I am really grateful for the test, many thanks for the hardwork and time involved !!!
My interpretation of the test data is different though. But the result will stay here regardless of my/other interpretation, from there many things can be learned, that benefits many people.
My interpretation of the test data is different though. But the result will stay here regardless of my/other interpretation, from there many things can be learned, that benefits many people.
"Most of us" means "more than 50% of us". Can you guess what it is (the decibel threshold) for those in the 90th percentile of the population who can hear better? 0.1dB? 🙂
The key is actually in distortion spectrum (valve amps have second order distortion, solid states have higher order distortion). Second order is not so bad (but often preferred by some), very high order is evil. Of course it is not mentioned in any old books.
I'm glad Jon didn't re-discover that the earth is actually flat hehe..
As easy as 1, 2, 3.
Combine with a thorough design and season with good construction. You can't buy better 😉
Resonance phnomena are non lti and cannot be eq'd out. Same for all CSD aberrations.
Reason is that with resonance, energy is stored, and system's output becomes dependant on preceding state of system.
Linear resonance phenomena are definitely LTI. For example, mass-spring systems at small signal conditions...
In other words: if the impulse response is all that is needed to fully describe the system then it is LTI.
In other words: if the impulse response is all that is needed to fully describe the system then it is LTI.
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The huge difference here, is that we have something down-to-earth. A real test, with real humans, with real-life listening conditions (speakers, equipement, music, etc..).
Even the mono + 4 octave or so bandwith is somewhat very real for most non-audiophile people who listens to their iPad or computer's speakers 😉
My whole point here is that ''high-end'' audiophile Hifi market is based on pure illusions. Wheter or not it was proven in the 20th century doesn't matter.... Actually, it's worse: it means the illusions kept living and growing like some sort of cancer. Without anything stopping it. I sure didnt get the memo when i walked in a boutique for the first time...
I see no equivalent in any other ''luxury'' market, even the highly subjective wine market.
That alone says a lot.
Watches falls into ''Jewelry'', not the same IMO.
High-end watchmakers can push the ''my watch is more precise than yours'' only up to a certain point, until it becomes completely ridiculous.
But on the high-end HiFi market, there is nothing to stop the ridiculousness to go on and on.
High-end watchmakers can push the ''my watch is more precise than yours'' only up to a certain point, until it becomes completely ridiculous.
But on the high-end HiFi market, there is nothing to stop the ridiculousness to go on and on.
And thank you for the "Thank you"! 🙂
The trouble is, we have forgotten that wheels existed, and nobody living now is smart enough to re-invent one, so we're dragging sleds around in the dirt instead. 😀
That was a joke, but I think the core idea is true: science is no longer "cool" among the general population, and for a while now, we seem to have been living in an era when superstition is on the rise, and many actually discard what the scientific method tells us, and instead believe the advertisers, the vested interests, and the lunatic fringe.
-Gnobuddy
There is a deeply buried human tendency to believe "I am special, I am different from all the others."
It isn't true, though. Just a part of the normal madness of the normal human brain. Take it seriously at your peril - that way lies narcissism, and megalomania, and belief in the "master race", and all sorts of other horrible stuff.
No, you can't hear a 0.1 dB difference. I'll believe otherwise when you participate in a well controlled double-blind test, along with at least a hundred other subjects, and prove that 10% of them can in fact detect 0.1 dB changes at a statistically significant rate.
Sounds good, but this is another nonsensical half-truth - it's very popular on the Internet, but is quite wrong, all the same.
Yes, 1 percent 5th harmonic distortion is more detectable than 1 percent 2nd harmonic distortion. But by the time you get to 0.1% total harmonic distortion, every harmonic is so low that nobody can hear it, no matter what harmonic it is.
And 0.1% is easily surpassed by even the cheapest amps these days. So no, you cannot hear the distortion from a 0.01% amp, no matter what order it might be.
Here is an analogy: you can easily taste a small amount of habanero chili in your dinner. But if I took that very hot chilli, and diluted it in a swimming pool full of water, could you detect it by tasting the water? What if I diluted it in a lake full of water? An ocean full?
Well, 0.0005% is a tiny bit of distortion diluted in an ocean full of clean sound. You cannot detect it, and neither can any other human.
Jon is actually using the scientific method, which disproved the older superstitious belief in a flat earth. There are a number of easily done experiments which show the earth isn't flat.
The belief in a flat earth came from subjectivists, people who trusted their own limited senses completely: "I look around, and the ground is flat, so the earth is obviously flat."
That was normal in the tens of thousands of years before the scientific method was created. Our ancestors were all superstitious and ignorant back then, because there was no alternative.
The tragedy is that many of us seem to want to return to that same superstitious condition now, centuries later.
-Gnobuddy
Despite some rumors slowly growing here, i am NOT a flat-earther.
... but i do enjoy some flat-EQ speakers now and then.
anyway, after living 10 years in Montreal with the potholes, you just can't believe earth is flat.
Yes, I agree 100%.
By the way, Bell Labs and others did do extensive testing with thousands of members of the general public who volunteered. Similarly, the BBC used to routinely administer some hearing-related tests to all job applicants. Even some of the early consumer audio companies conducted careful research to help them develop good products.
So there was, in fact, a large body of data collected from tests on ordinary people, and at least some of it was done using off-the-shelf audio equipment.
Agreed. I am quite convinced that superstition is much more appealing to the human mind than any results obtained from science. Quite literally, we instinctively prefer nonsense to reality. It's just the way our primate brains are wired.
With a lot of work, some of us can be trained to trust the science, and ignore the urge to become superstitious, a small percentage of the time.
But I think that is the best we can do, like a pilot who learns to trust her instruments and ignore what her inner ears are telling her when flying at night: "No, I'm not in a death spiral, the instruments show I'm flying straight and level."
But then, after she lands, she kisses her "lucky" scarf for getting her home safe and sound. 🙂
I wonder how many scientists play the lottery? 😀
-Gnobuddy
Mr. Gbobuddy, you're making way too much sense in your last couple of posts.
Good work! I couldn't agree more.
Good work! I couldn't agree more.
I believe in Science. Do you?
So that's your guess. It is not in any book you read, is it?
Don't forget that:
(1) THD is a cumulative measure.
(2) THD is a single frequency (you can make one good at 100Hz and bad at 10k and the opposite).
(3) We are talking about amplifier's THD, not distortion and intermodulation at acoustic level.
The original idea was: 1% valve amp THD was so good (non-existence of high order distortion), 1% class-B solid state was not (full of high order distortion). So the number should be smaller than 1%. IF you don't believe that, let's agree to disagree. If you believe that, can you propose the new number... 0.95% may be?
I have a friend in Poland who loves those scary-hot chillies, and even grows some of them.How about some 1M+ Scoville stuff, such as Bhut jolokia ?
I'm a chili wimp. An ordinary Habanero is more than enough to make me cry uncle. 😀
-Gnobuddy
An 'ordinary Habanero' should enough for most.
They score 350 000 Scovilles. A Jalapeño only scores 8000 to put things into perspective.
They score 350 000 Scovilles. A Jalapeño only scores 8000 to put things into perspective.
what midrange did you compare?
Did you put the drivers in an enclosure?
What amplification?
Can I bring my amps and speakers to montreal and have some listening sessions?
Did you put the drivers in an enclosure?
What amplification?
Can I bring my amps and speakers to montreal and have some listening sessions?