Hello Inductor
How you posted that Hungarian proverb with perfect spelling..???
These are another great driver
Visaton one of my favorite driver
Visaton - Lautsprecher und Zubehör, Loudspeakers and Accessories
I know these may be good for f3 in my 75L cabinet about 30Hz.
Sometimes a great dynamic better than a slow woofer which go deeper in bass.
Not cheap but I'm sure great quality.
I heard and owned several Visaton and still one of the top to me!
Greetings Gabor
How you posted that Hungarian proverb with perfect spelling..???
These are another great driver
Visaton one of my favorite driver
Visaton - Lautsprecher und Zubehör, Loudspeakers and Accessories
I know these may be good for f3 in my 75L cabinet about 30Hz.
Sometimes a great dynamic better than a slow woofer which go deeper in bass.
Not cheap but I'm sure great quality.
I heard and owned several Visaton and still one of the top to me!
Greetings Gabor
Gabor,
Where did you buy your flared port tube from, was locally?
VOLT B250.8, VB = 75.0 L, FB = 29.0 Hz, Qb = 7.0
F3 outside(no gain) = 29Hz, F6 (-3 with room gain) = 26Hz
This is a studios application driver for studio monitors. It was designed for a very demanding environment. Look that it has a 25mm maxim. excursion (before damage) or Xlim/Xmech important at low frequencies and high power. Nice specs overall and no less important it's also mated for your box approx. size and available in your area. And it goes veeeery looooow!😎
Solen Canada - Solen Electronique Inc.
Item B250.808 - Retail price: 219.13$EACH (this date)
http://www.solen.ca/pdf/volt/b2508.pdf
Where did you buy your flared port tube from, was locally?
VOLT B250.8, VB = 75.0 L, FB = 29.0 Hz, Qb = 7.0
F3 outside(no gain) = 29Hz, F6 (-3 with room gain) = 26Hz
This is a studios application driver for studio monitors. It was designed for a very demanding environment. Look that it has a 25mm maxim. excursion (before damage) or Xlim/Xmech important at low frequencies and high power. Nice specs overall and no less important it's also mated for your box approx. size and available in your area. And it goes veeeery looooow!😎
Solen Canada - Solen Electronique Inc.
Item B250.808 - Retail price: 219.13$EACH (this date)
http://www.solen.ca/pdf/volt/b2508.pdf
Attachments
VISATON TIW250XS 8 Ohms, VB = 75.0 L, FB = 29.7 Hz, Qb = 7.0
F3 outside(no gain) = 30Hz, F6 (-3 with room gain) = 27Hz
It needs a smaller box of 50L or less.
Your box is too big for it.
Attachments
Hello Inductor
Thank you very much!
The flared port tube is from Solen electronics.
Greetings Gabor
Thank you very much!
The flared port tube is from Solen electronics.
Greetings Gabor
Hello Inductor
From Volt I would pick these woofer. All do it has dual voice coil it has great data if is true.
http://www.audio-components.co.uk/pdf/products/DVC2517.pdf
Greetings Gabor
From Volt I would pick these woofer. All do it has dual voice coil it has great data if is true.
http://www.audio-components.co.uk/pdf/products/DVC2517.pdf
Greetings Gabor
Would you use both coils in parallel? As it's a 8+8 double VC it's parameter for impedance it's Re=2.8 ohms. Is that good for your amp?😀 Plus it's price is 341.97$ EACH. Or do you mean to use only one as a sub. I think you have already 2 loudspeakers for 3-Way. Please explain.
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Hello Inductor
I wrote if I would use Volt driver from that I would pick that driver.
I do not plan to use Volt.
That would be only good as a powered sub woofer next to my Visaton bookshelf speakers.
Honestly I do not need and I would have problem to set up to work well with my Visaton.
Also I do not spend that much money on driver I don't know (never heard it)
The best option to me to go with the Alcone.
The Alcon 90db some store did their test on it and give 89db.
All do the Davis most sensitive but more expensive than the Alcone and to me hard to believe only use 1" voice coil. 10" driver with 1" voice coil???
After the data not bad Fs92, Xmax 8, BL 10.08 to bad the Qms only 2.23.
25SCA10W - Davis 10 inch woofer carbon - Europe Audio
I have to compromise price, sensitivity and quality wise.
Only one think against the Alcone, I have the Visaton speakers also has aluminium membrane.
Greetings Gabor
I wrote if I would use Volt driver from that I would pick that driver.
