what subwoofer driver to go with a Audience A3?

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erikb1971

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#1
Hi all

I came across a nice pair of Audience A3 drivers for a good price and I want to build a 2.1 nearfield monitoring system with them. The A3's will probably be housed in a 2L cabinet, with a 3,5" passive radiator in the back. Considering the fact that the enclosures are pretty small and I will not be able to place them near a wall, my guess is that they will have to be helped by a sub-woofer. How do you go about selecting a sub-woofer driver and enclosure for something like this? The only things I am pretty sure about are the starting points:

1. Since they will be near field monitors, the volume will not have to be deafening.
2. Again given the purpose, the frequency response should be as natural as possible
3. I have a budget of about 200 Euro (250 dollar) for the sub driver
4. Although technically I am not limited to a maximum enclosure size, smaller is more preferable.

So how impossible is that?

I would like to hear your suggestions, and if I may be bold: not just driver models (although of course also welcomed), but please also some kind of "direction of thinking" to help me make a good choice.

Thanks a lot in advance!
 
#2
As long as it is time aligned (think 6db crossovers) or run wide open but naturally rolling at 100-200hz, I'd use something sealed (qtc .707 or lower) or something tuned below 30hz. I'd go push pull (slot loaded) with some 8" drivers maybe.

Norman
 
#4
norman bates said:
As long as it is time aligned (think 6db crossovers) or run wide open but naturally rolling at 100-200hz, I'd use something sealed (qtc .707 or lower) or something tuned below 30hz. I'd go push pull (slot loaded) with some 8" drivers maybe.

Norman
Click to expand...

Oh man.. I feel like such a beginner.... I have absolutely no clue what you are talking about! Sorry! Could you please explain a bit for me?
 
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#5
quick reply

"Push-pull" means two woofers, one faces in and the other faces out, then you reverse the wiring on one unit so the cones move in the same direction.
You could do this with two enclosed volumes or mount the drivers so they are "kissing". Google "isobaric" subs to see the pic.
 
#9
the thing is... my budget is not going to double. And the two drivers will ask more from the amp as well right? So that means that you trade in half the volume against two 70 Euro drivers instead of one 200 Euro driver... I am afraid that will be hardly ever a goo solution with a fixed budget or do I see this wrongly?
 
#11
erikb1971 said:
Hi all

I came across a nice pair of Audience A3 drivers for a good price and I want to build a 2.1 nearfield monitoring system with them. The A3's will probably be housed in a 2L cabinet, with a 3,5" passive radiator in the back. Considering the fact that the enclosures are pretty small and I will not be able to place them near a wall, my guess is that they will have to be helped by a sub-woofer. How do you go about selecting a sub-woofer driver and enclosure for something like this? The only things I am pretty sure about are the starting points:

1. Since they will be near field monitors, the volume will not have to be deafening.
2. Again given the purpose, the frequency response should be as natural as possible
3. I have a budget of about 200 Euro (250 dollar) for the sub driver
4. Although technically I am not limited to a maximum enclosure size, smaller is more preferable.

So how impossible is that?

I would like to hear your suggestions, and if I may be bold: not just driver models (although of course also welcomed), but please also some kind of "direction of thinking" to help me make a good choice.

Thanks a lot in advance!
Click to expand...

direction in thinking, well... here's what i would do. First since you have the drivers for the Mid / HF side design and build them. I would not use passives with the nearfealds, they will muck up the crossover point time alignment, simple sealed boxes would be best. Then once the Mid/HF boxes are built measure them to see where they want to roll off. Then find the right driver to extend the system.

A low order passive crossover imposes the least delay to the signal at the crossover, if you have the ability to delay the mid/HF signal this becomes less of an issue, an active crossover is even better. As far as sub box design, I personally like the large low theory, ie. a driver that has a low Fs (below 25Hz) that likes to be in a large box tuned very low (~14Hz)

How large is the room this will be in?
 
#12
revboden said:
direction in thinking, well... here's what i would do. First since you have the drivers for the Mid / HF side design and build them. I would not use passives with the nearfealds, they will muck up the crossover point time alignment, simple sealed boxes would be best. Then once the Mid/HF boxes are built measure them to see where they want to roll off. Then find the right driver to extend the system.

A low order passive crossover imposes the least delay to the signal at the crossover, if you have the ability to delay the mid/HF signal this becomes less of an issue, an active crossover is even better. As far as sub box design, I personally like the large low theory, ie. a driver that has a low Fs (below 25Hz) that likes to be in a large box tuned very low (~14Hz)

How large is the room this will be in?
Click to expand...

Thanks! The room itself is 6m by 7m, but that is the whole livingroom. The aerea where I am making music is just let's say 20% of that, a large dinner table in a corner, speakers facing the wall / bookshelves floor to ceiling about 2 meters away.

Regarding the other remarks. The 2 liter enclosure with a passive radiator was recommended by someone from audience. If I get what you are saying, the radiator might cause problems with the subwoofer. So If I was to use them as true full range speakers, the passive radiator woul be a better idea? (although this might be better for the full range discussion threads)
 
#13
erikb1971 said:
Thanks! The room itself is 6m by 7m, but that is the whole livingroom. The aerea where I am making music is just let's say 20% of that, a large dinner table in a corner, speakers facing the wall / bookshelves floor to ceiling about 2 meters away.

Regarding the other remarks. The 2 liter enclosure with a passive radiator was recommended by someone from audience. If I get what you are saying, the radiator might cause problems with the subwoofer. So If I was to use them as true full range speakers, the passive radiator woul be a better idea? (although this might be better for the full range discussion threads)
Click to expand...

in a room that size you won't have any room gain support for the low frequencys so design as flat as possible.

I agree, I think using the passive is for that driver used as a true full range driver but with a subwoofer the passive is not needed. Well you could use the passive tuned well below the crossover point to keep group delay low at crossover but then you wouldn't be putting it to use... so never mind.
 
#14
I'll second the "don't use the PR"

To get good integration with the A3s you'll need a woofer with good upper extension -- most subs don't cut the mustard.

My goto driver for this kind of application is the CSS SDX7. You can still get them from Henjan, Juoigâ, a pair would stretch your budget a bit (a single Trio8 would do too, i see he still has them listed, Bob ran out of them a while ago). They do need an easy mod to smooth out the top end (makes them good to ~1.4 kHz). I use them sealed in 14-18 litres, and they are happy to take a bit of boost at 25 hz. I am currently using a pair in my room, and am quite happy with them. They won't do the explosions and train crashes but are very musical & integrate well.

dave
 
#16
planet10 said:
I'll second the "don't use the PR"

To get good integration with the A3s you'll need a woofer with good upper extension -- most subs don't cut the mustard.

My goto driver for this kind of application is the CSS SDX7. You can still get them from Henjan, Juoigâ, a pair would stretch your budget a bit (a single Trio8 would do too, i see he still has them listed, Bob ran out of them a while ago). They do need an easy mod to smooth out the top end (makes them good to ~1.4 kHz). I use them sealed in 14-18 litres, and they are happy to take a bit of boost at 25 hz. I am currently using a pair in my room, and am quite happy with them. They won't do the explosions and train crashes but are very musical & integrate well.

dave
Click to expand...

Thank you! I agree with you from past experience... I have this subwoofer Dayton Audio RSS210HF-4 8" Reference HF Subwoofer 4 Ohm 295-456 in a sealed 20 liter box for my home cinema set combined with a pair of anthony gallo nucleus speakers... and for TV and games it is fine... they even do some sort of explosions... but I always have the feeling that I would want to crossover higher than I can...

Would there be a sonic iffeence between two SDX7's or one trio 8?
 
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