You see to drive a Pair of Speakers in a normal way, nobody is listening always with a 100Watts RMS - A cable with at 4 -6mm Square Millimeter is more than enough.
A cable with 6SQmm can take easy up to 25 Ampere.. no problem there..So if you take a Cable with 8sqmm then you are on the safe side,.,. length should net be over 5meter.
100Watts equals 28.25Volts into 8Ohm at 3.56Amps.. so now you will see that this cable is more than enough to connect the speaker to the amp.
But,.when the voice coil is pulled into the Magnet then resistance = OHM will go down, it's not for every speaker the same, some more and some less, depends on the magnet, the voice coil of course, what wire has been wound, how thick the wire is, and how many rounds have been wound and also the diameter of the Voicoil is important.
Is the Magnet a regular Magnet or does it use Ferrofluid and more..
But if this happen while listening to music just for a short period of time, nothing will happen, but if you drive that amp for a longer time, then the Amp has to deliver more POWER than the 100 watts into 8Ohm.
100Watts @2ohm needs about 14.15Volts RMS . But this will be 7Ampere no more 3.56 and so on.. Good amps will take this easy, bad amps will burn the speakers..
Also to drive a pair of speakers there is no need cables thick like arms or legs.. the current don't flow faster or slower.. it will have the speed according to the material used..
And all cables have resisitance and Capacistance.. no way around that one..
About transistors why the pins have the same size..I can't tell you, when I was a young guy, back that time I have seen this.. there are still a few devices out there but not for Audio but for Control units, motorcontrols. Check out Triacs and the huge DIODE. those still have different size Pins.. No need in Audio.
Chris
A cable with 6SQmm can take easy up to 25 Ampere.. no problem there..So if you take a Cable with 8sqmm then you are on the safe side,.,. length should net be over 5meter.
100Watts equals 28.25Volts into 8Ohm at 3.56Amps.. so now you will see that this cable is more than enough to connect the speaker to the amp.
But,.when the voice coil is pulled into the Magnet then resistance = OHM will go down, it's not for every speaker the same, some more and some less, depends on the magnet, the voice coil of course, what wire has been wound, how thick the wire is, and how many rounds have been wound and also the diameter of the Voicoil is important.
Is the Magnet a regular Magnet or does it use Ferrofluid and more..
But if this happen while listening to music just for a short period of time, nothing will happen, but if you drive that amp for a longer time, then the Amp has to deliver more POWER than the 100 watts into 8Ohm.
100Watts @2ohm needs about 14.15Volts RMS . But this will be 7Ampere no more 3.56 and so on.. Good amps will take this easy, bad amps will burn the speakers..
Also to drive a pair of speakers there is no need cables thick like arms or legs.. the current don't flow faster or slower.. it will have the speed according to the material used..
And all cables have resisitance and Capacistance.. no way around that one..
About transistors why the pins have the same size..I can't tell you, when I was a young guy, back that time I have seen this.. there are still a few devices out there but not for Audio but for Control units, motorcontrols. Check out Triacs and the huge DIODE. those still have different size Pins.. No need in Audio.
Chris
Hi and thanks a lot again. I am not very obsessed at least with speaker wires ... a little more with banana plugs. I love these type
they have a large contact surface i guess. Very nice.
it is just the Ohm law. The section size should follow the current flowing through. In some amps actually i see high current traces bigger than the signal ones ... i would do that thicker not only wider ... i like the idea of the debottlenecking at least for the wires going to the speakers outs
Thank you very much again
Kind regards, gino
the text below you can find on Kimber Cable website.. but fist a question to you.. how you keep noise out of a cable..? I would shield it..
A LEGACY IN THE MAKING
In the mid '70s Ray Kimber worked at a sound and lighting company in Los Angeles. The first big discotheques were being installed at that time. Traditionally sound and lighting systems were not installed right next to each other, nor did lighting systems ever have such an array of noise generating fixtures, such as strobes and other flashing and dimmable lights. But in a discotheque the lights and speakers are installed next to each other. The speaker cable was acting as an antenna array and bringing noise from the lights into the sound system.
In an attempt to solve the problem they encased the speaker cable in a steel conduit. This did help with the noise, but it also had the unintended result of lowering the fidelity of the audio. This happened because the steel conduit interacted with the magnetic field of the speaker cable.
Ray had the idea of some counter-rotating sets of conductors to cancel the magnetic interaction effect, but then also surmised that the counter-rotating sets of conductors would likely not pick up noise even without the conduit. He was correct, the noise was greatly reduced! But, Ray was also quite surprised at the difference in perceived audio quality. It was that discovery of noise elimination and improved fidelity that set him on the path to develop cable designs.
To his great satisfaction the finalized version of his braided wire concept not only rejected the (RF) noise, but allowed the system to sound different, better. It was after this period of discovery that Ray decided to take a risk and began entertaining the idea of selling his new discoveries.
He hit the road with a few spools of cable and some modest test equipment. He first showed that there was a testable difference in cables and then would do a simple "before and after" test, replacing regular speaker cables with Kimber Kable. For these tests Ray would choose the most modest system in the dealer showroom. The result was very obvious - it made a significant difference.
