I found a pair of Linton 2 for free. The woofers are OK, but the tweeters aren't.
Any chance to replace the tweeters to have a nice bookshelf? Does it worth the job and money?
Are the x-overs' caps (25MFD++ and 10 MFD++ 50V) still good or they must be replaced? Are they NP/Bi-Polar?
Many thanks!
Any chance to replace the tweeters to have a nice bookshelf? Does it worth the job and money?
Are the x-overs' caps (25MFD++ and 10 MFD++ 50V) still good or they must be replaced? Are they NP/Bi-Polar?
Many thanks!
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
They are non polar and of a brand that has a history of failures. Strongly suggest you replace them with some inexpensive film types from Dayton, Erse, Axon or similar.
And what about the tweeter ?
The possible substitute is a paper cone, which is cheap, if you can find some.
Then there are the regular dome tweeters and the modern 2" full range tiny speakers
which are good for treble reproduction.
When changing a component, you've got to search for the one with the right sensitivity and also impedance. I see that ( Wharfedale Linton 2 on thevintageknob.org )the speaker is rated 6 Ω and that the crossover cut point is at 1,2 kHz ...
The possible substitute is a paper cone, which is cheap, if you can find some.
Then there are the regular dome tweeters and the modern 2" full range tiny speakers
which are good for treble reproduction.
When changing a component, you've got to search for the one with the right sensitivity and also impedance. I see that ( Wharfedale Linton 2 on thevintageknob.org )the speaker is rated 6 Ω and that the crossover cut point is at 1,2 kHz ...
There a few references for a Linton tweeter (some with a cap as crossover, maybe earlier).
Also for the 3" cone tweeter, it seems there is also a alnico tweeter version. I will post a reference for one of the versions for the Linton 2. It was reading (first pic below),
www.ebay.com
www.ebay.co.uk/
References (I don't have any more details on the tweeters), 🙂
Repair Wharfedale speakers
Wharfedale Linton 2 on thevintageknob.org
Wharfedale Linton 3 on thevintageknob.org
Early 60's Warfedale Linton (?) Speakers - AudioKarma.org Home Audio Stereo Discussion Forums
Wharfedale i.d. - AudioKarma.org Home Audio Stereo Discussion Forums
Wharfedale | HiFi Engine
Wharfedale Linton XP2s. . .. No Respect? - AudioKarma.org Home Audio Stereo Discussion Forums
Also for the 3" cone tweeter, it seems there is also a alnico tweeter version. I will post a reference for one of the versions for the Linton 2. It was reading (first pic below),
Some W vintage stuff available on ebay (google, there are some tweeters for sale), Wharfedale Linton Speakers | eBay
www.ebay.com
www.ebay.co.uk/
References (I don't have any more details on the tweeters), 🙂
Repair Wharfedale speakers
Wharfedale Linton 2 on thevintageknob.org
Wharfedale Linton 3 on thevintageknob.org
Early 60's Warfedale Linton (?) Speakers - AudioKarma.org Home Audio Stereo Discussion Forums
Wharfedale i.d. - AudioKarma.org Home Audio Stereo Discussion Forums
Wharfedale | HiFi Engine
Wharfedale Linton XP2s. . .. No Respect? - AudioKarma.org Home Audio Stereo Discussion Forums
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Wharferdale Linton 2
Thanks you all! Grazie mille! Obrigado!
Yes, I'll replace the caps with new ones. But I'm really impressed with the 8" woofers! (picture below)
There's no further info on them, but hese speakers, according to TVK website, were made between 1971 and 1974!! Maybe same materials which can be found also on the Doverdale 3 model 12" woofers??
Thanks you all! Grazie mille! Obrigado!
Yes, I'll replace the caps with new ones. But I'm really impressed with the 8" woofers! (picture below)
There's no further info on them, but hese speakers, according to TVK website, were made between 1971 and 1974!! Maybe same materials which can be found also on the Doverdale 3 model 12" woofers??
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Tweeters' impedance
Another info: tweeters' impedance?
The woofers are 8 ohm rated, but since the tweeters are open I don't know their rated impedance.
Speakers are 6 ohm at input.
Cheers!
Another info: tweeters' impedance?
The woofers are 8 ohm rated, but since the tweeters are open I don't know their rated impedance.
Speakers are 6 ohm at input.
Cheers!
