Hi. I am going to try a project using the Tangband W4-1337SA in a mltl configuration. I have a pair of bob brines Ft1600s which are great so i would like to try the Tbs in a smaller slim design. Does anyone know of a design? I`ve seen the threads on the Ht forum but these are not for a mltl design. Here is a link to the speaker driver.
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=264-848&vReviewShow=1&vReviewRand=8943823
Here is a link to the HT forum design thread.
http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=27583
Any advice appreciated, Steve.
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=264-848&vReviewShow=1&vReviewRand=8943823
Here is a link to the HT forum design thread.
http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=27583
Any advice appreciated, Steve.
I have the design, I bought it from Bob for $25, I cannot give it to you as it is intellectual property.
I like to suggest you contact Bob(nice guy), if you tell him what you want he MAY even help you in the design of a cabinet similar to the design of LT1600 and pay the price of LT1600 cabinet design, I think that is cheap.
cheers.
I like to suggest you contact Bob(nice guy), if you tell him what you want he MAY even help you in the design of a cabinet similar to the design of LT1600 and pay the price of LT1600 cabinet design, I think that is cheap.
cheers.
I note that Jed's project from the HT thread was for multi-ways, with the final result incorporating rather more than a simple XO.
Great reviews from PE customers, and John apparently quite likes them too.
A quick glance at the TI's response would suggest that you could certainly try them full-range, but at the very least a notch filter or DEQ would be needed to tame that approximately 3 octave wide hump of well over 10 dB (as measured by John) , - "sparkle, they wouldn't lack"
If Bob hasn't already done the math for an MLTL for this one, you could try Godzilla for a BIB, or Scottmoose for one of his creations.
Great reviews from PE customers, and John apparently quite likes them too.
A quick glance at the TI's response would suggest that you could certainly try them full-range, but at the very least a notch filter or DEQ would be needed to tame that approximately 3 octave wide hump of well over 10 dB (as measured by John) , - "sparkle, they wouldn't lack"
If Bob hasn't already done the math for an MLTL for this one, you could try Godzilla for a BIB, or Scottmoose for one of his creations.
I agree with GM that any MLTL for this driver is going to be too small for a floor-stander and is not going to go low enough to work without a sub. IMO 4" and smaller drivers ingeneral need to be crossed above 100-200Hz to produce any meaningful SPL. They should be used as mid-tweets, HT satellites and computer speakers.
If you want to pursue this with me, contact me privately.
rbrines@onebox.com
Bob
If you want to pursue this with me, contact me privately.
rbrines@onebox.com
Bob
Tangband Ti 4
I guess i need to look into how to design a horn for this driver then. How does one go about that. I t strikes me that a horn is going to be difficult to design for me that`s why i was looking at a simple mltl or bass reflex. Would one of the designs off the frugal horn site be worthwhile trying?
These speakers are going to live in my living room and therefore have to be relatively high in waf . They don`t need to reach 30hz i was hoping to achieve closer to 50hz.
Steve.
GM said:
I guess i need to look into how to design a horn for this driver then. How does one go about that. I t strikes me that a horn is going to be difficult to design for me that`s why i was looking at a simple mltl or bass reflex. Would one of the designs off the frugal horn site be worthwhile trying?
These speakers are going to live in my living room and therefore have to be relatively high in waf . They don`t need to reach 30hz i was hoping to achieve closer to 50hz.
Steve.
Bib
BIB is a very basic kind of horn - the construction couldn't be simpler, and generally results in something of a floor stander.
http://www.zillaspeak.com/bib-howtobuild.asp
All that needs to be done is for someone familiar with the design to run the numbers, and see if something practical results. There are already several TB BIB designs posted on Mr Zilla's site - he may have already worked this one out.
If the calculated length is too short to allow proper coupling to the ceiling boundary, which is an essential component for maximum performance with this design, then it can likely be inverted.
Regardless of what enclosure loading you decide for bass response, you'll still need to deal with that upper frequency issue if running this driver full range.
BIB is a very basic kind of horn - the construction couldn't be simpler, and generally results in something of a floor stander.
http://www.zillaspeak.com/bib-howtobuild.asp
All that needs to be done is for someone familiar with the design to run the numbers, and see if something practical results. There are already several TB BIB designs posted on Mr Zilla's site - he may have already worked this one out.
If the calculated length is too short to allow proper coupling to the ceiling boundary, which is an essential component for maximum performance with this design, then it can likely be inverted.
