Hi folks,
I've got a Rega P1 turntable, which I got as a gift fairly recently, and having a great time digging out vinyl that I haven't had the means to listen to for many moons, as well as enjoying the sound of the deck itself - it's quite impressive for such a bargainous piece of kit.
One thing, however, that struck me about the deck when I got it was the hideous quality of the captive phono leads, which are like the things that you buy for about £1.99 a pair in Maplins. And there's no separate earth.
For anyone who doesn't know the deck (and I presume that this isn't uncommon on other budget priced decks?) - the phono leads go straight into the bottom of the plinth under the tonearm, via a small plastic cylinder that's held in place by a grub screw, and soldered directly onto the wires from the cartridge.
What I'd like to is get rid of the captive leads completely, and replace them with a simple socket, so I can use my own phono lead (which I already have from when I owned a 'decent' deck some years back).
My idea is to simply mount a decent quality 5 pin din socket directly below the tonearm, possibly on a small plate screwed to the plinth, et voila!
Has anyone attempted a mod like this before? I've been searching the net, and can't find anything, which kind of surprised me with so many peoples obsession with cables! Also, can anyone think of any problems that I might encounter in doing this?
Many thanks in advance 🙂
I've got a Rega P1 turntable, which I got as a gift fairly recently, and having a great time digging out vinyl that I haven't had the means to listen to for many moons, as well as enjoying the sound of the deck itself - it's quite impressive for such a bargainous piece of kit.
One thing, however, that struck me about the deck when I got it was the hideous quality of the captive phono leads, which are like the things that you buy for about £1.99 a pair in Maplins. And there's no separate earth.
For anyone who doesn't know the deck (and I presume that this isn't uncommon on other budget priced decks?) - the phono leads go straight into the bottom of the plinth under the tonearm, via a small plastic cylinder that's held in place by a grub screw, and soldered directly onto the wires from the cartridge.
What I'd like to is get rid of the captive leads completely, and replace them with a simple socket, so I can use my own phono lead (which I already have from when I owned a 'decent' deck some years back).
My idea is to simply mount a decent quality 5 pin din socket directly below the tonearm, possibly on a small plate screwed to the plinth, et voila!
Has anyone attempted a mod like this before? I've been searching the net, and can't find anything, which kind of surprised me with so many peoples obsession with cables! Also, can anyone think of any problems that I might encounter in doing this?
Many thanks in advance 🙂
A couple of years ago I did fit a 5-pin male DIN socket into an RB300 arm, but I currently don't
remember where I bought it. I just still know I fitted a female DIN plug to the corresponding lead
I made at the same time.
However, Rega TTs suffer from different issues than arm cable. For a P1 get a decent cartridge
first, then the glass platter and better subplatter.
remember where I bought it. I just still know I fitted a female DIN plug to the corresponding lead
I made at the same time.
However, Rega TTs suffer from different issues than arm cable. For a P1 get a decent cartridge
first, then the glass platter and better subplatter.
Thank you for your reply Ticktock.
I've been looking at the upgrades you suggested this morning, and found a great source of info here - Enjoy life with LP's and Turntables
Seems like the upgrades you pointed out are a great place to start, and then there's a whole load more, if the inclination takes you...
I also found this - M DIN R (Rega DIN) which is exactly what I need to ditch the captured phono leads on the P1 (fits into the hole where the current cables are held in by the grub screw), and isn't expensive in the least. Hooray!
I've been looking at the upgrades you suggested this morning, and found a great source of info here - Enjoy life with LP's and Turntables
Seems like the upgrades you pointed out are a great place to start, and then there's a whole load more, if the inclination takes you...
I also found this - M DIN R (Rega DIN) which is exactly what I need to ditch the captured phono leads on the P1 (fits into the hole where the current cables are held in by the grub screw), and isn't expensive in the least. Hooray!
Nice DIN plug by Cardas - didn't know it.
I remember I had to make my own sleeve to fit the plug into the arm shaft.
I forgot to say I went for an Oelbach female DIN despite it straight and an
angled one is more convenient on/under a Rega.
I remember I had to make my own sleeve to fit the plug into the arm shaft.
I forgot to say I went for an Oelbach female DIN despite it straight and an
angled one is more convenient on/under a Rega.
I'm looking at doing something like this at some point too (Rega Plana 3 owner here). Have you found a budget friendly female DIN socket? Seems the matching male bit for installation in the tonearm base isn't bad, but all the female bits I can find are terribly pricey. There's a joke in there somewhere, I'm sure...
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
TAC 5 | Zubehör | Phono | Home Hifi | Oehlbach
Oehlbach TAC 5 Tonarmstecker: Amazon.de: Elektronik
Captive external cables are fine it's just that the Rega cables are crap and the grounding arrangement is poor. I've done several Regas fitting good quality external cables together with a seperate ground cable which rectifies the grounding issue, leaving the internal wiring stock. A new brass or aluminium plug is required though to replace the cheap plastic affair. The improvement in sound quality is quite obvious. If I have some time tomorrow I'll post some pics of the last one I did. This is a cheap mod and well worth the effort, a big bang for your buck.
Sounds very promising, thanks for your input.
Excuse what is possibly a silly question, but which component are you referring to by 'the cheap plastic affair'? There's quite a few of them on the deck..!
Warm regards.
Ok I have some pics here of an RB250 I did recently.
The first pic shows the arm with the original cable removed and the new cable fitted in the new brass insert. There is a separate ground cable as well now. You can see the round glass fibre pcb to which the original cables were terminated. This is reused.
Second pic shows the wires ready to insert through the disc and the next with the disc in place. Each of the existing internal tonearm wires are inserted into the respective holes and soldered. The new ground wire and the existing internal black wire are soldered together but this junction also needs to be grounded at that point. You can either solder direct to the brass insert or fold the new ground wire over so it makes contact.