For a 1,2 kHz crossover point, you should be able to determine if the tweeter is 4-6-8 Ω
by looking mainly at the value of the cap. I see that in the photo there are a 10 and a 25 uF, so the 10 uF should be on the tweeter path, and its impedance 8 Ω. Otherwise if the 25 uF is for high-pass, the tweeter is 4 Ω .
by looking mainly at the value of the cap. I see that in the photo there are a 10 and a 25 uF, so the 10 uF should be on the tweeter path, and its impedance 8 Ω. Otherwise if the 25 uF is for high-pass, the tweeter is 4 Ω .
My first HiFi back in the seventies was a £110 Wharfedale Linton complete system using a LEAK derived 30 wpc amp and BSR MacDonald turntable. Very good, it was too. 🙂
I ended up with bigger Wharfedale Melton speakers which had a bit more bass due to 12" woofer.
Wharfedale used a lowish 1.5kHz crossover point on that 3" mylar cone tweeter, and they TENDED TO FRY as a result. 😱
The tweeter crossover was something like series 10uF cap and shunt 0.18mH coil which has a rather nasty low impedance.
I also used Linton boxes for a satisfying later build using more modern 8" bass and dome tweeter and an off the shelf crossover.
Measure the tweeter cutout to see what you might fit in the modern catalogue. I favour this Visaton DT 94 - 8 Ohm Mylar dome which is doable for good phase.
The crossover will look something like below, with a higher crossover and a simpler first order bass which suits 8" units (actually 6" paper cone) . We could tweak that to a 0.82uF tank capacitor according to your existing bass coil value which looks like 1.25mH.
This is diy, so who knows if it will all work out, but it's worth a stab. 😎
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
I ended up with bigger Wharfedale Melton speakers which had a bit more bass due to 12" woofer.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Wharfedale used a lowish 1.5kHz crossover point on that 3" mylar cone tweeter, and they TENDED TO FRY as a result. 😱
The tweeter crossover was something like series 10uF cap and shunt 0.18mH coil which has a rather nasty low impedance.
I also used Linton boxes for a satisfying later build using more modern 8" bass and dome tweeter and an off the shelf crossover.
Measure the tweeter cutout to see what you might fit in the modern catalogue. I favour this Visaton DT 94 - 8 Ohm Mylar dome which is doable for good phase.
The crossover will look something like below, with a higher crossover and a simpler first order bass which suits 8" units (actually 6" paper cone) . We could tweak that to a 0.82uF tank capacitor according to your existing bass coil value which looks like 1.25mH.
This is diy, so who knows if it will all work out, but it's worth a stab. 😎
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Thanks, folks!
Many thanks, folks!
Picowallspeaker, the 10uF cap is on the tweeter path, thus it's a 8 ohm HF driver. Thanks for that.
System7, I have also two pairs of brand new crossovers. One of them has a cut-off of 4500Hz (6 / 18 dB). If original 1.2kHz xo-point tends to fry as a result, then could the 4500Hz be a solution? I have a pair of Visaton tweeters which have freq. response from 1000 to 20.000kHz that requires a crossover point of 3500Hz.
Otherwise, another pair of Signat x-overs I posted here before, but have no info on its crossover point. 😕
I'm not really into coils, so my limitations would push me to use the existing (recapped) original crossover... or one of the two pairs I already have... 🙂
Many thanks, folks!
Picowallspeaker, the 10uF cap is on the tweeter path, thus it's a 8 ohm HF driver. Thanks for that.
System7, I have also two pairs of brand new crossovers. One of them has a cut-off of 4500Hz (6 / 18 dB). If original 1.2kHz xo-point tends to fry as a result, then could the 4500Hz be a solution? I have a pair of Visaton tweeters which have freq. response from 1000 to 20.000kHz that requires a crossover point of 3500Hz.
Otherwise, another pair of Signat x-overs I posted here before, but have no info on its crossover point. 😕
I'm not really into coils, so my limitations would push me to use the existing (recapped) original crossover... or one of the two pairs I already have... 🙂
Hi Karl vd Berg,
We are in DIYAudio so...
Try to use (as an experiment/test) to use the Visaton tweeters you have with a cap crossover (1.order/6dB) a la Dynaco. No crossover for the woofer let it roll off acoustically. The old woofers use to be good at that. Some of the Wharfedales also. 😉
Look at a 1.order table for the cap. 5 uF is good starting point.
In the end if working fine you might have to adjust only the output with one or two resistors (Lpad).
6 db Crossover Table
L-Pad (Driver Attenuation Circuit) Designer / Calculator for the 7/8 Ohms tweeter.
