Hi Maurice.
Good to see that you are on the same trip as I am.
I do not mention the other tweaks I applied to the Digi-Amp,
which are as effective as the BG tuning.
There are too many people in the forum who'd stone me after
mentioning them.
😀
Refering to your ceramics comments. I am also running 1000 pico ceramics parallel to some of the BGs.
On the BG I leave out the 1/10th rule. I usually go for the 1/100th
rule.
I prepare myself special DIY ceramics. I am soldering teflon isolated silver leads to 0805 types. If I need e.g. a combined 100nf/1000pf combo I solder them together to one lead per side! I wrap it with a hot melt adhesive. Turning it around until it looks like a pearl.
That's why I call them NANO-, PICO- or Micro Pearls. I'll show a picture as soon as I figure out how to upload the pictures.
On my Mundorf Silver/Gold coupling caps (applied between DAC/TX102/AMP) I use e.g. NANO pearls, which are working just fine.
Perhaps you read that I even put the BG-NX types as filter in the output. I am running a 8R load . 0,2uF = two 0,1NX types in Super E working fine. I put them also up in the output the same way as Zobel-filter. Sounds just clean.
By the way I- saw in another application that somebody put
a 0,1R type resistor in line with a small size power bypass C connected to ground.
Does somebody have an idea what's that supposed to be?
\Klaus
Good to see that you are on the same trip as I am.
I do not mention the other tweaks I applied to the Digi-Amp,
which are as effective as the BG tuning.
There are too many people in the forum who'd stone me after
mentioning them.
😀Refering to your ceramics comments. I am also running 1000 pico ceramics parallel to some of the BGs.
On the BG I leave out the 1/10th rule. I usually go for the 1/100th
rule.
I prepare myself special DIY ceramics. I am soldering teflon isolated silver leads to 0805 types. If I need e.g. a combined 100nf/1000pf combo I solder them together to one lead per side! I wrap it with a hot melt adhesive. Turning it around until it looks like a pearl.
That's why I call them NANO-, PICO- or Micro Pearls. I'll show a picture as soon as I figure out how to upload the pictures.
On my Mundorf Silver/Gold coupling caps (applied between DAC/TX102/AMP) I use e.g. NANO pearls, which are working just fine.
Perhaps you read that I even put the BG-NX types as filter in the output. I am running a 8R load . 0,2uF = two 0,1NX types in Super E working fine. I put them also up in the output the same way as Zobel-filter. Sounds just clean.
By the way I- saw in another application that somebody put
a 0,1R type resistor in line with a small size power bypass C connected to ground.
Does somebody have an idea what's that supposed to be?
\Klaus
BG superE measured
Guys,
For your interest:
Recently Gordon Rankin had brought up this at diyhifi.org, here:
http://www.diyhifi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=15020#15020
the thread is long and many [interesting] things are happening in it contemporarily, so here it is the conclusion:
http://www.diyhifi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=15759#15759
I would report it also here, the opinion of CG after having had a look at the bunch of BG caps that Gordon had sent to him:
From the thread you can understand that also Jocko had the same result. And I had the same result earlier on while looking at superE config [anti-parallelling them] of generic caps.
Mauricio, is it enough evidence to stop repeating the claim that nobody had measured the thing?
Ciao, George
Guys,
For your interest:
Recently Gordon Rankin had brought up this at diyhifi.org, here:
http://www.diyhifi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=15020#15020
the thread is long and many [interesting] things are happening in it contemporarily, so here it is the conclusion:
http://www.diyhifi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=15759#15759
I would report it also here, the opinion of CG after having had a look at the bunch of BG caps that Gordon had sent to him:
From the thread you can understand that also Jocko had the same result. And I had the same result earlier on while looking at superE config [anti-parallelling them] of generic caps.
Mauricio, is it enough evidence to stop repeating the claim that nobody had measured the thing?
Ciao, George
My new pot
There is a surprise... I connected before, both UCD and AMP5 to a preamp (a tube Klimo Merlin) and both were much powerful than directly connected to the DAC. I thought it were the preamp gain. With this cheap pot, both are as powerful as if they were connected to the pre.