All done and just needs closing off.
Re the choice if external cable. I used VanDamme Pro Patch which has two cores inside the same single screen and I wire psuedo balanced but by all means use single core screened cable in the normal fashion if you wish.
The first pic shows the arm with the original cable removed and the new cable fitted in the new brass insert. There is a separate ground cable as well now. You can see the round glass fibre pcb to which the original cables were terminated. This is reused.
Second pic shows the wires ready to insert through the disc and the next with the disc in place. Each of the existing internal tonearm wires are inserted into the respective holes and soldered. The new ground wire and the existing internal black wire are soldered together but this junction also needs to be grounded at that point. You can either solder direct to the brass insert or fold the new ground wire over so it makes contact.
All done and just needs closing off.
Re the choice if external cable. I used VanDamme Pro Patch which has two cores inside the same single screen and I wire psuedo balanced but by all means use single core screened cable in the normal fashion if you wish.
Attachments
That's fantastic, thank you!
Only query I have is about the earthing - on the P1's RB100 tonearm the pillar is made of plastic, so is there any point in using the metal bung and connecting the earth wire to it, as it won't make electrical contact with any other components?
Warm regards.
Only query I have is about the earthing - on the P1's RB100 tonearm the pillar is made of plastic, so is there any point in using the metal bung and connecting the earth wire to it, as it won't make electrical contact with any other components?
Warm regards.
I didn't know the RB100 had a plastic pillar. In that case you've nothing to ground to so a metal inset will not be needed. From an engineering point of view I'd probably still machine one up but it would serve no other purpose here.
It might be wise to gently remove the original plastic insert and check what's inside. Maybe you could take a pic?
It might be wise to gently remove the original plastic insert and check what's inside. Maybe you could take a pic?
Additional connector will degrade low level cartridge signal much more than even the cheapest cable. Try soldering tonearm cable directly to phono stage PCB eliminating dreadful RCA chinch connectors. Difference in sound is clear.
So, do not play with Rega cable.Do not introduce a new connector.
So, do not play with Rega cable.Do not introduce a new connector.
Yep, plastic all the way..
The internals are as follows - tonearm signal wires are connected to their normal terminals on the PCB, the earth 'doubled up' onto the blue's and a bridge from there to what would normally be the earth terminal, which has a metal tab that extends around the side of the bung to rest against the inside of the tonearm pillar (there's nothing inside the pillar to make an electrical connection with the tab though...).
Sounds like logical thinking from a purely sound quality point of view, but I'm not 100% sold on the practicalities (I'd have to make a hole in the phono stage casing, and I like the idea of being able to disassemble the system without having to use a soldering iron!). I'll be using a decent quality cable, with screw tightening RCA connectors, which shouldn't cause a huge loss in signal quality?
I haven't suggested introducing a new connector or even making any additional connections as there's already four/five connections at that point. I've suggested replacing the original external cable for something better and correcting the ground wiring and I prefer to solder the new cables directly in place of the old. This can only improve on the original wiring.
I had a friend who's Rega arm was wired continuous from cart tags to phono and he damaged the wiring close to the pillar. I cut off the damaged cable and fitted new external cables just as I'm suggesting here. He actually thought it sounded better after the repair so go figure. Bear in mind that your phono stage is full of solder joints also.
Mad idea. We should keep a sense of proportion here. 😉 Reducing the number of jounts is nice, but
proper solder joints won't do any serious (= audible) harm. Not just that this is highly impractical, all
top class arms (which usually run low output moving coils) come with connectors. Are they sounding
dreadful? Certainly not. Even more it's just a cheap Rega P1 with lots of other weaknesses, most of
them much more significient than solder joints and RCA connectors.
Nevertheless I agree with most here though, that grounding needs to be improved on all Rega arms.
And get proper quality RCA plugs, I'd recommend Neutrik Profis.
NF2C-B/2 - Neutrik
Ticktock, phono cartridges have so low output, that every connector degrade sound quality, much more than line signals . I am speaking about five pin and RCA chinch , soldered joints are not so degrading, SN62 alloy should be used here.
Absolute sound quality, not ergonomics is what I wished to explain. And of course, best connector is no connector. Small loss of practicality is accepted.
If you have shiny,factory made phono stage with CAD enclosure and tidy rows of gold plated RCA-s, you are not ready to use soldering iron to disturb its beauty. But it is your loss. Old fashioned DIN connectors an branded XLR-s are better, but not perfect.
Neutrik RCA connectors are nothing special, I have bought recently two pairs of the most respected and expensive RCA plugs and sockets, I would say shamelessly expensive. Just for educational reasons.
They are good,but direct soldering in my high grade DIY phono stage is better-cleaner and more dynamic.
A long time ago , DNM primus preamp made in UK had at the enclosure back pierced soldering terminals at MC input instead of connectors. They knew the ultimate way to get most out of that low output devices.
Absolute sound quality, not ergonomics is what I wished to explain. And of course, best connector is no connector. Small loss of practicality is accepted.
If you have shiny,factory made phono stage with CAD enclosure and tidy rows of gold plated RCA-s, you are not ready to use soldering iron to disturb its beauty. But it is your loss. Old fashioned DIN connectors an branded XLR-s are better, but not perfect.
Neutrik RCA connectors are nothing special, I have bought recently two pairs of the most respected and expensive RCA plugs and sockets, I would say shamelessly expensive. Just for educational reasons.
They are good,but direct soldering in my high grade DIY phono stage is better-cleaner and more dynamic.
A long time ago , DNM primus preamp made in UK had at the enclosure back pierced soldering terminals at MC input instead of connectors. They knew the ultimate way to get most out of that low output devices.
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