L-Pad (Driver Attenuation Circuit) Designer / Calculator
...and you are in business. (without spending too much) 🙄
Thanks, Inductor! I'll try the cap crossover (1.order/6dB) and report later 🙂
The total speaker impedance will remain within its margin, right?
The total speaker impedance will remain within its margin, right?
Your Visaton SC10N tweeter works pretty well. I give you a PROPER crossover below, not some MICKEY MOUSE first order effort that distorts at high level and has no phase alignment and hence rotten imaging. The treble filter could be 3.3uF and 0.3mH without much difference overall.
The red resistor adjusts level on the top end. As it is, it's likely to be unobtrusive. 🙂
The red resistor adjusts level on the top end. As it is, it's likely to be unobtrusive. 🙂
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WOW! It's becoming VERY interesting!!
I guess I can find the coils easily, right? Resistors are rated 10W? 🙂
It's the 0.68uF/22R tank that aligns the phase so nicely. 😎
Yup. Nothing exotic. Ferrite Coil on the bass, 10W wirewounds and an air coil on the tweet. Small 250V or fatter 630V polypropylene capacitors on the tweeter. Get 4.7, 6.8 and 8.2 ohm resistors to adjust treble level.
Something that ends up looking roughly like this before you wire it all up, though you might adapt a PCB:
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Wharfedale Dovedale 3
Wharfedale Dovedale III's speakers
The pair I have now was given from a neighbour. The speakers were already misused and abused as someone tried to replace the drivers, apparently without much success.
Here are some pictures taken earlier. 🙂
A cheap 4" woofer was put were the mid-range is, and a 6 ohms JBL tweeter was forced into the square hole where the original purple tweeter goes...
Both tweeters are broken, I have no idea how to fix them. It appears that one of the tiny wires that links from one connector is broken in both tweeters.
One mid-range seems fine...
The woofer seems OK for the rubber surrounds but I don't know if is or became a bit stiff. Down the cone another tiny paper or fabric is not glued to a ring. I don't know what kind of glue to use here without damaging that tiny paper, so I leave the woofers as they are for a moment...
Wharfedale Dovedale III's speakers
The pair I have now was given from a neighbour. The speakers were already misused and abused as someone tried to replace the drivers, apparently without much success.
Here are some pictures taken earlier. 🙂
A cheap 4" woofer was put were the mid-range is, and a 6 ohms JBL tweeter was forced into the square hole where the original purple tweeter goes...
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
- An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
- An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Both tweeters are broken, I have no idea how to fix them. It appears that one of the tiny wires that links from one connector is broken in both tweeters.
One mid-range seems fine...
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
The woofer seems OK for the rubber surrounds but I don't know if is or became a bit stiff. Down the cone another tiny paper or fabric is not glued to a ring. I don't know what kind of glue to use here without damaging that tiny paper, so I leave the woofers as they are for a moment...
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
You never said how you got on with the Lintons, Karl. I have seen a pair down a local shop, and I sure like the boxes. I've done them up before with good results. 🙂
These Dovedales look like a lot of work. That bass needs the spider regluing to the metal chassis. I'm not sure what adhesive will be best. Some Silicone grease seems to work well enough on rubber surrounds, but avoid aerosol solvents.
The tweeters MIGHT be fixable if you can unwind a turn on the old tweeters and resolder. You'll then also need to use some glue or varnish on the wires.
The mids aren't going to be too critical IMO. Why not try some cheap and cheerful 4" paper units?
I can't quite figure out the crossover, but suspect it must be something like this:
These Dovedales look like a lot of work. That bass needs the spider regluing to the metal chassis. I'm not sure what adhesive will be best. Some Silicone grease seems to work well enough on rubber surrounds, but avoid aerosol solvents.
The tweeters MIGHT be fixable if you can unwind a turn on the old tweeters and resolder. You'll then also need to use some glue or varnish on the wires.
The mids aren't going to be too critical IMO. Why not try some cheap and cheerful 4" paper units?
I can't quite figure out the crossover, but suspect it must be something like this:
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Hi Steve,
I decided to abort the projects on both Linton (earlier) and now on the Doverdale 3. And the reason is that there is indeed a lot of work to do on these speakers.
The Lintons had the rubber surrounds very stiff. A cheap 8" woofer I had as spare part had better performance so I gave them away.
The same thing with these Doverdale's 12" woofers. Yesterday I finished a whole-day work on these speakers with really poor results with the woofers. I recapped the x-over with new caps, etc...
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
The results were far far less than expected...
