitable cross over frequency. It also shows an acoustic power plot. I don't know how that relates to our ears. It's flatter and about 5dB lower at 2KHz than spl which is rising from ~200Hz.
Main problem for me was that I hoped to use a small box and a bass shelf. Box volume and vent dia fixed so all I can change is port length.
Not even sure it's possible. I have a boost of about 1dB at ~60Hz for an F3 of about 35.I haven't looked at 1.2 but thanks for uploading it.
It looks like they are using a different speaker model to the usual on V2 so using a different make of speaker may well be tricky. It does seem to show a more reasonable freq response of woofer than WinISD does. That shows the bass end ok but just a straight line out of that range. NVG if a highish cross over freq is needed. WinISD did a new trick for me too. It calculated some values and worked with them. When I tried to load the same values on another design it refused to use them.
Xmax on it bugged me as it mentions some where to store things that it doesn't use. However it does set a value that differs from the one in their data sheets. Might be the needed one - where it causes 10% distortion. The max spl graphs appear to account for Xmax showing how many jolts can be applied and max spl across the range.
Calculation time is longer than WinISD but it's crunching more numbers. A major change may take a some seconds using a 3,2ghz i7-8700. Pretty low power device in a tiny case and fan doesn't run what ever I am doing.
So far anyway. It's also running under wine on Linux.It has a cute trick if the red line of death appears due to errors. Click on the area and a pop up states what the problem is. Helpful when I 1st used it as had not filled enough sections in.
WinISD is more convenient. As many projects as needed and the 0dB reference graphs but it offers cursor readout. WinISD reckoned -3dB at 35Hz, Boxsim -5. It's driven via box volume and tuning frequency but there is a port calculator included. No optimisation on this aspect. None I have noticed anyway. Not sure I am interested in box Q based designs down to stuff I have listed too and general guidance on winisd seems to be change what it comes up with anyway.
Parameter to allow other brands to be used -
not sure but came across some interesting web pages around this one. This app may provide them - pass at the moment.https://www.cfuttrup.com/dpc_main.html
Because WinISD only looks at the piston behavior of a speaker.
In other words, it never was the purpose of WinISD to predict the total picture of a loudspeaker.
So if you're using WinISD that way, you're using it wrong.
WinISD works great if you just want to quickly compare the max performance of multiple drivers or ideas.
Looking and getting an estimate of their (max) cone excursion, power (VA graph) and rough idea of velocity in ports and volumes.
There aren't any programs who can do this that easily for so many drivers at once.
The downside is that it uses a couple of parameters (like Q-values for box and ports) that are far to ideal.
(by default I always lower those)
Why not using all of them
There is no perfect, all have their own strong points and weaknesses.
1. The crossover optimization feature of Boxsim works very well. It is possible to lock down any number of components and optimize a subset. For instance the lowpass can be locked and the highpass of the adjacent driver can be optimized by the program. 2. It is possible to locate drivers on any side of the cabinet. I have simulated a dipole by placing drivers front and back on a think cabinet. 3. It is now possible to simulate a large number of drivers, so shaded arrays can now be modeled.
There are a few to try. I downloaded hornresp but for some reason it wont install under wine on linux when the web suggests it can. It just bombs out immediately, no signs of an install doing anything.
Main thing with Boxsim is this
Where do those substitute entries come from?? And is it a complete set? Needed if I try to use another brand with it.
I just entered a Dayton woofer into it. Some moans but it let me do what I wanted. Also saved the project file.
Main problem is that Dayton do not appear to state how their measurements are made. I have read that they make use of a hole in the wall for speakers but Xmax? I'd hope it's the 10% distortion version.
So I picked DIN baffle as the measurement method and optimised for that. Then changed that setting. The sp graph could do all sorts of strange things.
The moans mostly related to some one choosing to build a box, measure the data and re enter it and doing something else. It suggested saving it with _mod on the end. Needed if a visaton speaker is being used. It doesn't seem to have actually saved it,
Main problem is that Dayton do not appear to state how their measurements are made. I have read that they make use of a hole in the wall for speakers but Xmax? I'd hope it's the 10% distortion version.
So I picked DIN baffle as the measurement method and optimised for that. Then changed that setting. The sp graph could do all sorts of strange things.
