I can't answer your question but would ask why not go down the 'China route' that so many use. Everyone always seems highly delighted at the quality.
If it would be any help the above posts could be copied and duplicated into a new thread asking that specific question (UK based production) and cross linked with this one. It would probably generate a lot more interest as this is one is very specific.
If it would be any help the above posts could be copied and duplicated into a new thread asking that specific question (UK based production) and cross linked with this one. It would probably generate a lot more interest as this is one is very specific.
I would recommend JLCPCB in China, if you use a courier such as DHL or FedEx, you get the boards fairly quick with minimum hassle from customs.
If I may, and not wanting to start a posting war, I would suggest a PCB shop not in China if you want to maintain some degree of control of your intellectual property.
Mike
Mike
If you are okay with lower profit margins, support local manufacturing. I also use JLCPCB and can't say anything bad about them, but if I was to sell boards commercially, they would be made in Germany (or at least the EU). Shouldn't be too hard to fill a panel with Signal Transfer Company PCBs and get fairly reasonable prices in the UK as well.
If you want that, dont sell PCB's at all - if someone really wants to clone them, they would simply buy them, scan them, and do it that way
I do not think IP is an issue. Ask your fab to sign your NDA
I wonder how many pcb fabs are actually in the UK. You must realize that in the past many fabs charged you a setup fee which can be a fair % of the cost if not amourtize over a large order or if you plan to order more later. The Chinese fabs are special where they do not charge these large setup fees. I think it is due to improved automated panelization or worker bees work fast. You’ll find out when you get your quote.
I wonder how many pcb fabs are actually in the UK. You must realize that in the past many fabs charged you a setup fee which can be a fair % of the cost if not amourtize over a large order or if you plan to order more later. The Chinese fabs are special where they do not charge these large setup fees. I think it is due to improved automated panelization or worker bees work fast. You’ll find out when you get your quote.
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Volumes?
How many square feet per batch?
Screen Printing?
Material?
Foil Thickness?
Payment Terms?
Indian companies are taking up the lower volume space abandoned by the Chinese.
UK the youngsters are barely educated, will not work on the shop floor.
Have fun
Here I know a shop who can design the board from circuit diagram, their minimum quantity is 500 credit card sized boards, tinned pads, screen printed, punched.
How many square feet per batch?
Screen Printing?
Material?
Foil Thickness?
Payment Terms?
Indian companies are taking up the lower volume space abandoned by the Chinese.
UK the youngsters are barely educated, will not work on the shop floor.
Have fun
Here I know a shop who can design the board from circuit diagram, their minimum quantity is 500 credit card sized boards, tinned pads, screen printed, punched.
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Oh gosh. Is this some kind of rant over the neighbor and the former colonial rulers? This is an audio forum, not reddit or whatever.
The Chinese will do pretty much any quantity.
The youngsters in the UK are definitely not undereducated to work in PCB manufacturing.
You probably don't want some guy at the board house doing your PCB layout, I certainly wouldn't want that.
I don't understand why so many here don't respect the fact that Mr. Self specifically asked for a UK based manufacturer?!
The Chinese will do pretty much any quantity.
The youngsters in the UK are definitely not undereducated to work in PCB manufacturing.
You probably don't want some guy at the board house doing your PCB layout, I certainly wouldn't want that.
I don't understand why so many here don't respect the fact that Mr. Self specifically asked for a UK based manufacturer?!
Start listing them, I did a quick goggle search and found many to choose from. I am amazed that anyone designing/living in the UK all there life, do not know of a pcb mfr that they used in the past for both personal and business. If you were in Canada/US I could recommend many I have experience with. I know Elektor uses Euro-circuits exclusively. @NareshBrd post is out in left field somewhere.
Doug asked for help since he obviously does not order many boards. If he choses UK fab, the cost adjustments apply compared to where ever the last batch was done. He will find out once he does quoting.
It is so easy these days with Asian fabs, compared to working with local shops. See if a UK shop can upload your zip file, show a pic of your pcb layer set, instant quote, mfr in 2-3 days, deliver to your door in one week.
You determine, if that matters at all to your business 🙂
Good Luck Rick
Doug asked for help since he obviously does not order many boards. If he choses UK fab, the cost adjustments apply compared to where ever the last batch was done. He will find out once he does quoting.
It is so easy these days with Asian fabs, compared to working with local shops. See if a UK shop can upload your zip file, show a pic of your pcb layer set, instant quote, mfr in 2-3 days, deliver to your door in one week.
You determine, if that matters at all to your business 🙂
Good Luck Rick
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My point has been well made by rsavas.
It is not a colonial rant, a simple statement that the volumes are low, and so it becomes a cost factor that the effort required to design the board has to be distributed over the number of copies, to use a printing comparison of sorts...
Let us say the design charges are 50 dollars, and he wants 100 boards, so 50 cents are added per board.
For 1000 boards it is 5 cents only.
The testing jig is the expensive item, if it is needed.
And the photo etching screens, and so on, so what happens is that for a small batch the per unit cost goes into multiples of what it would cost in a larger batch.
Anyway, I wonder what happened to his existing supplier, which made it necessary to ask for a new one.
In pandemic times, all sorts of shortages have occurred.
I have a neighbor, called Aimtron, they have 2 SMD lines and one through hole line, they make populated PCBs for a world wide clientele...so I am aware of the goings on here compared to China, and why the orders come to India...among them is confidentiality.
