Hi,
The reason I responded is that you mentioned metal domes and bi-polar output devices as if it were the only way to go to audio nirvana without being specific.
My experience with them makes me doubt that but I have not listened to everything on the planet.
No, I won't say Krell nor ML.
My experience is mostly with tube amps.
My preferred speakers are high(ish) efficiency ribbons for the mid and high frequencies but I won't limit my preferences to just that.
I certainly didn't mean to offend you.
Cheers,
The reason I responded is that you mentioned metal domes and bi-polar output devices as if it were the only way to go to audio nirvana without being specific.
My experience with them makes me doubt that but I have not listened to everything on the planet.
No, I won't say Krell nor ML.
My experience is mostly with tube amps.
My preferred speakers are high(ish) efficiency ribbons for the mid and high frequencies but I won't limit my preferences to just that.
I certainly didn't mean to offend you.
Cheers,
I agree that electronic music can be demanding for a system. It can therefore be used to test some properties of a system.
But do you really believe one can judge how accurately a system reproduces sound, when the source of the test signal is an artificial one, of which nobody ever will know how it actually should sound, simply because it has never existed in acoustical form ?
But if this judgement is O.k. for YOU, then go for it. That's simply due to the fact that everybody has to judge by himself what sounds good to him.
Regards
Charles
Hey, i was not offended.. just a bit taken. Because i said that kind of a system doesn't necesseraly sound the most enjoyable but (i think) lets you listen the most critically. I never said it would be less fatiguing or more pleasing than a tube amp - because that's what a lot of people see as audio nirvana. But when music is mixed in a studio, on studio monitors, usually the sound is *not* of absolute pleasing quality and you would never want to listen constantly for hours and hours because it would get tiring. Sound engineering is not a relaxing, easygoing job. It takes focus and energy and it drains you. All i'm saying is that the most accurate system will get you that sound like it was back in the studio, whether recorded on crappy equipment or great equipment, you get to hear exactly what the engineer was hearing. Most of those guys don't care about silky highs and bloomy midrange but rather the true core and essence of the recording, undressed and in your face.
This may or may not be a good thing too.. Everything that goes through a stereo is not supposed to sound good. The bad stuff should sound bad and the good stuff good. That way you hear everything for what it really is. And I did also say that i like chip amps. Because sometimes i don't want to hear everything for what it really is, because that is not a necessity in order to be able to enjoy music. But i think it's important to have that option. To have that tool.
And by the way, congradulations on the 8K post
Hi,
Sardonx,
I tend to agree with you and when I was running my own audio company, I strived for highest possible fidelity to the original recording.
Mainly because it served as a tool to asess other components.
Geee, you must have checked me out just before you posted this one....
Well, it's 8001 now...
Cheers and thx for the kind attention,
Sardonx,
I tend to agree with you and when I was running my own audio company, I strived for highest possible fidelity to the original recording.
Mainly because it served as a tool to asess other components.
Geee, you must have checked me out just before you posted this one....
Well, it's 8001 now...
Cheers and thx for the kind attention,
Well I opened up planet10's milestone post and saw that. That is a lot of posts!
Seems like a lot of of people on this forum have or at one point in time had audio companies of their own. This is a great forum.
As much as my posts seem solid state pro i would like to find a good tube amp too. Except i don't have the knowledge to build one, and i'm not sure i want to rake out that kidn of cash to buy one which is good.
Speakers, on the other hand, i can handle!
Seems like a lot of of people on this forum have or at one point in time had audio companies of their own. This is a great forum.
As much as my posts seem solid state pro i would like to find a good tube amp too. Except i don't have the knowledge to build one, and i'm not sure i want to rake out that kidn of cash to buy one which is good.
Speakers, on the other hand, i can handle!
Kelticwizard, Frank, and a few others have hit one of the critical points, which is to have a set of standards. It is terrifying to me how many people go through life without a touchstone.
Ever try to read a voltage when ground has come loose and is floating?
You need a reference point. The If-I-Like-It school of thought impresses people who are too lazy to check their grounds. Or, alternatively, lack of experience can lead to the same point of view. This leads to the endless repetition of stories about people who hear a good system (or live performance) for the first time, then go home and realize that their system is flawed. The key here is experience. The best teacher is live, unamplified music. For someone who lives in the middle of ten thousand square miles of wheat fields, it may not be possible to hear a jazz performance, or classical, or bluegrass...but that doesn't mean that the standard isn't there waiting for them if they ever get a chance to travel.
One of the things that I used to tell people who seemed to truly want to educate their ears was to go to a live, unamplified performance, and pretend that it was a really big, elaborate stereo. Is the treble a bit recessed? The bass a little shy? Often it is compared to what they're used to. But guess which one is right...hint...it isn't the stereo.
"But I like it sounding that way!" people cry.