Also, measuring DC resistance I had 12 ohms instead of 6. All polarities are correct. Something must be wrong in the x-over, too. And I suspect those tone increase/decrease selectors for the midrange and tweeter are done. They are VERY hard to switch up/down and no effect is heard when turning. They are sealed with rivets and cannot be opened.........
Yes, I still can apply some silicone grease to try to make the woofer's surrounds a bit softer, but frankly there are cheaper and better performers on market.
I want to thank you very much for your great support with these vintage speakers. Surely they would have another good second life in your hands.
..
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Ew, that's a pity about the Lintons. 😱
The first pair I ever did up seemed to have somebody smiling down on me. I bought a pair of lovely new Eminence Alpha 8" woofers for £30 in the local junk shop, then the next day I found some Linton cabinets in a skip in my street! Maplin's standard cheap tweeter in those days was a rather goodish Audax TW034 soft dome, and not knowing enough to worry about the details, I just used Maplin's standard two way crossover and it all worked beautifully with an adjustable sliding plastic tube reflex. Heaven knows, those speakers could go LOUD! My Ex still has them. 🙂
These days, I have got this simple £6 Monacor HT22/8 tweeter working really well. I've learnt a lot about crossovers since early days and know just what to do with them. But I have noticed a terrible inflation in driver prices lately. Everything seems to have gone up 50%. Happily I have lots of different tweeters lying about.
The trick seems to be to use Visaton's Boxsim to do the design with something similar, then just tweak it around a bit for the slightly different drivers:
Downloads
The first pair I ever did up seemed to have somebody smiling down on me. I bought a pair of lovely new Eminence Alpha 8" woofers for £30 in the local junk shop, then the next day I found some Linton cabinets in a skip in my street! Maplin's standard cheap tweeter in those days was a rather goodish Audax TW034 soft dome, and not knowing enough to worry about the details, I just used Maplin's standard two way crossover and it all worked beautifully with an adjustable sliding plastic tube reflex. Heaven knows, those speakers could go LOUD! My Ex still has them. 🙂
These days, I have got this simple £6 Monacor HT22/8 tweeter working really well. I've learnt a lot about crossovers since early days and know just what to do with them. But I have noticed a terrible inflation in driver prices lately. Everything seems to have gone up 50%. Happily I have lots of different tweeters lying about.
The trick seems to be to use Visaton's Boxsim to do the design with something similar, then just tweak it around a bit for the slightly different drivers:
Downloads
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The 3-way Dovedale is a lot more complicated I suppose, but actually a 12 ohm DC reading on the bass is not uncommon with old speakers. 16 ohms nominal used to be the standard, and the Celestion HF1300 was a 16 ohm unit AFAIK.
I would love to have a go at some old SEAS 503!
SEAS Kit 503
Troels really fixed those up nicely, but the original crossover wasn't bad either IMO. 🙂
I would think those old switches are corroded, and most people would just lose them if the magic switch spray doesn't work.
Visaton do a nice mid called a FRS8M that seems to play nicely in most modelling I've done. FRS 8 M - 8 Ohm
Couple of nice mids at SEAS too: http://www.seas.no/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&id=46&Itemid=240
What I don't know is what glue to use on a spider, but perhaps someone here does.
I would love to have a go at some old SEAS 503!
SEAS Kit 503
Troels really fixed those up nicely, but the original crossover wasn't bad either IMO. 🙂
I would think those old switches are corroded, and most people would just lose them if the magic switch spray doesn't work.
Visaton do a nice mid called a FRS8M that seems to play nicely in most modelling I've done. FRS 8 M - 8 Ohm
Couple of nice mids at SEAS too: http://www.seas.no/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&id=46&Itemid=240
What I don't know is what glue to use on a spider, but perhaps someone here does.
The 12" woofer reads 6.2 Ω DC Res, but the whole speaker reads 12.3 Ω Res.
Something is really stuck in the switches!
Believe it or not, I paid 4 (four) euros in a 2nd-hand shop for a very well build (diy) speakers including the incredible CA25RE4 in it. 🙂
I'm using them most of the time. The x-over has those metallic blue bipolar Philips caps. Don't know if the speakers were assembled more than 20 years ago. They look in good condition.
Nice 2-way speakers! I think I saw them before! 🙂
Something is really stuck in the switches!
Believe it or not, I paid 4 (four) euros in a 2nd-hand shop for a very well build (diy) speakers including the incredible CA25RE4 in it. 🙂
I'm using them most of the time. The x-over has those metallic blue bipolar Philips caps. Don't know if the speakers were assembled more than 20 years ago. They look in good condition.
Nice 2-way speakers! I think I saw them before! 🙂
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