Not sure if this test could works, as I said before the Ferrite,Alnico and Neo design requeriments are different each other.
An Ferrite driver will have bad sound with an Alnico magnet.
I think it would be impossible to generate identical magnetic fields with different magnetic materials. So the design/dimensions have to be quite different to have the same magnetic field strength.
fwiw there was quite a difference in "tone" going from a D140 to K140 bass guitar speaker and that was with a Traynor YBA-3 Custom Special amp - that alnico speaker had a more "bouncy" sound - have no idea whether either had good parameters as one was old and the E, reconed.
I don't think alnico in a motor guarantees good sound.
maybe a combination of good speaker design with alnico, SET, and full horn system or high sensitivity FR is one good way.
I don't think alnico in a motor guarantees good sound.
maybe a combination of good speaker design with alnico, SET, and full horn system or high sensitivity FR is one good way.
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Hi freddi, it's very amplifier dependent.
SS class AB with high feedback will be too much for PAPER alnico cones, the coil movement will be overly damped and the leading edge too dynamic with high current impulses.
This has consequences: one will only hear the dynamic and the decay and mid-signal will be blurred. Also the bass wont have time to properly damp itself between attacks. This will result in poor sound no matter if the SS amplifier is the best possible.
Take this SS amplifier on a ferrite magnet polypropylene cone and voila. Polypropylene can damper the current attack and restitute the sound message in between transitions.
The Class AB tube amplifier with low feedback is in between and can sound very smooth, less dynamic on poly cones/carbon/Kevlar.
SET has the less damping and the most delicate musical message, even paper drivers with ferrite magnets will not sound the best and this is puzzling, alnico is way better with SET.
SS class AB with high feedback will be too much for PAPER alnico cones, the coil movement will be overly damped and the leading edge too dynamic with high current impulses.
This has consequences: one will only hear the dynamic and the decay and mid-signal will be blurred. Also the bass wont have time to properly damp itself between attacks. This will result in poor sound no matter if the SS amplifier is the best possible.
Take this SS amplifier on a ferrite magnet polypropylene cone and voila. Polypropylene can damper the current attack and restitute the sound message in between transitions.
The Class AB tube amplifier with low feedback is in between and can sound very smooth, less dynamic on poly cones/carbon/Kevlar.
SET has the less damping and the most delicate musical message, even paper drivers with ferrite magnets will not sound the best and this is puzzling, alnico is way better with SET.
As I've also bought a JBL K140 speaker about 40 years ago, may I ask you which one has the AlNiCo magnet? I don't remember that it was specified in the K140 datasheet.
[qoute]I don't think alnico in a motor guarantees good sound.[/quote]
I also don't think so, as it isn't yet proven (by DBT's, of course).
Best regards!
A way to test these magnets in similar drivers could be listen some Audio Nirvana drivers as they use similar paper cones, alum baskets and suspensions:
Classic 5 FERRITE Specifications
Classic 6.5 FERRITE Specifications
Classic 8 FERRITE Specifications
Classic 8+ FERRITE Specifications
Classic 10 FERRITE Specifications
Classic 12 FERRITE Specifications
Classic 6.5 ALNICO Specifications
Classic 8 ALNICO Specifications
Classic 8+ ALNICO Specifications
Classic 10 ALNICO Specifications
This site is a big source of fullranges tests>
Glow in the Dark Audio--Tube Amps
Classic 5 FERRITE Specifications
Classic 6.5 FERRITE Specifications
Classic 8 FERRITE Specifications
Classic 8+ FERRITE Specifications
Classic 10 FERRITE Specifications
Classic 12 FERRITE Specifications
Classic 6.5 ALNICO Specifications
Classic 8 ALNICO Specifications
Classic 8+ ALNICO Specifications
Classic 10 ALNICO Specifications
This site is a big source of fullranges tests>
Glow in the Dark Audio--Tube Amps
How is it?
Do you think the Alnicos are not properly desingned?
This site say the Ferrite/Alnicos have different sound:
Glow in the Dark Audio - Audio Nirvana full range drivers
Do you think the Alnicos are not properly desingned?
This site say the Ferrite/Alnicos have different sound:
Glow in the Dark Audio - Audio Nirvana full range drivers
First a couple old Alnico threads that may be of interest:
Alnico versus ferrite Neodymium
AlNiCo vs. Neodymium
I compared the 8” drivers. You would expect a driver with an Alnico magnet to be more efficient but the Alnico 8” is significantly less efficient. I interpret this to mean they skimped on magnet material or did not properly redesign the motor structure leadin gto the conclusion (perhaps errant, i have not heard them) a marketing move, since Alnico has a certain cache.
dave
Alnico versus ferrite Neodymium
AlNiCo vs. Neodymium
I compared the 8” drivers. You would expect a driver with an Alnico magnet to be more efficient but the Alnico 8” is significantly less efficient. I interpret this to mean they skimped on magnet material or did not properly redesign the motor structure leadin gto the conclusion (perhaps errant, i have not heard them) a marketing move, since Alnico has a certain cache.
dave
This happen too with the Fostex, both the Nirvanas and Fostex F120A F200A have around the same SPL, so far I dont see a 99-100dB Alnico FR yet from current production.
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I have numerous speakers in my work space.
The loudest for a set voltage is a 1980's Fane 12-50WRMS speaker I picked up off ebay. Not sure what the magnet material is.
I suspect the drivers electrical efficiency have to do w/the cone and suspension damping treatment.
However these two drivers have the freq curve very strange all the way, I instantly noted the bass start to fall around 100Hz, the Super models are not like this:
http://www.commonsenseaudio.com/an12classicalnicospecs.jpg
http://www.commonsenseaudio.com/an15classicalnicospecs.jpg
However these two drivers have the freq curve very strange all the way, I instantly noted the bass start to fall around 100Hz, the Super models are not like this:
http://www.commonsenseaudio.com/an12classicalnicospecs.jpg
http://www.commonsenseaudio.com/an15classicalnicospecs.jpg
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Its Ferrite. Just found a picture of it before it was put in a folded horn cabinet.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
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This is some what usual in some FR, the praised Visaton B200 have the BL low.
On the Classic10Ferrite and Classic10Alnico data is possible see the motors propably use the same cone/suspension and different motors:
Same data are:
Cone Paper
Surround Fabric
Damper Conex
VC wire 0.21'' CCAW
Center Cap: Coating Fabric Dust Cap
The data that are different are:
VC diameter 35mm and 35.5mm
Magnet Ferrite and Alnico
Short Ring: Cu Cap and Alu Ring + Cu Cap
Above all this MMS is 19.9g and 22.3g its a small difference;
The Alnico electrical efficiency is low 1.27% and Ferrite is hi 2.56%
Maybe the Alnico gap is hi hence the low efficiency.
Same data are:
Cone Paper
Surround Fabric
Damper Conex
VC wire 0.21'' CCAW
Center Cap: Coating Fabric Dust Cap
The data that are different are:
VC diameter 35mm and 35.5mm
Magnet Ferrite and Alnico
Short Ring: Cu Cap and Alu Ring + Cu Cap
Above all this MMS is 19.9g and 22.3g its a small difference;
The Alnico electrical efficiency is low 1.27% and Ferrite is hi 2.56%
Maybe the Alnico gap is hi hence the low efficiency.
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