It is not a colonial rant, a simple statement that the volumes are low, and so it becomes a cost factor that the effort required to design the board has to be distributed over the number of copies, to use a printing comparison of sorts...
Let us say the design charges are 50 dollars, and he wants 100 boards, so 50 cents are added per board.
For 1000 boards it is 5 cents only.
The testing jig is the expensive item, if it is needed.
And the photo etching screens, and so on, so what happens is that for a small batch the per unit cost goes into multiples of what it would cost in a larger batch.
Anyway, I wonder what happened to his existing supplier, which made it necessary to ask for a new one.
In pandemic times, all sorts of shortages have occurred.
I have a neighbor, called Aimtron, they have 2 SMD lines and one through hole line, they make populated PCBs for a world wide clientele...so I am aware of the goings on here compared to China, and why the orders come to India...among them is confidentiality.
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I posted this too..."Here I know a shop who can design the board from circuit diagram, their minimum quantity is 500 credit card sized boards, tinned pads, screen printed, punched."
It was a statement of capability, and offer of alternate supply from a source that maintains secrecy, not really a rant.
That is why I asked for the board specifications like size and foil thickness and so on.
It was a statement of capability, and offer of alternate supply from a source that maintains secrecy, not really a rant.
That is why I asked for the board specifications like size and foil thickness and so on.
Places like JLCPCB and SEEED do 10 boards up to 100 x 100mm for $ 4.90.
No other cost. Your choice of colors and thickness. Shipping exceeds board costs usually, but if you want 50 or 100 cost are ridiculously low. No one in EU or UK can beat that.
I have been comparing the quality to established EU houses like eurocircuits.com - no difference.
And nobody is interested in your layout, what with hundreds of them passing through the shop each day.
Jan
No other cost. Your choice of colors and thickness. Shipping exceeds board costs usually, but if you want 50 or 100 cost are ridiculously low. No one in EU or UK can beat that.
I have been comparing the quality to established EU houses like eurocircuits.com - no difference.
And nobody is interested in your layout, what with hundreds of them passing through the shop each day.
Jan
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Bit late to this, but I’ve getting all my boards made in China for the last 5 yrs - no issues with delivery and others have indicated, superb prices and quality.
I tried using a UK based board house and got a quote for £700. The same boards from China were £80 (excl shipping which was another £50).
Doug, you will not be disappointed with the quality or service provided by JLCPCB in Hong Kong. Nelson Pass uses PCBWay in China for all his non Passlabs boards and recommends them as well.
I used to send all my files to a domestic manufacturer, right up to when I discovered they were simply outsourcing the manufacturing to Chinese fabs and whacking on a healthy profit margin, plus an extra week.
One thing I dislike about PCBWay is that the price is always subject to internal review. I uploaded GERBERs there twice or so, but the updated price after review was significantly higher than before, upwards of 25% increase iirc. But as far as manufacturing capabilities go, PCBWay is probably among the best Chinese board houses that advertise to us western DIYers/Makers/whatever.
Thanks everyone for the advice.
The Signal Transfer boards were indeed made in China. Quality was excellent (as some of you can testify) prices good and turnaround very fast. If I ever get Gareth to speak to me again that would be the route I would choose, but I have no contact details and don't even know the name of the company he used.
Never had any problems with theft of IP that I know of.
Combined with the appalling problems created by Brexit, it seems easier to deal with a mainland company, even if that does cut the profit margin. It is possible I may to have to raise the prices a bit to make things workable.
The Signal Transfer boards were indeed made in China. Quality was excellent (as some of you can testify) prices good and turnaround very fast. If I ever get Gareth to speak to me again that would be the route I would choose, but I have no contact details and don't even know the name of the company he used.
Never had any problems with theft of IP that I know of.
Combined with the appalling problems created by Brexit, it seems easier to deal with a mainland company, even if that does cut the profit margin. It is possible I may to have to raise the prices a bit to make things workable.
I use these guys also
NextPCB - Next Day Get Your PCB
You should try by giving them a small order, if that works, then use them for your main orders.
I'm getting high quality boards in about 4-5 days from China (I'm in the UK BTW)
NextPCB - Next Day Get Your PCB
You should try by giving them a small order, if that works, then use them for your main orders.
I'm getting high quality boards in about 4-5 days from China (I'm in the UK BTW)
There are many suppliers in China, and many users of their services seem to have no problem with Brexit.
So what is your issue with finding another Chinese supplier?
If you had access to the records of the company, the invoices should be there, or payments records.
You mean to say your old partner put the word out that anybody supplying to Douglas Self will be punished?
He is some sort of mafia or ruffian?
That is fantastic....for a few hundred pounds worth nobody goes to that extent.
Deal with your fears.
Chinese suppliers seem to be earnest, and fast.
And don't worry about IP, the copied boards would have been out long back if the seller decided it was worth it.
Same as Bose 901 speakers, the patents expired long back, 1990 as per the Google Patent Office tie up, nobody bothered to copy them.
So what is your issue with finding another Chinese supplier?
If you had access to the records of the company, the invoices should be there, or payments records.
You mean to say your old partner put the word out that anybody supplying to Douglas Self will be punished?
He is some sort of mafia or ruffian?
That is fantastic....for a few hundred pounds worth nobody goes to that extent.
Deal with your fears.
Chinese suppliers seem to be earnest, and fast.
And don't worry about IP, the copied boards would have been out long back if the seller decided it was worth it.
Same as Bose 901 speakers, the patents expired long back, 1990 as per the Google Patent Office tie up, nobody bothered to copy them.
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