G'Day everyone,
I have posted in the speaker section, but thought that I would ask here, as I know that I tend to forget to look over there when I have my head buried in tube amp stuff.
As you can see on my avatar, I have a Tubelab Simple SE. I also have a pair of Lynn Olson Ariel speakers (91-92dB efficient) with the matching 100 litre stereo bass units. I love these speakers, but I have just purchased an apartment with my girlfriend and there is no room for these speakers. I am looking for a new project - a pair of tube friendly speakers that have reasonable efficiency, reasonable bass response and reasonable sized cabinets. As it is in an apartment, high volume levels are not a requirement. The living area is 5 metres wide by 6.75 metres long, but an L shape with the 'cutout' (kitchen) being 2 metres wide by 3.6 metres long. This then opens out to another 5 metre wide by 4.5 metre long living area. 9 ft ceilings, carpet with good underlay on concrete floors, drywall ceiling. Listen to a mix of music - alternative rock, electronic, jazz, classical. Will watch occasional movie. Might be looking to install a sub for movie use at a future date (probably in ceiling).
Looking to build some PP 6L6 or EL34 amps in the future (maybe Tubelab PP?)
Guessing I need about 89dB min sensitivity? Was very interested in the new Zaph design ZRT with Scan Speak 18W8531G Revelator woofer and the 6600 AirCirc tweeter. However, 2 way is only 85dB efficient and the 2.5 vented is too big (65 litre cabinet). 2.5 sealed may be too demanding of power.
Any suggestions for moderate size reasonable efficiency great detail/sound quality project?
Thanks guys!
(BTW, Ariels for sale, listed in trading post section)
I have posted in the speaker section, but thought that I would ask here, as I know that I tend to forget to look over there when I have my head buried in tube amp stuff.
As you can see on my avatar, I have a Tubelab Simple SE. I also have a pair of Lynn Olson Ariel speakers (91-92dB efficient) with the matching 100 litre stereo bass units. I love these speakers, but I have just purchased an apartment with my girlfriend and there is no room for these speakers. I am looking for a new project - a pair of tube friendly speakers that have reasonable efficiency, reasonable bass response and reasonable sized cabinets. As it is in an apartment, high volume levels are not a requirement. The living area is 5 metres wide by 6.75 metres long, but an L shape with the 'cutout' (kitchen) being 2 metres wide by 3.6 metres long. This then opens out to another 5 metre wide by 4.5 metre long living area. 9 ft ceilings, carpet with good underlay on concrete floors, drywall ceiling. Listen to a mix of music - alternative rock, electronic, jazz, classical. Will watch occasional movie. Might be looking to install a sub for movie use at a future date (probably in ceiling).
Looking to build some PP 6L6 or EL34 amps in the future (maybe Tubelab PP?)
Guessing I need about 89dB min sensitivity? Was very interested in the new Zaph design ZRT with Scan Speak 18W8531G Revelator woofer and the 6600 AirCirc tweeter. However, 2 way is only 85dB efficient and the 2.5 vented is too big (65 litre cabinet). 2.5 sealed may be too demanding of power.
Any suggestions for moderate size reasonable efficiency great detail/sound quality project?
Thanks guys!
(BTW, Ariels for sale, listed in trading post section)
I've been happy with a pair of Audio Nirvana Super 6.5's in a Madisound BK-16 back loaded horn cabinet. The one driver is full range, so it's all very simple with no crossover. I think it's tube amp friendly. Being sensitive to your geography I suppose a similar Fostex driver could be used and their are all sort of similar horn cabs out there.
They're very efficient. I've connected my 6N1P headphone amp to them and got enough sound for background listening. With the Simple SE in triode they absolutely rock! Very forward sounding with good midrange detail. This is quite complimentary to tube amps in my opinion. The horn produces good, but not overwhelming low frequencies, although it may not be as tight as a bass reflex cabinet. The highs are a bit rolled off too, but not so much that it is unpleasant.
Tang Band makes some interesting full range drivers too, but I'm not sure if you can find those in Australia.
They're very efficient. I've connected my 6N1P headphone amp to them and got enough sound for background listening. With the Simple SE in triode they absolutely rock! Very forward sounding with good midrange detail. This is quite complimentary to tube amps in my opinion. The horn produces good, but not overwhelming low frequencies, although it may not be as tight as a bass reflex cabinet. The highs are a bit rolled off too, but not so much that it is unpleasant.
