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New to FLAC files, need advice
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Old 13th September 2021, 10:22 PM   #31
haiqu is offline haiqu  Australia
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New to FLAC files, need advice
Quote:
Originally Posted by jean-paul View Post
The app for an Ipad:

OPPO UDP-20X MediaControl on the App Store

So there is no need to turn on the TV neither when playing back FLAC DVD disks nor with playing back files from the NAS/USB. The only way to get used to this is by stowing away the IR remote in a place you don't find it back easy. After a week you will not even look for it provided the Oppo app runs fine. This way of controlling devices is standard in 2021 with most audio players/streamers and although they're all equal some are more equal than others

You're welcome, Haiqu! Glad to help you out.
Thanks JP, that's a very useful suggestion and I do happen to have an iPad lying around so may give it a shot eventually.

My immediate need for reference material for testing will still have to rely on original discs though, since copying to HDD loses too much subtle information for my liking.

See An Experiment in Digital Audio
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Old 13th September 2021, 10:23 PM   #32
haiqu is offline haiqu  Australia
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Originally Posted by twocents View Post
haiqu, nothing to contribute here - but great to see another Sugar Man / Rodriguez fan! Sweet memories of my student days.
Some of us in Australia had heard the same crazy rumours about him. That movie was brilliant, I had always wondered what the real story was.
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Old 14th September 2021, 06:02 AM   #33
jean-paul is offline jean-paul  Netherlands
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haiqu View Post
copying to HDD loses too much subtle information for my liking.
That is simply not true. If things are done the correct way and played back on the right devices that is. Also you don't have enough experience with various dedicated devices to conclude that music from HDD/SSD is worse than optical disk. That your specific setup and methods may be the exception not the rule.
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Old 15th September 2021, 03:28 AM   #34
linuxfan is offline linuxfan  Australia
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haiqu, I see from this post and others on the forum that you are "skilling up" in the area of audio file management and playback. I commend your knowledge-gathering efforts in this regard.
But please, be very, very careful with your "experiments" and what you pass off as results from such - because the scope of your test conditions has been quite narrow, and in some cases completely flawed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by haiqu View Post
I can also save them (FLAC's) to a DVD as data files and use the TV as a menu to play them (ex Oppo UDP-203) but the playback is mighty weird. Specifically, the two channels are out of time with each other
Oops, it turns out there was no file playback issue - just the TV's sound turned up as a secondary audio output.

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Originally Posted by haiqu View Post
if you don't believe that digital information is changed in the process of copying it ...
Yeah I don't believe it. Neither do the IT consultants I work with.

Quote:
Originally Posted by haiqu View Post
... I challenge you to make a copy of an HDCD disc and see if it lights the HDCD indicator on your player.
Oops, you later beat your own challenge. So the initial experiment, or assertion, was flawed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by haiqu View Post
I used Checkfield's "A View From The Edge" which is an excellent recording. I found the results of ripping that to HDD and replaying across the network to be very similar, maybe 97-98% the same as the original. There was a little more space around individual instruments with the CD but it was a hard call to say they were different, and it would take a very well-trained ear to pick it in a double-blind test.
OK, that's a fair and credible observation. Interesting to note that optical disc playback was only slightly better than ex HDD. But be aware that your result is limited to your test conditions. You cannot know, and should not claim, that this result applies universally. I can think of several technical reasons why the Oppo may do a better job of playing back digital information from its optical drive, than from an audio file on a hard drive or network drive - particularly in terms of how the digital data is buffered ...
but many/most of us who use audio file playback don't use an Oppo, and in many cases these devices are tested and optimised for audio file playback. Examples:
- Raspberry Pi's, with various reclocking methods and DAC's, such as from iancanada.
- ALLO DigiOne, and BOSS2 player.
- Twisted Pear Cronus.
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Old 15th September 2021, 03:43 AM   #35
linuxfan is offline linuxfan  Australia
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Regarding the Sting Sacred Love SACD which you ripped/extracted ("converted" is incorrect) to .dff files -
An experiment in digital audio
if these .dff files sound only "5/10" as good as the SACD disc playback, then there's clearly a significant configuration problem, or the Oppo has a fault reading .dff files, or the test method was flawed.
Think about it - the (DSD) digital information which is read from the SACD disc is identical to the information in the .dff files.
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Old 16th September 2021, 01:49 AM   #36
haiqu is offline haiqu  Australia
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Originally Posted by linuxfan View Post
Regarding the Sting Sacred Love SACD which you ripped/extracted ("converted" is incorrect) to .dff files -
An experiment in digital audio
if these .dff files sound only "5/10" as good as the SACD disc playback, then there's clearly a significant configuration problem, or the Oppo has a fault reading .dff files, or the test method was flawed.
Think about it - the (DSD) digital information which is read from the SACD disc is identical to the information in the .dff files.
Yeah, OK I've obviously made a few errors due to unfamiliarity with the (new to me) formats and admitted them. However, the above statement is pure nonsense. There is a major stupidity amongst audiophiles that digital information is immutable. I challenge that opinion.