I do not plan to use Volt.
That would be only good as a powered sub woofer next to my Visaton bookshelf speakers.
Honestly I do not need and I would have problem to set up to work well with my Visaton.
Also I do not spend that much money on driver I don't know (never heard it)
The best option to me to go with the Alcone.
The Alcon 90db some store did their test on it and give 89db.
All do the Davis most sensitive but more expensive than the Alcone and to me hard to believe only use 1" voice coil. 10" driver with 1" voice coil???
After the data not bad Fs92, Xmax 8, BL 10.08 to bad the Qms only 2.23.
25SCA10W - Davis 10 inch woofer carbon - Europe Audio
I have to compromise price, sensitivity and quality wise.
Only one think against the Alcone, I have the Visaton speakers also has aluminium membrane.
Greetings Gabor
Hi Gabor,
Davis Acoustics 25SCA10W
I don't know the conditions they measured the driver. Sure is not 92 in a box. More like 90.5 dB and F3=32Hz (Fs=28Hz). The spec 92 can be in open air panel. Also I have reasons to believe that 8mm for excursion is maybe peak to peak? In this case would be Xmax=4 mm and what gives from specs in the websites Xmax PP (peak to peak)=8 mm. That's an old driver, and people have problems with that kind of measurements (data-sheets from manufacturer hard to find or obsolete). As I say, this is what I believe based in the data from databases in France. Have a nice evening.😉
http://petoindominique.fr/php/mysql_menu.php
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Hello Inductor
How I wrote I stick with the Alcone driver.
I can buy it from Germany from a company who willing to ship it as a sample or gift.
They have business on Ebay and used to sell these Alcone to, but because new brand (not many people knows it)so now they stop selling it.
But they still have them.
I just asked on Friday.
Shipping not cheap 60Euros for a pair but I know that is a shipping cost.
Otherwise I can order from other store but import duty etc it cost more.
I pay via pay pal so I'm protected.
I knew Parts Express stop selling the Davis (probably for a reason) also I find on the net German guy bought a pair after short test on one driver he decided not to keep them.
After your sim and the company data is 90db.
If is great to D'Appolito it will be good to me to.😀
I only build one 3 way system. The Visaton what I have I'll give a larger enclosure.
I will see what will happen with the Monacor driver, I can use it in a two way sistem. It is flat up to 5KHz.
Also I have a pair Beyma 8" coax drivers, brand new but I needed to replace in the tweeter the diaphragm one sounded louder than another. Only access to replace them I needed to cut a hole on the Beyma sticker to access the mounting screw.
Beyma sell the diaphragm as a matched pair in one box. I didn't knew it and Europe audio didn't informed me so I ordered two, (I ended up two pair new)
I only write about these I can't sell that Beyma as a driver.
I will build a 65L BR enclosure. From that (not the best) but it go done to 30Hz.
I read on the net people who built speaker they were more than satisfied with.
I com pared the woofer with the 8" Monacor and better driver. Sound much cleaner, more control over the bass. Is a polypropylene membrane. I love the Beyma drivers. I heard two driver and both was more than nice.
I will have to do something with them to. I have a friend who build one source speakers like Sonata or use that British one source driver.
He does not like the Fostex or Nirvana type drivers.
I think at next summer I will do something with that driver or with the Monacor which give better result from 65L BR. Both driver has their own charm.
Of course I plan to keep the only 2 pair speakers. The Visaton one of my favorite.
I'll see which speaker will be good enough for the second system.
Again one more time thank & thank you so much for your help and advise and patient.🙂
Greetings Gabor
How I wrote I stick with the Alcone driver.
I can buy it from Germany from a company who willing to ship it as a sample or gift.
They have business on Ebay and used to sell these Alcone to, but because new brand (not many people knows it)so now they stop selling it.
But they still have them.
I just asked on Friday.
Shipping not cheap 60Euros for a pair but I know that is a shipping cost.
Otherwise I can order from other store but import duty etc it cost more.
I pay via pay pal so I'm protected.
I knew Parts Express stop selling the Davis (probably for a reason) also I find on the net German guy bought a pair after short test on one driver he decided not to keep them.
After your sim and the company data is 90db.
If is great to D'Appolito it will be good to me to.😀
I only build one 3 way system. The Visaton what I have I'll give a larger enclosure.
I will see what will happen with the Monacor driver, I can use it in a two way sistem. It is flat up to 5KHz.