Regardless of what enclosure loading you decide for bass response, you'll still need to deal with that upper frequency issue if running this driver full range.
I have a pair in a shorten version of the Suzy Chang cabinet(shortened out of necessity because of speaker location) Actually seems to work quite well. Noticeably more bass output than with a bass reflex cabinet. Perhaps Scott can design a cabinet specifically for this driver or recommend an existing one if he thinks Suzy Chang can be bettered. Used this way with a subwoofer crossed over around 80Hz makes a very nice system.
Tangband Ti4
So what horn do you guys think would be best for the TBs? I don`t know how to model a bib and my computer freezes every time i try to load the modelling program. The Suzy chang looks nice but i don`t know if i should use a box designed for another driver ala Fostex 107. I love the look of the double horns but i don`t know if any would work.
steve.
So what horn do you guys think would be best for the TBs? I don`t know how to model a bib and my computer freezes every time i try to load the modelling program. The Suzy chang looks nice but i don`t know if i should use a box designed for another driver ala Fostex 107. I love the look of the double horns but i don`t know if any would work.
steve.
Well, if any readily available DIY design for a (small) BLH would have enough flexibility to encompass this driver's T/S parameters, I'd imagine it would be the Frugelhorn. If it could work, the suprabaffle and rear deflector should be considered essential.
If not, or the design doesn't appeal to you, I'd wait for Scottmoose to stumble upon this thread and take a quick look at the driver's specs - I'd be surprised if he couldn't guess off the cuff which of the Spawn family might be best suited.
If not, or the design doesn't appeal to you, I'd wait for Scottmoose to stumble upon this thread and take a quick look at the driver's specs - I'd be surprised if he couldn't guess off the cuff which of the Spawn family might be best suited.
Hmm. I can't say I'm convinced with the driver, but if you want a floorstander, then an ML TQWT looks passable, providing you're not planning on going anywhere near the volume knob.
50in tall. 5in wide x 8in deep at base, comes to a point for So=0 at the top. Zdriver 25in, stuff 0.45lbs ft^3 from the top 30in down. Vent as close to the base as possible, 2in diameter x 4in long. As it's relatively short as TQWT goes, I'd take a leaf out of the late Terry Cain's book & mount the driver on the sloping side so it angles it up slightly, toward the listening position.
50in tall. 5in wide x 8in deep at base, comes to a point for So=0 at the top. Zdriver 25in, stuff 0.45lbs ft^3 from the top 30in down. Vent as close to the base as possible, 2in diameter x 4in long. As it's relatively short as TQWT goes, I'd take a leaf out of the late Terry Cain's book & mount the driver on the sloping side so it angles it up slightly, toward the listening position.
Attachments
Scottmoose said:
Thanks very much for the sim. I assume that the cabinet has straight sides and only slopes on the front baffle right? Not like the metronome that converges from all sides. As for the driver i`ve wanted to try these for some time so i can blame myself if i don`t like it. I`ll give these a try. I`ll post photos as progress is made.
Steve.
castlesteve said:
You're welcome.
Right. The Metronome is a quadratic taper, these are a simpler TQWT taper.
Remember, as GM & Bob pointed out, these are not especially sensitive units, and they're small. Ideally, they're best used with dedicated woofers; the price you pay for getting the ~45Hz extension of this pipe is extremely limited SPLs. We're talking nearfield, relatively low level use on simple music here; Pink Floyd in Pompii, or one of Goldfrapp's raunchier numbers are definitely out.
Between the driver's high Fs, low Vas and medium Q, ergo low efficiency, it's just a poor candidate for a long enough mass loaded pipe to make it a floorstander with any dynamics short of mounting it flush in a corner. IOW, it needs to be tuned to < 0.7*Fs to get a long enough pipe and its Vas combined with its Qts isn't enough to 'fill' the pipe all the way to Fp without EQ, but its marginal Xmax combined with low efficiency doesn't leave any excess to use it.
GM
GM
GM said:
Note that GM & Scott's comments didn't really address the driver's high frequency performance, which definitely needs attention if this driver is to be tolerated full-range.
All in all, this is probably a great candidate exactly the type of project detailed in the link to Jed's HT forum posts. There are numerous other drivers in the same size and price range (or even less), that would be much better suited to a single driver floorstander MLTL / modified VP / BLH or BIB. To name a few:
several models of TBs as indicated on Godzilla's BIB site,
CSS FR125
Fostex FE126/ 7E/ FF125K
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