The moans mostly related to some one choosing to build a box, measure the data and re enter it and doing something else. It suggested saving it with _mod on the end. Needed if a visaton speaker is being used. It doesn't seem to have actually saved it,
I now find it pretty easy to use. It was mostly a familiarity problem as nothing like winisd. The common box aspect confused me a bit as I didn't realise each driver needed it's own enclosure when one is vented. I assume it's the same when sealed. Some commercial units do not use separate enclosures for each driver.
In the past I have designed speakers I would never build with a calculator using various sources of ideas about doing that. Cross overs - never really looked at them so was somewhat surprised what adding them did. Silly me really. Boxsim includes a calculator for these and it needs the driver impedance which will vary with frequency so I was wrong to expect to see the ideal passband response. The spl is likely to vary as well over it's active frequency range. It seems a pro would add more bits to correct that aspect Tricky without some examples of what to do. I haven't found much in terms of examples on the web or on the Boxsim finished designs site.
The optimiser. Interesting but I don't see any way of steering it towards a cross over frequency. For instance pretty flat response etc but a cross over frequency of 1kHz - not where I want it. At say a few hundred hz or 2kHz it may not be as "good" but might be ok for my use.
LOL One interesting thing - being keen I ordered 2 drivers. Cheap and Xmax looked ok for low frequency use. 7mm. Visaton parts and when loaded cone excursion is set to +/-2mm. 7mm is the mechanical limit. I assume +/-2 is for 10% distortion. With that limit max spl is too low at low frequencies that the driver can handle.
In the past I have designed speakers I would never build with a calculator using various sources of ideas about doing that. Cross overs - never really looked at them so was somewhat surprised what adding them did. Silly me really. Boxsim includes a calculator for these and it needs the driver impedance which will vary with frequency so I was wrong to expect to see the ideal passband response. The spl is likely to vary as well over it's active frequency range. It seems a pro would add more bits to correct that aspect Tricky without some examples of what to do. I haven't found much in terms of examples on the web or on the Boxsim finished designs site.
The optimiser. Interesting but I don't see any way of steering it towards a cross over frequency. For instance pretty flat response etc but a cross over frequency of 1kHz - not where I want it. At say a few hundred hz or 2kHz it may not be as "good" but might be ok for my use.
LOL One interesting thing - being keen I ordered 2 drivers. Cheap and Xmax looked ok for low frequency use. 7mm. Visaton parts and when loaded cone excursion is set to +/-2mm. 7mm is the mechanical limit. I assume +/-2 is for 10% distortion. With that limit max spl is too low at low frequencies that the driver can handle.
It's on this page
https://www.visaton.de/en/literature-software/software
The earlier version is attached to one of the posts in this thread.
https://www.visaton.de/en/literature-software/software
The earlier version is attached to one of the posts in this thread.
I could not get the link to work either. I zipped up the folder of 2.00 I have on my PC. It doesn't really install. You just unzip and then click on the .exe file to run it. I left a several of my projects in the projekts folder. This 2.00 version is great as you can see the shape of the box and where all the drivers are located. It also handles 20 drivers so I can model larger designs now. I made a few designs that are omni-directional. It's interesting to see how the radiation pattern changed as the box size is changed between the three projects.
Last edited:
The Visaton link works at least for us in EU. You can also try download from the Boxsim homepage:
http://www.boxsim.de/
http://www.boxsim.de/
When I have downloader it I have just found it with google. Links directly to apps don't always work as things may get moved around on servers.
I've tried adding the special chassis volt and amp meters to a project. I added an extra chassis to the project but boxsim refused to accept them. Additional speakers can be added to a project this way but not the special chassis. I assume there must be some way of using them but I haven't a clue how.
Appart from that Boxsim isn't too difficult to use even for the clueless
.
Similar seems to work on V2. No FR IMP button It loads it as in box as designed and complains when that is changed to infinite baffle but then just complains about no position on baffle so I added one.
Thanks but just one more question. I attached a voltmeter to a driver. It shows volts loss due to the crossover and goes to 50dB at the high pass point. The loss due to the crossover is shown as 5dB. It that a direct scale? In other words 5/50 times 2.83volts or what?
Being an electronics man I hope it's not -5dB as wouldn't have a clue what that means in actual volts. I assume the ammeter displays in the same fashion,