Also I have a pair Beyma 8" coax drivers, brand new but I needed to replace in the tweeter the diaphragm one sounded louder than another. Only access to replace them I needed to cut a hole on the Beyma sticker to access the mounting screw.
Beyma sell the diaphragm as a matched pair in one box. I didn't knew it and Europe audio didn't informed me so I ordered two, (I ended up two pair new)
I only write about these I can't sell that Beyma as a driver.
I will build a 65L BR enclosure. From that (not the best) but it go done to 30Hz.
I read on the net people who built speaker they were more than satisfied with.
I com pared the woofer with the 8" Monacor and better driver. Sound much cleaner, more control over the bass. Is a polypropylene membrane. I love the Beyma drivers. I heard two driver and both was more than nice.
I will have to do something with them to. I have a friend who build one source speakers like Sonata or use that British one source driver.
He does not like the Fostex or Nirvana type drivers.
I think at next summer I will do something with that driver or with the Monacor which give better result from 65L BR. Both driver has their own charm.
Of course I plan to keep the only 2 pair speakers. The Visaton one of my favorite.
I'll see which speaker will be good enough for the second system.
Again one more time thank & thank you so much for your help and advise and patient.🙂
Greetings Gabor
Attachments
Hi Gabor,
How is it going,
Since you have been so eager and working so hard to compare your drivers, and you don't like the complicated software WinISD, Unibox and others we use everyday here at diyAudio please evaluate this one and tell me if this what you're looking for. Should be accurate/OK for tuning +/-1dB curves, F3 (in the bottom), optimized alignments, and with flared ports that you like are included. Have fun. 🙂
Box-Port Design software.sdecnet.com SDeC Software - Home
Download build 2.02 (927 KB) SDeC Software - Box-Port Design
How is it going,
Since you have been so eager and working so hard to compare your drivers, and you don't like the complicated software WinISD, Unibox and others we use everyday here at diyAudio please evaluate this one and tell me if this what you're looking for. Should be accurate/OK for tuning +/-1dB curves, F3 (in the bottom), optimized alignments, and with flared ports that you like are included. Have fun. 🙂
Box-Port Design software.sdecnet.com SDeC Software - Home
Download build 2.02 (927 KB) SDeC Software - Box-Port Design
Last edited:
Hello Inductor
The software give you the optimal enclosure size around 50L, tuning frequency something over 35Hz or over..
At least at first try that is what I got, tomorrow if I have time I do more tests.
With another software I gave the enclosure volume, WAS, Fs, Qts and how many driver I use etc.
I get simulated after the enclosure volume I chose but also if I was interested it gave me the optimal enclosure size.
Thanks to you🙂 I think I'm done with all the simulation. I have to put it together and tune up the speaker.
Since the ear the best tool here (my opinion and some other speaker builders to) I have to tune up after my ear which take couple weeks or so.
I always use 18db Xower. Lot of adjustment option.
Now I use 18db in my Visaton to. I find at the German website they use the same driver same size enclosure (12L). I built their Xower and sounded like a crap.
After few test I put back what I designed.
The software (help) I needed to gave me a foundation where I can start.
If the enclosure to small I can't get the right result. If to large that can be a problem to.
All do after I build the 3 way speaker I will put the Visaton in a 30L BR enclosure.
My friend who did the sim on it he wrote he wouldn't do that but I will try it.
I have a great 30L enclosure ready for that.
He also wrote to me he would not put the Beyma speakers larger than 40L sealed enclosure.
To me the 65L BR look acceptable.
I read on the net others did it to and they were more than happy with the result.
These week I'll order the Alcone drivers.
I want to com pare after my ear the Beyma woofer and the Monacor 8" drivers over these enclosure.
That will be next year and my last project (one set of speaker) I chose which one I like better.Probably the Beyma is better (after the first test). Also has the advantage because coax driver, as a one source driver.
The Monacor good in a 50L enclosure tuned to 27Hz. But not bad either in 60-65L.
Greetings Gabor
The software give you the optimal enclosure size around 50L, tuning frequency something over 35Hz or over..
At least at first try that is what I got, tomorrow if I have time I do more tests.
With another software I gave the enclosure volume, WAS, Fs, Qts and how many driver I use etc.
I get simulated after the enclosure volume I chose but also if I was interested it gave me the optimal enclosure size.
Thanks to you🙂 I think I'm done with all the simulation. I have to put it together and tune up the speaker.