Tang Band makes some interesting full range drivers too, but I'm not sure if you can find those in Australia.
chrish said:I also have a pair of Lynn Olson Ariel speakers (91-92dB efficient) with the matching 100 litre stereo bass units. I love these speakers, but I have just purchased an apartment with my girlfriend and there is no room for these speakers.
(BTW, Ariels for sale, listed in trading post section)
I have yet to "love" a speaker I made. If you really love those Ariels, take them off the market and build ME2 cabinets for them:
http://www.nutshellhifi.com/ME2txt.html#me2
Thanks for the suggestions. As for turning them in to ME2s, I don't think I could stand pulling them apart for the drivers. Much work went in to creating them, they deserve a loving home. As for full range driver speakers, I have built two pairs of mini fonkens. They are great for the office, but I am not really that interested in a single driver solution at this stage.
Thanks again guys!
Chris
Thanks again guys!
Chris
Hi Chris,
If you are thinking of selling, drop me a line. I am looking for a decent pair of speakers and I was really thinking of buying a pair over the next couple of months. It would depend a bit on the physical size but certainly drop me a line if you are serious about offloading.
Cheers,
Rob
If you are thinking of selling, drop me a line. I am looking for a decent pair of speakers and I was really thinking of buying a pair over the next couple of months. It would depend a bit on the physical size but certainly drop me a line if you are serious about offloading.
Cheers,
Rob
Yep, I have committed to letting them go...
Here is link in trading post section of this forum http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=126827
There is a link in that thread that details the build process, so you can see what went in to them and what they look like. If they have not gone by the time I get to Sydney, you will be able to audition them
Cheers
Here is link in trading post section of this forum http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=126827
There is a link in that thread that details the build process, so you can see what went in to them and what they look like. If they have not gone by the time I get to Sydney, you will be able to audition them
Cheers
Have you considered Hugh Dean's VSonics. Oz design.
These are Transmission Line design.
89dB/W/m - you would need that push pull 6L6/EL34
8 Ohm nominal
9 inches wide, approx 12 inches deep, just under 3ft tall.
http://www.aksaonline.com/products/products_Vsonics.html
Cheers,
Ian
These are Transmission Line design.
89dB/W/m - you would need that push pull 6L6/EL34
8 Ohm nominal
9 inches wide, approx 12 inches deep, just under 3ft tall.
http://www.aksaonline.com/products/products_Vsonics.html
Cheers,
Ian
Chris,
Another OZ option if you don't mind going back to Bass Reflex design.
http://www.vaf.com.au/detail.asp?audio=dc&grunt=s200r26725
93 dB/W/m 6 Ohms Nominal.
The Kits come as fully assembled cabinets and all bits including drivers. All you have to do is screw in the drivers, put in the stuffing and wire the things. Last time I was in the shop they offered to sell me the fully assembled and tested units at the Kit Price. If you decide to go this path give them a ring and negotiate.
They do some tricky mods to the Bass/Mid drivers with felt pads to change the Qms. Cabinet Construction is a tapered lossy line so takes on some aspects of a transmission line. They have good self damping characteristics which makes them ideal for low damping factor tube amps.
I use VAF DC-X (the older model NOT the new DC-X Generation 4) at home on the Baby Huey's.
One of my apprentices runs DC-7 Gen4 and borrowed the original Baby Huey (the one with the CCS in the output tube cathodes) to drive them.
Cheers,
Ian
Another OZ option if you don't mind going back to Bass Reflex design.
http://www.vaf.com.au/detail.asp?audio=dc&grunt=s200r26725
93 dB/W/m 6 Ohms Nominal.
The Kits come as fully assembled cabinets and all bits including drivers. All you have to do is screw in the drivers, put in the stuffing and wire the things. Last time I was in the shop they offered to sell me the fully assembled and tested units at the Kit Price. If you decide to go this path give them a ring and negotiate.
They do some tricky mods to the Bass/Mid drivers with felt pads to change the Qms. Cabinet Construction is a tapered lossy line so takes on some aspects of a transmission line. They have good self damping characteristics which makes them ideal for low damping factor tube amps.
I use VAF DC-X (the older model NOT the new DC-X Generation 4) at home on the Baby Huey's.
One of my apprentices runs DC-7 Gen4 and borrowed the original Baby Huey (the one with the CCS in the output tube cathodes) to drive them.
