The materials cost in a $20k car is about $2k-$3k, which is about the same as in some $20k audio thing. The difference is that the car is mass produced, which cuts production costs dramatically.
I don"t think the parts cost of a $20k car is $2k-$3k.
The markup on cars is not that great, but they are built by volume.
Sold by volume and very competitive market so dealer markup is stuff all.
Profits are made on options/accessaries and massive on replacement parts.
Comparing porsche or farrari to audio? how..... Sit in peak hour traffic for an hour every day
and watch the Porsche/Farrari sit behind you all the way....
Hiend audio, dealers will sell for what they can, good markup.
People will pay what they can afford for a brand name, looks (their view) or perseved sound (even with mp3`s)
Think yourself lucky there's so much info on the net, and it's just up to you to learn and experiment and find what you like.
The markup on cars is not that great, but they are built by volume.
Sold by volume and very competitive market so dealer markup is stuff all.
Profits are made on options/accessaries and massive on replacement parts.
Comparing porsche or farrari to audio? how..... Sit in peak hour traffic for an hour every day
and watch the Porsche/Farrari sit behind you all the way....
Hiend audio, dealers will sell for what they can, good markup.
People will pay what they can afford for a brand name, looks (their view) or perseved sound (even with mp3`s)
Think yourself lucky there's so much info on the net, and it's just up to you to learn and experiment and find what you like.
Its not confined to speakers, I find some of the 'top' end hifi these days rather vulgar in its design, especially as some of these designs are merely to make the pieces heavier and look more expensive and exotic. Same goes for magic cables and super expensive fuses..
The reality is there must be a market for all this stuff or it wouldn't exist.
Agree
Yes, so much in a 20K car, so little in a 20K hifi by comparison.
Mass production and competition are what push car prices down and func / quality up.
They also make money on servicing and parts... Thank heavens hifi's don't wear in the same way.
I suppose if someone created drivers that were miles better than best today and had service intervals, we would accept a shorter life and service for the extra performance?
Hifi is a different world - I suppose the fact it has to sit in the living room and appease counts for a lot of the inexcusable pricing.
Yes, so much in a 20K car, so little in a 20K hifi by comparison.
Mass production and competition are what push car prices down and func / quality up.
They also make money on servicing and parts... Thank heavens hifi's don't wear in the same way.
I suppose if someone created drivers that were miles better than best today and had service intervals, we would accept a shorter life and service for the extra performance?
Hifi is a different world - I suppose the fact it has to sit in the living room and appease counts for a lot of the inexcusable pricing.
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NP
No problem - I agree with you.
I have only been able to hear my system in an unsuitable large other room - low ceiling, bare walls, over 70sqm.
It sounded better with about 40 bodies in it. a higher ceiling suitable furnishings and it would have been more interesting.
I do measure each stage dev and improve what's possible - you don't find hi-end manufacturers publishing individual driver freq SPL's, distortion, corssover points, in cab, in real rooms, from the listening seat do you...
One day - a mansion and several listening rooms - I'd love to have at least 3 rooms with different systems from key points in my life - to be able to go back and compare...
No problem - I agree with you.
I have only been able to hear my system in an unsuitable large other room - low ceiling, bare walls, over 70sqm.
It sounded better with about 40 bodies in it. a higher ceiling suitable furnishings and it would have been more interesting.
I do measure each stage dev and improve what's possible - you don't find hi-end manufacturers publishing individual driver freq SPL's, distortion, corssover points, in cab, in real rooms, from the listening seat do you...
One day - a mansion and several listening rooms - I'd love to have at least 3 rooms with different systems from key points in my life - to be able to go back and compare...
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because these ones are rather unique. How many people can make them?
How much costs a Steinway gran piano, and how much is the Steinway Lyngdorf full dipole system? Try to compare the mecanics involved and such..
A violin is actually much simpler than a stereo system. And to me, all the good violins can be tuned to sound very similar. People seem to have no problem with $100k violins, but a $20k speaker makes people downright angry at its very existence.
there was a time where i practiced my musical instrument (not violin) 10 hours a day to prepare for recitals, but i use violin as example because they are more expensive.
i never understood why people get so angry at expensive hi-fi yet revere even more expensive musical instruments.
Generally the revered musical instruments, have got there status with age. and revered more so by the muso's than general public.
For me, it's more the ability of the muso that's playing whatever instrument.
In the audience you don't see the brands.
One thing that has not been mentioned is the time it takes to develop a speaker. Lynn Olson has often stated that it takes a designer at least 6 months to properly dial in a speaker design. That amounts to a lot of costs in terms of building rental and other overheads, never mind the salary of a good designer like Lynn himself. I am sometimes surprised that the manufacturers selling 'cheaper' loudspeakers survive. You'd have to move. Quite a bit of volume to pay for R&D. That is also why something like the Ariel is such a bargain. If the Ariels had to sell commercially they would have been pretty expensive. We DIYers often forget the time it takes to finally dial in the sound, or some of us never really bother too. 
Now why speakers using a single fullrange driver of well-known source should cost so much is a bit beyond me.
Enjoy,
Deon
Now why speakers using a single fullrange driver of well-known source should cost so much is a bit beyond me.Enjoy,
Deon
Even top violinist's can't tell
Violinists can?t tell the difference between Stradivarius violins and new ones : Not Exactly Rocket Science
Violinists can?t tell the difference between Stradivarius violins and new ones : Not Exactly Rocket Science
Yup - this is why you need to bling it up to make it eys candy enough...
The super rich in need to know it cost that much for it to be of an interest at all. value for money in our terms is simply not relevant, as you say.
The super rich in need to know it cost that much for it to be of an interest at all. value for money in our terms is simply not relevant, as you say.
this could be actually true. I work in yachting and believe me, these super toys are seriously underdeveloped when it comes to sound. Sure, they have all the latest gadgets you can imagine and in terms of comfort it's all great, everything is touch button and instant, but would you believe me if most large boats worth over 40 millions do use tiny.... bose speakers at best, very often just standard in ceiling ones? Rarely have I seen decent systems there, let alone high end, it's a rarity. I don't know, maybe on yachts everything has to be so slick so they keep their real system home..
in case of a violin, maybe yes, but a good concert piano is very expensive, but still cheaper than some so called "high end speakers". Do these speakers reach true constant directivity, distorsion below 0.5% at realistic volume for any frequency, decent phase response and linearity within at least 0.5db without resonances? They don't, that's why their price is not justified. Good speakers could, and probably should be more expensive, but 50.000$ or more? Give me a break.
It's the same with wine, no wine on this planet whatever the quality cost more than 30$/bottle to be produced, all the rest is rarity, envy, placement strategy, ego flattering, etc etc etc..
And no, not everybody can make good instruments I am sorry. Ever played on a chinese or old soviet piano brand? I did. Try a Bosendorfer, a Petrof. Magic.
Running costs? Sure, probably. But on the other side you have guys like Linkwitz that can make great things at home, with no uber expensive equipment or facilities.
What a world..
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Microsofts co-founder Paul Allen has a number of boats and each contains a top-notch recording studio. He is also maintaing a band to play with when he feels like it and has a large collection of guitars used by Jimi Hendryx.
Probably no Bose on his boats!
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