Fullrange bass

[Scottmoose]

Personally I'd use a couple of 15in units per channel, good as you can afford, XO at 500Hz. Should do a decent job.

 

[régine's]

you are absolutely right

 

[c2cthomas]

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=110583&perpage=25&pagenumber=1
This is the link to the OB project that Panomaniac did (you asked about it in post #14). I once saw one of his post where he responded in French - so perhaps he speaks your language.

 

[régine's]

Oh thank you I do speak english, german, french and do understand spanish
very nice from you
4 x 12' will do the job Pyle or Ciare Cts high and fs low
or even 4 x 10'

 

[régine's]

found this

Eminence

ALPHA-12A

THIELE & SMALL PARAMETERS
Resonant Frequency (fs) 49Hz
DC Resistance (Re) 6.3
Coil Inductance (Le) 0.79mH
Mechanical Q (Qms) 6.53
Electromagnetic Q (Qes) 0.88
Total Q (Qts) 0.77
Compliance Equivalent Volume (Vas) 121.5 liters / 4.3 cu. ft.
Peak Diaphragm Displacement Volume (Vd) 125cc
Mechanical Compliance of Suspension (Cms) 0.32mm/N
BL Product (BL) 8.5 T-M
Diaphram Mass inc. Airload (Mms) 33 grams
Efficiency Bandwidth Product (EBP) 56

a nice QTS low fs and not $$ in Germany 48 Euro

could use not my idea 4 on the baffel really low and two on the hinges right and left low to give the beast stand. Apr 1.3m high the Manger on his round baffel sitting on the main baffel. The Manger out of center in another wood essence could look really nice

 

[régine's]

and than this one a car speaker

PYLE Pli 1090 Bl 1290 Bl
Fs 26.9 hz 23.2 hz
Qms 5.23 4.92
Qes 0.89 0.84
Qts 0.76 0.72
SPL (db) 83.5 85
Vas (cuft) 2.394 4.908

both the emminece or one of the Pyle will do the trick

which one hm ??????

 

[c2cthomas]

Perhaps you will find this of interest: http://www.lampizator.eu/SPEAKERS/PROJECTS/P19/P19 alnico open baffle.html BTW - all of my friends in high school used to kid me about looking like Capt. Nelson

 

[el`Ol]

and than this one a car speaker

PYLE Pli 1090 Bl 1290 Bl
Fs 26.9 hz 23.2 hz
Qms 5.23 4.92
Qes 0.89 0.84
Qts 0.76 0.72
SPL (db) 83.5 85
Vas (cuft) 2.394 4.908

both the emminece or one of the Pyle will do the trick

which one hm ??????

12dB difference in sensitivity means you need 16 times the power to do the same job.

 

[el`Ol]

I am interested in the topic myself, so I calculated the Fs/Qe values of several drivers in order to estimate their "strength" in relation to their moving mass.
My results:
The Alpha 10A is the record holder.
The Delta 15B is as strong as the Ciare 10"ers.
The Alpha 12A is not stronger than the Beta Beta 15A and the Selenium.

 

[el`Ol]

I just found out in a car hifi forum that this value is called "EBP", and an EBP<60 is the correct criterion for free-air use, not Qts>0.6. So a "strong OB driver" is a contradiction in itself. Horn drivers typically have an EBP around 200.
The only Manger setup I have heard is Manfred Scheu´s setup (can be found in the Manger DIY zone) with Manger satellites and Klipschorn subs. I couldn´t hear any bass integration problems. The Klipsch La Scala doesn´t go that low, but is easier to build and has exactly the right dimensions for adding the semicircular Manger baffle.
My advice: OB drivers are inexpensive, try them in test baffles, and when you are not pleased, there are plans for the La Scala in the web.


Oliver

 

[régine's]

Thanks a lot my dear
I do think, I put the project on hold for a moment as.
Yes a la Scala is good, but soon moving to the other half of the globe
a smalish frugal or something like this would be less less problematic

 

[hm]

"which one hm ??????"

1.
cut a manger at 500 Hz, crossover works in the most used oktave
1 oktave below and above the Kammerton a 440 Hz,
you get a lot of area of the bass driver, and different:
acceleration
material
prinzip!! bending wave driver

thats why i prefer a cut latest at 150 Hz.

2.
fast bass you can reach "only"with low membran movement,
thats why i prefer the new double horns.
inertia of big drivers is my problem if the membran must move.
A horn dominates the driver, every other bass construction uses
the driver reso.
http://www.rsl-horn.de/theorie/baesse/index.htm
sorry in german, more or less my opinion.

3.
bass is the slowest part of music,
our ear-brain "hears" a ~40 Hz tone from the 4 wave on,
the tone is now 34 m or ~100 msec on the run, reflecting in
your room before you get it as a tone.
so a delay of 8 msec by a bass horn is academic,
the win by the horn much more important as a not
listenable delay:

wiki also in english.
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gesetz_der_ersten_Wellenfront
for PA but
http://www.sengpielaudio.com/Haas-Effekt.pdf


4.
your are in a dilemma,
strong motor fast bass high BL to get the Manger doesn´t work
in OB
a OB driver has most low BL........ 1.