It's your right to make your system sound any way you want, but don't confuse that with 'right' in the sense of agreement with reality. One of the problems we face these days is that many people are unable to tell the difference between relatives and absolutes (for instance, at least one moderator has difficulty with the concept that 'safe' is relative, not absolute--want to be absolutely safe? can't be done. even if you stay in bed a meteorite might hit your house.). More to the point, they are unable to see why there should even be any such thing as absolutes.
Should any one person be designated the final arbiter of what sounds good? No. But a common framework will enable all to determine for themselves--with a little effort--whether something is indeed "good." (Basically, the same point Wizard made earlier, wherein he used the English language as an analogy. A good choice. Ever tried to talk to someone who insisted on using a word in a non-standard way? It's difficult to even think clearly when words have no set meaning. [Shades of Orwell's 1984.])
"But I listen to electronic music!"
Think of a mirror. Do you want a flat, truthful mirror, or do you want a bent, twisted funhouse mirror? A fat man who looks in a convex mirror will see himself as thinner than he really is. Perhaps this pleases him. But is it intellectually honest? Nope. Even if all you really like is electronic music, become familiar with the sound of a couple of acoustic instruments. Use them to evaluate your system. No one says you have to like the music--just think of it as a type of test instrument. Set your mirror to flat using that as a standard, and rest assured that anything else you see in your mirror will be very close to correct, indeed.
Besides, you might find that you like other types of music...and wouldn't that be nifty?
Grey
Ever try to read a voltage when ground has come loose and is floating?
You need a reference point. The If-I-Like-It school of thought impresses people who are too lazy to check their grounds. Or, alternatively, lack of experience can lead to the same point of view. This leads to the endless repetition of stories about people who hear a good system (or live performance) for the first time, then go home and realize that their system is flawed. The key here is experience. The best teacher is live, unamplified music. For someone who lives in the middle of ten thousand square miles of wheat fields, it may not be possible to hear a jazz performance, or classical, or bluegrass...but that doesn't mean that the standard isn't there waiting for them if they ever get a chance to travel.
One of the things that I used to tell people who seemed to truly want to educate their ears was to go to a live, unamplified performance, and pretend that it was a really big, elaborate stereo. Is the treble a bit recessed? The bass a little shy? Often it is compared to what they're used to. But guess which one is right...hint...it isn't the stereo.
"But I like it sounding that way!" people cry.
It's your right to make your system sound any way you want, but don't confuse that with 'right' in the sense of agreement with reality. One of the problems we face these days is that many people are unable to tell the difference between relatives and absolutes (for instance, at least one moderator has difficulty with the concept that 'safe' is relative, not absolute--want to be absolutely safe? can't be done. even if you stay in bed a meteorite might hit your house.). More to the point, they are unable to see why there should even be any such thing as absolutes.
Should any one person be designated the final arbiter of what sounds good? No. But a common framework will enable all to determine for themselves--with a little effort--whether something is indeed "good." (Basically, the same point Wizard made earlier, wherein he used the English language as an analogy. A good choice. Ever tried to talk to someone who insisted on using a word in a non-standard way? It's difficult to even think clearly when words have no set meaning. [Shades of Orwell's 1984.])
"But I listen to electronic music!"
Think of a mirror. Do you want a flat, truthful mirror, or do you want a bent, twisted funhouse mirror? A fat man who looks in a convex mirror will see himself as thinner than he really is. Perhaps this pleases him. But is it intellectually honest? Nope. Even if all you really like is electronic music, become familiar with the sound of a couple of acoustic instruments. Use them to evaluate your system. No one says you have to like the music--just think of it as a type of test instrument. Set your mirror to flat using that as a standard, and rest assured that anything else you see in your mirror will be very close to correct, indeed.
Besides, you might find that you like other types of music...and wouldn't that be nifty?
Grey
Bingo!!...That remenber me "the closest aproach" sentence of Peter walker...for me to the unanplified live perfomance is the target!!
Happily i can hear many times live music ,as the boyfriend of my daughter, play cello in a local orchestra...and what can i say...
specialy the dinamic range is awesome!!!
I`ve wondered about who sets the standard?
Isn`t it somewhat subjective???
Everybody's hearing is different, I know I`ve messed up my hearing by listening to too much loud music when I was younger, so when will I know when I have a great sounding system?
Just curious.
If you have different audiences and they don't like the sound you produce then you don't have a great sound system. My point is, the judge would be the people around you - not just you. Hearing is different but when all people unite to make good compliments, you win.
As per my knowledge, there is nothing perfect loundspeaker for everybody. Everybody tastes differs when listening to sound. For as an example: somebody likes more bass or more treble or more dynamics while watching movies. And there is no speaker which perfect in frequency response, you will see lot dips and ups in frequency response. A high fidelity speaker will minimize size of dips and ups in frequency response in certain band of frequency. But it depends that every body will not like high fidelity speaker. Just ask yourself what sort of sound u like listening music or watching movie. And how much dynamics of sound is annoying for u.
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