I'm intending on Building a Batch of very high-quaitly subwoofers i guess mainly for home-cinema usage but also the perform well in hi-fi application too.
Please could u submit lists of the quailties you would desire in a subwoofer i.e most important features, small/large dimensions, deep bass/accurate bass/loud bass/musical bass? how u tend to connect your subs, also ne suggestions for designs do these modern arty desgins appeal?
Just chuck ne thoughts or ideas u may have at me, ne thing and everything will be greatfull received.
Thanks
Dan.
Please could u submit lists of the quailties you would desire in a subwoofer i.e most important features, small/large dimensions, deep bass/accurate bass/loud bass/musical bass? how u tend to connect your subs, also ne suggestions for designs do these modern arty desgins appeal?
Just chuck ne thoughts or ideas u may have at me, ne thing and everything will be greatfull received.
Thanks
Dan.
Let me see.....
Large dimensions(if it doesnt sound big, at least it will look big)
deep bass
accurate bass
loud bass
musical bass
I connect my subs with the largest guage wire availabe, positive to the positive terminal and negitive to negitive terminal. Ohh and if its DVC always wire parellel for lower inductance and higher current draw.
how it looks, well ugly is the best(that way people will know it is hommade)
Large dimensions(if it doesnt sound big, at least it will look big)
deep bass
accurate bass
loud bass
musical bass
I connect my subs with the largest guage wire availabe, positive to the positive terminal and negitive to negitive terminal. Ohh and if its DVC always wire parellel for lower inductance and higher current draw.
how it looks, well ugly is the best(that way people will know it is hommade)
Look i know those of u that are looking are thinking "pwahh cant be bothered" and to be honest id probably do the same, maybe u could post pics of designs that appeal to u? maybe that would be more interesting and once/if the post gets going then maybe people will feel like contributing more? 😕
We all want a sub that plays loud, low, fast, and accurate. We want it to sip electricity and fit in our back pocket.
Engineering is the art of compromise. That's why everyone here has a different design.
Engineering is the art of compromise. That's why everyone here has a different design.
The best way to get ideas... is to throw out some of your own
Tell us what drivers you have looked at or considered, what amps, what kind of enclosure looks appealing, etc....
Budget is a big factor also
How big is too big?
Tell us what drivers you have looked at or considered, what amps, what kind of enclosure looks appealing, etc....
Budget is a big factor also
How big is too big?
I guess asking this question in a DIY Audio Forum wasnt the best idea cos u all like what u like and its mostly on an indvidual basis and not lead by a purely aesthetic appearence.
I need to find people who just "buy" subwoofers and see if they follow ne trend i.e small cos they dont want subs to impose on the room which i guess if probably more true here in the uk than the states due to the fact that we typically do have smaller listening rooms.
I just thought u guys would have a more technical spin and "connoisseur" angle to likes and dislikes in subwoofers.
But like me i assume IF u were going to purchase a pre-built subwoofer the appearence of the thing would take a back seat and priorities would be performance & sound quaility. I just feel this this isn't the case with members of the general public who have bucks to spend i think the desingner spin to the design has a big effect on what they purchase.
I need to find people who just "buy" subwoofers and see if they follow ne trend i.e small cos they dont want subs to impose on the room which i guess if probably more true here in the uk than the states due to the fact that we typically do have smaller listening rooms.
I just thought u guys would have a more technical spin and "connoisseur" angle to likes and dislikes in subwoofers.
But like me i assume IF u were going to purchase a pre-built subwoofer the appearence of the thing would take a back seat and priorities would be performance & sound quaility. I just feel this this isn't the case with members of the general public who have bucks to spend i think the desingner spin to the design has a big effect on what they purchase.
If I were to buy a sub that was made by someone other than me, it better be as small as possible and look damn good. I prefer a tight, accurate response over high SPL and/or tons of low end. It should come self amplified with tons of options on the plate amp (lowpass in, highpass out, variable phase, bass boost, rumble filter etc etc etc.) The controls for (most of) these functions should be somewhere easier to reach than the back of the plate amp and possibly remote controlled.