So digital control of volume through Emu1212M sound card affects amps power.
Unfortunately the sound is not better, with both amps. I've lost a lot of transparency, even if at low-medium volume sound is more enjoyable.
It depends on pot quality, of course, because with the tube preamp they sounded better than with this pot.
Thomas
peufeu said:
There is a surprise... I connected before, both UCD and AMP5 to a preamp (a tube Klimo Merlin) and both were much powerful than directly connected to the DAC. I thought it were the preamp gain. With this cheap pot, both are as powerful as if they were connected to the pre.
So digital control of volume through Emu1212M sound card affects amps power.
Unfortunately the sound is not better, with both amps. I've lost a lot of transparency, even if at low-medium volume sound is more enjoyable.
It depends on pot quality, of course, because with the tube preamp they sounded better than with this pot.
Thomas
Would that have something to do with the DAC from the soundcard driving them differentially, how did you connect them?
SPDIF from Emu card to DAC. DAC balanced output to UCD balanced input, and, alternatively, DAC unbalanced outputo to AMP5 unbalanced input. Volume I use is that of PatchMix: I let 0dB attenuation to ASIO Strip, then I use monitor volume control with an IR.
If I use internal Emu DAC (I have it as daughter card inside the PC) and connect directly daughter card outputs to amps, the volume level is the same as that of the external DAC.
If I use internal Emu DAC (I have it as daughter card inside the PC) and connect directly daughter card outputs to amps, the volume level is the same as that of the external DAC.
Hi JosephK, 🙂
I did it again, didn't I?
Thanks for the links, I admit I had not reached that page yet...
BTW, at first glance I failed to see the promised plots.
Am I becoming blind and deaf to all evidence, doctor?
Anyway, that thread is great and it is refreshing (amongst other) that even highly qualified EE's discuss topics that I thought were evident or obvious to them (without adding that this is a exclusivelly technical thread; no opinions on sound).
About BG, I like them and think that two sound better than one. How much better? Don't know. The problem is that they take many, many days to begin to sound good...
Hi Soundcheck, 🙂
So, ceramics not necesarilly sound bad?
That pearls of you are out of my skills, I think.
I am also worried by those ceramic caps that are on the UCD's signal input circuit 😱 they must be doing something bad to the sound, don't you guys think?
Yeah, I saw your comments but was affraid to try them there because I confess I don't understand how the filter's properties can be changed. I was going to 2*330nf Wima film caps. BTW, my speakers are all around 6-8ohm.
Hi Thomas,
Well, perception is tricky. I think it has to be related to the perceived "balance" of the Freqs. I read somewhere (I believe it was Bruno) that If the amp losses some fraction of a dB on high freq. it could be perceived as more powerfull and with fat bass and vice/versa. Almost everytime one has a cleaner output, with better detail and extension on HF the whole presentatio is perceived as the bass getting linner, ence "less powerfull".
Cheers,
M
I did it again, didn't I?
Thanks for the links, I admit I had not reached that page yet...
BTW, at first glance I failed to see the promised plots.
Am I becoming blind and deaf to all evidence, doctor?
Anyway, that thread is great and it is refreshing (amongst other) that even highly qualified EE's discuss topics that I thought were evident or obvious to them (without adding that this is a exclusivelly technical thread; no opinions on sound).
About BG, I like them and think that two sound better than one. How much better? Don't know. The problem is that they take many, many days to begin to sound good...
Hi Soundcheck, 🙂
So, ceramics not necesarilly sound bad?
That pearls of you are out of my skills, I think.
I am also worried by those ceramic caps that are on the UCD's signal input circuit 😱 they must be doing something bad to the sound, don't you guys think?
Yeah, I saw your comments but was affraid to try them there because I confess I don't understand how the filter's properties can be changed. I was going to 2*330nf Wima film caps. BTW, my speakers are all around 6-8ohm.
Hi Thomas,
Do you mean the amps "sound as if they were more powerfull" than before?
