What is the Universe expanding into..

Do you think there was anything before the big bang?

  • I don't think there was anything before the Big Bang

    Votes: 56 12.5%
  • I think something existed before the Big Bang

    Votes: 200 44.7%
  • I don't think the big bang happened

    Votes: 54 12.1%
  • I think the universe is part of a mutiverse

    Votes: 201 45.0%

  • Total voters
    447
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For the Higgs, two separate teams were formed at CERN. They were not allowed to communicate or share data. They ran the experiments and each had to achieve 5 sigma agreement with the experimental hypothesis before announcing they had a result (or not as the case may have been). When both teams agreed, they could say ‘I think we have it!’ in true scientific understatement.
That's pretty tight control alright. What does the actual process consist of? I mean the "third party verification process", not the experimental one. Although even that is up for additional scrutiny. I just read about the 6 sigma neutrino fiasco apparently caused by faulty cables? Was there a third party investigation to determine whether it was in fact a cable issue? Lots of unanswered questions seem to abound when it comes to the activities of groups of people in cloistered settings. Transparency is one part of the process that appears to be lacking. Part of that problem has to be the difficulty of examining the findings from a non-participant point of view with the obvious limitations to deciphering the data. We simply have to trust a body of professionals' exclusive access to information without question. It's really up to them to find a way to verify their findings if they want to be believed. Right now it seems like having faith in a religion.
 
The problem is that the same team does the verifying. That would be okay if it wasn't for matters requiring the highest levels of education and intelligence the masses don't have.
Sorry to disagree. I think the problem is too many people simply have no willingness to acquire necessary knowledge for one reason on another. I am glad that progress does continue regardless.
Difficult though it may be for a non-scientist to accept.
Everybody who wants to learn can somehow build up his knowledge foundation and understanding in his own time. Progress is made by those who find some gap within current understanding.
 
We used to detect particles every month in Physics "A" Level. 🙂

Millikan's Oil drop experiment for electrons, which came in discrete chunks of "e" charge.

We'd bend electon paths in magnetic fields uses Helmholz Coils over a glorified cathode ray tube.

Cloud chamber to see inch long tracks of alpha particles (helium nuclei) produced by radioactive decay.

Lots of optics and photoelectric effect.

Mossbauer effect at College using radioactive iron isotopes, and some gamma ray spectrum stuff.

I never doubted what I was seeing, be it graphs and plots or real physical glows. Or clicks on a Geiger counter.

I can't remember if we did the famous Stern-Gerlach experiment which unlocks the quantum mysteries of the electron spin not commuting on the x and y axis. But a great experiment.
 
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We'd bend electron paths in magnetic fields using Helmholz Coils over a glorified cathode ray tube.
You haven't lived until you've measured the charge to mass ratio of an electron! 😉
 

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The problem is it takes an enormous amount of effort and an uncommon intelligence to be a leading scientist in a given field. I envy these people and I am jelous, but I respect them because when I look around at how we live today in terms of STEM that we take for granted, its because of these folk.

Its just too easy to dismiss science because an individual is intellectually lazy, or not equipped, to understand this it. I am 64, and remember kids popping off (at least one every 1-2 years at the schools I was at) from leukaemia. By the time my kids went to school it was rare and nowadays very rare.


Lots of other stuff as well. We don't get these huge changes by denying science.

🙂
 
Sorry to disagree. I think the problem is too many people simply have no willingness to acquire necessary knowledge for one reason on another. I am glad that progress does continue regardless.

Everybody who wants to learn can somehow build up his knowledge foundation and understanding in his own time. Progress is made by those who find some gap within current understanding.
You're speaking about some in attendance. The juggernaut of discovery pushes on no matter what, but the more history we leave behind the more questionable the discoverers become.



I have no trouble accepting proof, even when I can't personally verify it. There's power in numbers. However if you're watching the news lately, even that has come into question. It's a crazy world we're living in.
 
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