Oh and it should be as cheap as possible too.
OHHH... you want to sell these....
well what the average joe looks for is probably
Big speaker, small enclosure, high power, and high SPL.
Adjustable bass boosts are nice too. A remote control is a plus
High and low level imputs are nice
An built-in amp(plate amp) is a must.
Asthetically wood veneers are nice. If you're making them for unknown customers you should make probaly a few black, and a few of the finished hardwood look(perhaps using different types of wood finish would be good to giving more options)
A vented design is probably the best way to go. If I were building subs to sell myself I'd probably use downfiring vents to eliminate the appearance of a hole in the enclosure and also keep people from putting things in it.
A removable grille over the speaker is a must
well what the average joe looks for is probably
Big speaker, small enclosure, high power, and high SPL.
Adjustable bass boosts are nice too. A remote control is a plus
High and low level imputs are nice
An built-in amp(plate amp) is a must.
Asthetically wood veneers are nice. If you're making them for unknown customers you should make probaly a few black, and a few of the finished hardwood look(perhaps using different types of wood finish would be good to giving more options)
A vented design is probably the best way to go. If I were building subs to sell myself I'd probably use downfiring vents to eliminate the appearance of a hole in the enclosure and also keep people from putting things in it.
A removable grille over the speaker is a must
Well, for me, I want a subwoofer flat to at least 16 Hz in a normal room. I want SPL to be at least 105 dB at listening position. That means you need to do a ported subwoofer, or a passive radiator subwoofer or finally a Linkwitz Transform subwoofer. If it's ported, I want to have low air speed in the ports. At the very least 34 m/s at maximum volume, better if under 17 m/s. I want it to have its own amplifier. I want the plate amplifier to have a variable 4th order low-pass crossover, strong rumble filter to prevent overexcursion, variable phase, overheat/overload circuit and finally line-in and line-out. I don't care about high level in and outs. I want the box to be heavily braced and done in 3/4" birch plywood or better.
Aesthetics, I'll leave that to someone else.
Aesthetics, I'll leave that to someone else.
re: techinical spin etc... it sounds a bit lot like you want to sell a commercial product and are asking us to give you design ideas? I don't think thats really fair, you should design your product yourself.
If your motivation is just to do your market research here, I think you are correct, in that this is not the best place for it, as people here are into DIY and thus have quite different concerns and priorities, as well as a higher technical knowledge and lower susceptibility to 'marketing hype' than your normal audiophile. If your 'target market' for these subs is DIY types, I can almost guarantee you will fail, sorry to be blunt, but DIY folks are into DIY for a number of reasons, only one of which is saving $$$.
If you want to know what type of aesthetics your average punter or hifi enthusiast wants, I suggest you go over to audioasylum, avsform, or hometheaterforum and ask people to post pics of their personaly favourite subs 'looks wise'. If you don't want to do your own market research, you can make use of the market research done by 'the big boys', who have spent thousands of dollars finding out the ansers to questions like 'what is a reasonable size' 'what finishes are acceptable' 'what dimensions are acceptable'. By that I mean copy the size/shape/finish/dimensions of their subs, they were chosen based on the type of research you're trying to do here.
In terms of performance, I would have a look at other subs in the pricerange you are looking at, and try to beat them by a fair margin. I would also have the finished product measured by someone reputable like Tom Nuisane, since frankly no one is going to beleive that some guy who just 'ran off a batch of subs' has produced something that can beat big name products that they can find magazine reviews gushing over. At least then you have measured performance by a trusted authority, which goes a LOT further than random marketing claims like 'it will destroy a tempest' or 'way more musical than a REL storm'. Then for your subjective 'audiophile', the non-technical type 'specs don't mean anything' type, you need to get someone who is good at that sort of thing to write a bunch of marketing hype about intimacy, bringing you 'closer' to the 'soul' of the music, etc.