Since the ear the best tool here (my opinion and some other speaker builders to) I have to tune up after my ear which take couple weeks or so.
I always use 18db Xower. Lot of adjustment option.
Now I use 18db in my Visaton to. I find at the German website they use the same driver same size enclosure (12L). I built their Xower and sounded like a crap.
After few test I put back what I designed.
The software (help) I needed to gave me a foundation where I can start.
If the enclosure to small I can't get the right result. If to large that can be a problem to.
All do after I build the 3 way speaker I will put the Visaton in a 30L BR enclosure.
My friend who did the sim on it he wrote he wouldn't do that but I will try it.
I have a great 30L enclosure ready for that.
He also wrote to me he would not put the Beyma speakers larger than 40L sealed enclosure.
To me the 65L BR look acceptable.
I read on the net others did it to and they were more than happy with the result.
These week I'll order the Alcone drivers.
I want to com pare after my ear the Beyma woofer and the Monacor 8" drivers over these enclosure.
That will be next year and my last project (one set of speaker) I chose which one I like better.Probably the Beyma is better (after the first test). Also has the advantage because coax driver, as a one source driver.
The Monacor good in a 50L enclosure tuned to 27Hz. But not bad either in 60-65L.
Greetings Gabor
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Hello
From AE drivers which one would feet my need in 75L better?
The TD10X or the TD10S? I didn't check the drivers price yet.
Acoustic Elegance • View topic - TD10M, X, H, and S parameters
Someone offered these drivers to me here.
http://www.aespeakers.com/drivers.php?driver_id=23
Unfortunately the company who promised to ship the Alcone to Canada they changed their mind.
They only ship to Germany (free) or may be Europe.
My friend who is in Germany does not answer to me.
Why I want to deal with these company(store), only they match the woofer as a pair. Of course not for free.
At first they offered shipping to Canada, now they not even answer to me.🙄
I write to them one more time if they not answer I can't purchase Alcone woofers.
Greetings Gabor
From AE drivers which one would feet my need in 75L better?
The TD10X or the TD10S? I didn't check the drivers price yet.
Acoustic Elegance • View topic - TD10M, X, H, and S parameters
Someone offered these drivers to me here.
http://www.aespeakers.com/drivers.php?driver_id=23
Unfortunately the company who promised to ship the Alcone to Canada they changed their mind.
They only ship to Germany (free) or may be Europe.
My friend who is in Germany does not answer to me.
Why I want to deal with these company(store), only they match the woofer as a pair. Of course not for free.
At first they offered shipping to Canada, now they not even answer to me.🙄
I write to them one more time if they not answer I can't purchase Alcone woofers.
Greetings Gabor
Hello
Finally today they let me to order the Alcone woofers.
Not cheap because the shipping cost 60Euro matching 30Euro.What can I do? I want to finish that project.
Another option was the Scan Speak but that cost more, I'm not sure if Solen electronics match them.
Thanks for the help for all of you one more time!
Happy Christmas
Greetings Gabor
Finally today they let me to order the Alcone woofers.
Not cheap because the shipping cost 60Euro matching 30Euro.What can I do? I want to finish that project.
Another option was the Scan Speak but that cost more, I'm not sure if Solen electronics match them.
Thanks for the help for all of you one more time!
Happy Christmas
Greetings Gabor
i was going to offer my help with shipping if they wouldnt ship it to you but i see it´s no longer needed
merry xmas
merry xmas
AE speakers just answered
Hello
Now when I ordered the Alcone from Germany AE speakers answered to.
Hello,
In this case either of the drivers could work well. I would choose the TD10S though because you get slightly more output down low. You will achieve the 90dB goal everywhere above 80hz. Below that down to 30hz there is only a very small rolloff. With room/boundary gain you will have plenty of output. The tuning in this graph is 28hz in the 75L which is very good for either option.
These drivers probably would be better option than the Alcone but 30 minutes later I placed the order for the Alcone.
That is the life.
They did run a sim and the TD10S not bad at al. -3 Fs 28Hz
Here are the parameters of the driver
Not bad at all.
Greetings Gabor🙂
AE Speakers Online Store
Hello
Now when I ordered the Alcone from Germany AE speakers answered to.
Hello,
In this case either of the drivers could work well. I would choose the TD10S though because you get slightly more output down low. You will achieve the 90dB goal everywhere above 80hz. Below that down to 30hz there is only a very small rolloff. With room/boundary gain you will have plenty of output. The tuning in this graph is 28hz in the 75L which is very good for either option.