When you're dealing with SACD or DVD-A it's 24-bit data. Those last few bits represent very low levels of information, and the slightest clock jitter or power supply ripple can affect it. There is no SACD equivalent of Exact Audio Copy so the results of ripping them are digitally unverified.

If this were not true, any transport played via the digital output through a reference DAC - and thus eliminating the analog stages commonly believed to be the sole cause of "character" - would sound identical. Why, therefore, do we pay a premium for the better ones?

Think it through, dude.

I may be out-of-date but I have almost 40 years as a computer hardware engineer behind me, and was an advisor on digital matters to Allen Wright BEFORE he started building mods to SACD players. I'm not asking for respect for old achievements per se, but I do ask that my statements aren't so blithely disregarded either. There is something going on, and I can hear it.

If Blind Freddie had an audio counterpart, I'd say even Deaf Ernie could hear it. Don't be like Deaf Ernie, do the tests.
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Last edited by haiqu; 16th September 2021 at 01:53 AM.
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Old 16th September 2021, 02:02 AM   #37
haiqu is offline haiqu  Australia
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Originally Posted by jean-paul View Post
That is simply not true. If things are done the correct way and played back on the right devices that is. Also you don't have enough experience with various dedicated devices to conclude that music from HDD/SSD is worse than optical disk. That your specific setup and methods may be the exception not the rule.
I'm glad that you consider my results exceptional. ;-)

I set up the QNAP NAS and the iPad yesterday, it will be handy for listening in the upstairs bedrooms, where I don't intend to install full systems. I've also thrown my BDP-105D into the main system for the moment, since it both plays HDCD (which the UDP-103 doesn't) and it's analog stage is so blatantly coloured that any differences in sound are nicely masked.

Perhaps that's how you prefer to listen to music, but for serious design work it comes right out again.
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Old 16th September 2021, 04:40 AM   #38
linuxfan is offline linuxfan  Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haiqu View Post
I'm not asking for respect for old achievements per se, but I do ask that my statements aren't so blithely disregarded either.
You misread or misinterpreted my posts. I said that most of your statements may be true in your test conditions, but cannot (and should not) be stated as universally true. That's not disregard. That's clarifying and refining a broad concept.

Unfortunately, though, your most recent post has now veered off into wild territory. Some of the stuff about DAC's and "character" have nothing to do with the issues that I addressed in my previous 2 posts.

And I would like to help clear up some of the stuff I just read about SACD ... but I'm concerned that your "tests" have given you some pearls of wisdom that you will not wish to give up.
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Old 16th September 2021, 10:07 AM   #39
jean-paul is offline jean-paul  Netherlands
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+1

As in post #10.
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Old 16th September 2021, 10:14 AM   #40
MikePP is offline MikePP
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Quote:
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So, I made a few drink coasters so far. :-)

Confucious says always use RW media when experimenting
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