If your motivation is just to do your market research here, I think you are correct, in that this is not the best place for it, as people here are into DIY and thus have quite different concerns and priorities, as well as a higher technical knowledge and lower susceptibility to 'marketing hype' than your normal audiophile. If your 'target market' for these subs is DIY types, I can almost guarantee you will fail, sorry to be blunt, but DIY folks are into DIY for a number of reasons, only one of which is saving $$$.
If you want to know what type of aesthetics your average punter or hifi enthusiast wants, I suggest you go over to audioasylum, avsform, or hometheaterforum and ask people to post pics of their personaly favourite subs 'looks wise'. If you don't want to do your own market research, you can make use of the market research done by 'the big boys', who have spent thousands of dollars finding out the ansers to questions like 'what is a reasonable size' 'what finishes are acceptable' 'what dimensions are acceptable'. By that I mean copy the size/shape/finish/dimensions of their subs, they were chosen based on the type of research you're trying to do here.
In terms of performance, I would have a look at other subs in the pricerange you are looking at, and try to beat them by a fair margin. I would also have the finished product measured by someone reputable like Tom Nuisane, since frankly no one is going to beleive that some guy who just 'ran off a batch of subs' has produced something that can beat big name products that they can find magazine reviews gushing over. At least then you have measured performance by a trusted authority, which goes a LOT further than random marketing claims like 'it will destroy a tempest' or 'way more musical than a REL storm'. Then for your subjective 'audiophile', the non-technical type 'specs don't mean anything' type, you need to get someone who is good at that sort of thing to write a bunch of marketing hype about intimacy, bringing you 'closer' to the 'soul' of the music, etc.
I agree with Morbo and if you really want to build and sell "very high quality subwoofers", then you need to do a custom speaker for each customer. That way you can build each something that best suits their goals and needs and will still outperform anything they can purchase off the rack. The sky is the limit and the options are endless, just be creative. Just call yourself "DIY For Hire" . Keep a few loaners around so they have a quality sub to use while you build their's.
Member
Joined 2004
DDDD,
Why (personally) would you desire a self amplified unit (Plate amp) i was considering using an external amp custom fitted with the standard plate amp subwoofer filters, the amp i was considering using (depending on driver used and enclosure type) was something similar to this http://www.amplifier.co.uk/images/Data Sheets/SDV1037-1200S.pdf 600watt D-class amp with similar front pannel design to the one in the PDF just not in rack form and with the added filter controls to the front pannel. This would also eliminate the need for power cables running to the sub as the amplification would be with the rest of the hi-fi equipment which would obviously already be connected to power.
Opinions?
Just a quicky has ne one had ne expericence with these Drivers? i'm having difficulty finding ne feed back on them.
http://www.p-audio.co.uk/products/db_product_1_27_tm-10.htm
http://www.p-audio.co.uk/products/db_product_1_27_tm-10.htm
Attachments
Morbo,
This is not market research for a commerical product i just want to focus on Projects that i know i can sell on in order to fund the next bigger and better concept.
I want to take the information you guys give me as to what u look for in a subwoofer and try to make the very best looking & sounding finished sub. I figured the technical side of it would be best comming from enthusiasts like you. 😀
Member
Joined 2003
that is suspension behind the motor... Should never suffer from voice coil rubbing the pole peice or top plate....
The TM-10 is a peice if you ask me
55hz Fs
10mm one way linear
Unless its selling for less than $20, you could do alot better
The TM-10 is a peice if you ask me
55hz Fs
10mm one way linear
Unless its selling for less than $20, you could do alot better
I wasn't intending on purchasing it at all just wanted to know if ne one has had ne experience with it?
I beleive the unit retails for $389.95.
The most i've been able to find out about it is that "its built like a tank"
Member
Joined 2003
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