Well, perception is tricky. I think it has to be related to the perceived "balance" of the Freqs. I read somewhere (I believe it was Bruno) that If the amp losses some fraction of a dB on high freq. it could be perceived as more powerfull and with fat bass and vice/versa. Almost everytime one has a cleaner output, with better detail and extension on HF the whole presentatio is perceived as the bass getting linner, ence "less powerfull".
Cheers,
M
maxlorenz said:
No, it is not perception. If I connect EMU sound card => Spdif => DAC => AMP, the highest volume level is at 3/4 ~ 4/5 of the max volume.
With the pot the same volume level is with knob at 1/2, even less. With the pot the sound card has no attenuation.
So there is something I don't know about the Emu card.
Ciao
Thomas
Mauricio,
It's always a pleasure to exchange some "botta e risposta" with You..
And I hope that now, from that thread, You could perceive quite clearly my approach as well:
I don't have anything against You our anybody else, but try to protect a minimum of common sense, especially when I sense the presence of marketing BS.
And we are not talking about paralleling or not. We are talking about L-cancellation invented [and patent-protected ] by BG. Which is not real, as it could have been understood just from the ways the patent has been written.
And I understand the missing curves. It's always difficoult to show non-existence of something.
Though it's easy to see impedance rising instead of keeping to "absolute zero" - and this is what happened "It just acted like two same-value caps in parallel."
When I will get my hands on BG caps, I will publish mercilessly the results.
But will not buy them, because it's not my fixation...
Ciao, George
It's always a pleasure to exchange some "botta e risposta" with You..
And I hope that now, from that thread, You could perceive quite clearly my approach as well:
I don't have anything against You our anybody else, but try to protect a minimum of common sense, especially when I sense the presence of marketing BS.
And we are not talking about paralleling or not. We are talking about L-cancellation invented [and patent-protected ] by BG. Which is not real, as it could have been understood just from the ways the patent has been written.
And I understand the missing curves. It's always difficoult to show non-existence of something.
Though it's easy to see impedance rising instead of keeping to "absolute zero" - and this is what happened "It just acted like two same-value caps in parallel."
When I will get my hands on BG caps, I will publish mercilessly the results.
But will not buy them, because it's not my fixation...
Ciao, George
Ciao Giorgio,
Ti ringrazio molto. I got it know. Now my fixation will be comparing good film caps with " a pair of BG's", both numerically and sonically. I will wait anxiously your results.
To add injury to insult (or whatever it is said in these cases)... to myself, I could even send you a prepared pair. The tough part will be burn in...
Cheers
M
Ti ringrazio molto. I got it know. Now my fixation will be comparing good film caps with " a pair of BG's", both numerically and sonically. I will wait anxiously your results.
To add injury to insult (or whatever it is said in these cases)... to myself, I could even send you a prepared pair. The tough part will be burn in...
Cheers
M
Mauricio,
Excuse me, really. I feel bad, I did use the wrong words, which is stupid, because I really feel respect for You. And wanted to show it and again went wrong..
And don't forget, I don't question what You hear.
Can't think up a reasonable explanation for that, the superE effect is surely not, but then I have at hand 10 different diy interconnects all sounding different - no answer also for that. At least not a simple one.
Now it would be just crazy sending those bits around half of the world, literally. Will try to find some closer solution.. 🙂 But if You want I can measure and put it up in all honesty.. ehm, would try my best..😀
Ciao, George
Excuse me, really. I feel bad, I did use the wrong words, which is stupid, because I really feel respect for You. And wanted to show it and again went wrong..
And don't forget, I don't question what You hear.
Can't think up a reasonable explanation for that, the superE effect is surely not, but then I have at hand 10 different diy interconnects all sounding different - no answer also for that. At least not a simple one.
Now it would be just crazy sending those bits around half of the world, literally. Will try to find some closer solution.. 🙂 But if You want I can measure and put it up in all honesty.. ehm, would try my best..😀
Ciao, George
Ah! Giorgio! Don't feel bad. I'm toughter that you think and tend to allways see good intentions everywhere...even with digital experts, go figure 😀 I am allways "self-flagellating" on posts as rwfbr (what his nick') says...