Over the years Ray would continue to test various metals as conductors, assorted manufacturing protocols, assorted stranding sizes, different twist lengths and insulation, as well as methods for adhering insulation to cable. All the time improving, modifying, and expanding upon his original cable concept and design.
No factory wants to make and stock a "just right" pin for EVERY different purpose.
And very short connections do not melt as easy as long wires.
And frequently a "just right" size for the current is much too small for mechanical stresses.
Transistors have about two "pin sizes".
thin wire leads for up to about 2 Amperes (TO-5, TO-92)
pin leads for 20 Amperes and more (TO-3, TO-220)
Yes, a TIP120 can have 10 Amps in the Emitter lead and 0.002 Amps in the Base lead, similar sizes. But how much metal could be saved by shaving the base lead down to a hair? How many pennies is that?
i can understand shield on a signal cable ... but on a speaker cable much less. An antenna can pick up RF noise but need also an amplification stage downstream. The speakers are passive units ... they do not amplify anything.
Instead phono cables can cause noise if not shielded.
Am i wrong ?
Hi ! thanks a lot for the very valuable advice. I did not know that.
So shielding them has a reason. It is quite rare but ... shielded power cables are more common from what i understand.
For low level signals i would use shielded cable.
And if it were not, BELDEN (and ALL other serious cable manufacturers around the World) would be out of business.
Mmmmhhhh, who do I believe? ... who do I believe?
10.000 cable manufacturers making Millions of cables weekly around the World since forever or a lone snake oil salesman catering to the insecure?
Look at my eyes:
prepare for the worst and hope for the best ... i guess that benign environments are hardly the norm with a lot of noise sources around (like badly shielded smps ?)
There is always a scope to check not only the effect of a shield but also its execution quality
I have the feeling that some shielded cables have poorly executed shields.
A good brand is Canare for me. I have opened one and the shield is impressively built very tight wires ... but i did not measure anything.
I made with it a headphone extension cable of 3 meters with Neutrik connectors. The sound with the extension in and out was absolutely the same. Completely transparent. Great cable indeed.
Classic Telephone wires are miles long, typically twisted and unshielded; phone to wall and even house terminal block to street distribution block is typically parallel wire , untwisted, unshielded., and they get away with it.
BUT: signal level is high, impedance is 600 ohm and to boot signal is balanced
Plus typical bandwidth used to be 250-2500Hz and in any case cheesy tiny transducers reproduced VERY poorly frequencies outside that narrow band, so they didn´t even "play" hum, hiss, most buzz, etc. and to boot very low SPL means Fletcher Munson also helps reduce outside of band noises.
IF you are happy with that sound quality and level, yes, shield is unnecessary.
FWIW when I am at the woodshop with the table saw running (you can hear it from the street or 2-3 houses away) I listen to Music typically through "any" (Guitar) amplifier I have lying around connecting Smartphone or Tablet headphone out (200 mV 32 ohm impedance) through a piece of *speaker* cable: parallel and untwisted, yet have no hum/buzz problems.
And IF I had, ambient noise + hearing protectors smash it for good.
Of course, NONE of that applies to Audiophile settings such as Kimber caters to.
I bet the Audio source driving that barely twisted cable is a DAC putting out 2V RMS out of 100 ohm internal impedance or a 1V Preamp signal out, about same impedance.
Those are BENIGN conditions and even straightened coat hanger wire will do.
For me the word shield means: As soon it helps to protect something which is behind that "shield" the we might call it a shield..
Bad or Good Example.. The magnetic Shield of the Earth keeps Sun Eruptions out of our World.. nobody has ever seen that shield and still it protects us..
PRR said it very well:"Sometimes a parallel grounded wire cuts room hum enough"
I think the question here is, how we define the WORD "shield"..
It can be almost anything, as long as it protects and does it job tor which is was designed..
Bad or Good Example.. The magnetic Shield of the Earth keeps Sun Eruptions out of our World.. nobody has ever seen that shield and still it protects us..
PRR said it very well:"Sometimes a parallel grounded wire cuts room hum enough"
I think the question here is, how we define the WORD "shield"..
It can be almost anything, as long as it protects and does it job tor which is was designed..
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Does your 'scope pay for enjoying your sound system?? (If you pay for it, why not try YOUR ears?)
A wire has to be mighty bad to dirty-up a headphone signal.
Classic Telephone wires .....IF you are happy with that sound quality and level, yes, shield is unnecessary....a piece of *speaker* cable: parallel and untwisted, yet have no hum/buzz problems.
Live performance recordings to a fairly high standard (university students' parents pay a lot so the recordings have to be unobjectionable). As YOU go on to say, appropriate termination is just good hygiene. 100 feet UN-balanced cable around dimmers and another 100 feet to the building electric closet (400A breakers), small gain at the microphone, even the elevator surge didn't corrupt the recording.
You are right ... but i read too much about debottlenecking that i am become obsessed by too small wires. Mostly in power amp. I cannot stand thin wires to speakers or to bring power to the output devices. Speaking of headphones (i love them) i have seen people rewiring them internally. In my case it was just a 1st diy work to learn how to solder jacks.
And it worked
this is not very scientific ... ears are limited. I have them checked not long ago and the result was decent for a 59 man
I did not get the full report but i am afraid i do not hear higher frequencies.
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