These drivers probably would be better option than the Alcone but 30 minutes later I placed the order for the Alcone.
That is the life.
They did run a sim and the TD10S not bad at al. -3 Fs 28Hz
Here are the parameters of the driver
Not bad at all.
Greetings Gabor🙂
AE Speakers Online Store
Attachments
Hello
Yesterday the Alcone AC10 HE 10" matched pair woofers arrived. They are very nice drivers. I hock up with out XO or cabinet but just in a low level to run it bit.
They sound very clear, detailed absolutely love it what I hear.
I tested many speakers (drivers). What I want to say I have some experience. These ones I love them from the moment I heard them.
Some pictures.
Now I need to put my speakers together. I didn't stained because I want to test what type of damping material would be the best.
I have 100% thick wool carpet, long ship wool, the white stuff many speakers company use it and I'll try glass fiber isolator (the white one) from Rona produced for sound project.
So the buttom of the woofer enclosure not glued yet.
After I test the damping material I'll glue and stain them.
Any experience about damping material for woofer welcome.
Actually now that calculator run again. If someone want to test it you find it at third page.
Greetings Gabor🙂
Yesterday the Alcone AC10 HE 10" matched pair woofers arrived. They are very nice drivers. I hock up with out XO or cabinet but just in a low level to run it bit.
They sound very clear, detailed absolutely love it what I hear.
I tested many speakers (drivers). What I want to say I have some experience. These ones I love them from the moment I heard them.
Some pictures.
Now I need to put my speakers together. I didn't stained because I want to test what type of damping material would be the best.
I have 100% thick wool carpet, long ship wool, the white stuff many speakers company use it and I'll try glass fiber isolator (the white one) from Rona produced for sound project.
So the buttom of the woofer enclosure not glued yet.
After I test the damping material I'll glue and stain them.
Any experience about damping material for woofer welcome.
Actually now that calculator run again. If someone want to test it you find it at third page.
Greetings Gabor🙂
Attachments
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The AE's and Alcone are made for smaller boxes. You can model and test various alignments later.
Hello Inductor
About the AE the guy lied to me, I did simulated and not even close the sim what he sent to me.
The Alcone will work nice in a larger enclosure to.
I run simulation after the speech they sent to me and even from 90L is very nice.
Of course I have 75L a very long reflex tube. I'll cut it inch by inch..
I'll first test what dumping material feet my need best.
After I'll play with the tube and of course how much dumping material I use.
I use 18db XO so to have lot of adjustment possibility.
I believe these will be great project if I can put them together.
It take weeks and months until I reach the final sound. At least usually took that much time when I built something for myself. I forget there are some differences between the orig Alcone website shared speech and the orig what they sent me with the speakers.
Alcone website Was 100L , Fs28, Qts 0.325
Reality Was 93L, Fs31, Qts 0.41
Please use these sim program, simple and good
http://80.254.240.160/ElementCalc/vented.aspx
How I learned as long the simulation remain straight on the line the FB still OK.
With the Alcone I can go below 30Hz with room gain from 75L
That not true in the AE speaker case
I did simulation and between 60 to 200Hz go way under the (-3 to 6db or more in 75L)
Again the guy who did the sim lied to me to buy his drivers.🙁
Greetings Gabor
About the AE the guy lied to me, I did simulated and not even close the sim what he sent to me.
The Alcone will work nice in a larger enclosure to.
I run simulation after the speech they sent to me and even from 90L is very nice.
Of course I have 75L a very long reflex tube. I'll cut it inch by inch..
I'll first test what dumping material feet my need best.
After I'll play with the tube and of course how much dumping material I use.
I use 18db XO so to have lot of adjustment possibility.
I believe these will be great project if I can put them together.
It take weeks and months until I reach the final sound. At least usually took that much time when I built something for myself. I forget there are some differences between the orig Alcone website shared speech and the orig what they sent me with the speakers.
Alcone website Was 100L , Fs28, Qts 0.325
Reality Was 93L, Fs31, Qts 0.41
Please use these sim program, simple and good
http://80.254.240.160/ElementCalc/vented.aspx
How I learned as long the simulation remain straight on the line the FB still OK.
With the Alcone I can go below 30Hz with room gain from 75L
That not true in the AE speaker case
I did simulation and between 60 to 200Hz go way under the (-3 to 6db or more in 75L)
Again the guy who did the sim lied to me to buy his drivers.🙁
Greetings Gabor
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