Cheers,
Ian
Re: tube friendly. hmmmm?
All the links in my signature....
The PP (at least in UL or Pentode) sould be best if you do a speaker with an XO (althou i personally think most XOs are "evil"), the SE wants something simple, single driver or single driver with very help (and very simple XO, if the help is at the bottom, preferably active).
dave
klm1 said:Check out planet-10's site, also transmission line speakers site
(use search function)
Lowther, Celestion, Fostex, Tannoy- just to get you started...
All the links in my signature....
The PP (at least in UL or Pentode) sould be best if you do a speaker with an XO (althou i personally think most XOs are "evil"), the SE wants something simple, single driver or single driver with very help (and very simple XO, if the help is at the bottom, preferably active).
dave
Ian,
Those BR speakers you linked are interesting. However, I think a few grains of salt have to be taken, along with the claims. The impedance is 6 Ohms nominal. What does the impedance curve look like? Are there substantial dips in the impedance curve, particularly in the bass region? The 93 dB. sensitivity spec. is midleading. 2.83 V. into 6 Ohms is 1.33 W.
For purposes of mating with a tube amp, I'm inclined to regard those speakers as 4 Ohm/90 dB. sensitive. Still, even with that conservative set of numbers, a PP amp built around EL34s or 7591s should be dandy. IMO, it makes good sense to have switching between UL and triode modes. Save the extra 3 dB. UL provides for large scale orchestral works and "head banger" Rock. Triode mode should be fine for just about every other musical type.
Those BR speakers you linked are interesting. However, I think a few grains of salt have to be taken, along with the claims. The impedance is 6 Ohms nominal. What does the impedance curve look like? Are there substantial dips in the impedance curve, particularly in the bass region? The 93 dB. sensitivity spec. is midleading. 2.83 V. into 6 Ohms is 1.33 W.
For purposes of mating with a tube amp, I'm inclined to regard those speakers as 4 Ohm/90 dB. sensitive. Still, even with that conservative set of numbers, a PP amp built around EL34s or 7591s should be dandy. IMO, it makes good sense to have switching between UL and triode modes. Save the extra 3 dB. UL provides for large scale orchestral works and "head banger" Rock. Triode mode should be fine for just about every other musical type.
These are tube freindly
http://tpluspod.com/rtl/fostex PVChorn.html
Just joking
I have heard a lot of good things about the Decware High Definition Towers (HDT). You can buy the plans, as a kit, or fully assembled.
http://www.decware.com/
in the speaker section.
http://tpluspod.com/rtl/fostex PVChorn.html
Just joking
I have heard a lot of good things about the Decware High Definition Towers (HDT). You can buy the plans, as a kit, or fully assembled.
http://www.decware.com/
in the speaker section.
Attachments
Picture of the Decware HDT.
They are using a modified version of the Fostex FE206E.
Lowther drivers are also tube friendly ... but with a higher pricetag.
http://www.quinceton.com/lowther/lowther_main.htm
They are using a modified version of the Fostex FE206E.
Lowther drivers are also tube friendly ... but with a higher pricetag.
http://www.quinceton.com/lowther/lowther_main.htm
Attachments
I'm using my Simple SE with Omega XRS:
http://www.omegaloudspeakers.com/super3xrs.html
Its not a project, but this amp/speaker combo is truly amazing. It sounds best to me in triode mode with no cfb, I'm using Tung Sol 6550 reissues. The XRS are a good choice for a small apartment as well.
http://www.omegaloudspeakers.com/super3xrs.html
Its not a project, but this amp/speaker combo is truly amazing. It sounds best to me in triode mode with no cfb, I'm using Tung Sol 6550 reissues. The XRS are a good choice for a small apartment as well.
It's a little below your desired efficiency, and I am predjudiced... but I would recommend something based on a Jordan JX-92S:
http://www.pmillett.com/jx92s.htm
Pete
http://www.pmillett.com/jx92s.htm
Pete
You know, a simple Fostex FE 167e in a small bass reflex box works very nicely. If you want to add a sub later you can, but these will give a solid 60hz. Want more? The FE207e's work great in a BR box, too (will hit high 40's). Check out Bob Brines site for more ideas. On the 167 you can use one of the smaller Parts Express boxes and it will look great. MY day-to-day speaker is a JBL 2226 in BR with an Edgar horn on top, not an apartment friendly speaker, but when I was in an appartment last year, the 167's did a very credible job.
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