Rest reasured that I got your meanings as you intended.
As I told you before, I am more strict with method than I show to others just to push others to do things I can't do myself!
Sun in Virgo, ascendant Aquarius, if you know what I mean...
Square methodic guy but strongly attracted by unconventional wisdom.
In this case I surelly hear good things with BG's...perfect? No, they tend to sound unnatural, like "plastic" at first, then this effect vanishes over the weeks.
E sempre un piacere...
M
Rest reasured that I got your meanings as you intended.
As I told you before, I am more strict with method than I show to others just to push others to do things I can't do myself!
Sun in Virgo, ascendant Aquarius, if you know what I mean...
Square methodic guy but strongly attracted by unconventional wisdom.
In this case I surelly hear good things with BG's...perfect? No, they tend to sound unnatural, like "plastic" at first, then this effect vanishes over the weeks.
E sempre un piacere...
M
Klaus,
I too am a TVC user and agree with what you have said earlier in this thread about the qualities of the S&B TVC - but I was not aware that you could use these in autoformer mode - do you have any link to any information about how to do this?
You also mention that you could skip the coupling capacitors if you had a differential (balanced) input on your 2020 amps - what tripath chips have a balanced input (could you eliminate coupling caps on a bridged 2050 by running it balanced?)
David
I too am a TVC user and agree with what you have said earlier in this thread about the qualities of the S&B TVC - but I was not aware that you could use these in autoformer mode - do you have any link to any information about how to do this?
You also mention that you could skip the coupling capacitors if you had a differential (balanced) input on your 2020 amps - what tripath chips have a balanced input (could you eliminate coupling caps on a bridged 2050 by running it balanced?)
David
Ucd400
I have planes to build a hypex Ucd400 stereo amplifier to power my two scanspeak 10" subs. They are in a closed box.
Does anyone have any idea if this will sound good and does the hypex moduls the power to have control over my speakers.
I was thinking abouth using a 800va transformer and a total of abouth 100000uF in the powersupply. Is this big enough?.
Thnks for any help.
I have planes to build a hypex Ucd400 stereo amplifier to power my two scanspeak 10" subs. They are in a closed box.
Does anyone have any idea if this will sound good and does the hypex moduls the power to have control over my speakers.
I was thinking abouth using a 800va transformer and a total of abouth 100000uF in the powersupply. Is this big enough?.
Thnks for any help.
Re: Ucd400
Plenty of control and 'grunt' for woofer applications. You could get away with say 20.000uf per rail in the power supply, 100.000uf is exagerated.
Vigo said:
Plenty of control and 'grunt' for woofer applications. You could get away with say 20.000uf per rail in the power supply, 100.000uf is exagerated.
More Ucd400
Hi i can se on the power supply you can buy fron hypex they hav a dc protection. I would like to have on my powersupply but i dont now how it works. Does anyone have a site or somthing were i can se how to build on.
Thanks for any help.
Hi i can se on the power supply you can buy fron hypex they hav a dc protection. I would like to have on my powersupply but i dont now how it works. Does anyone have a site or somthing were i can se how to build on.
Thanks for any help.
@vigo
I got the Bent TX102 MK3.
I do not have the +6db option connected.
My input looks as it's supposed to be for a standard RCA connection:
Input wireing:
++ hot
-- connected to +
- cold is connected to all other ground/shield leads
To be configured as autotransformer:
Output 0db wire must be bridged to ++ of the input
To avoid a short circuit on the primary you should take the 0db wire off the switch.
You'll loose of course your 0db switch position.
That's about it. It'll take you 10 minutes max.
Klaus
I got the Bent TX102 MK3.
I do not have the +6db option connected.
My input looks as it's supposed to be for a standard RCA connection:
Input wireing:
++ hot
-- connected to +
- cold is connected to all other ground/shield leads
To be configured as autotransformer:
Output 0db wire must be bridged to ++ of the input
To avoid a short circuit on the primary you should take the 0db wire off the switch.
You'll loose of course your 0db switch position.
That's about it. It'll take you 10 minutes max.
Klaus
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