First of all, I strictly adhere that brighter is better no matter what. Some don't think so, but I'm not one of them.
Secondly, I don't recall anyone claiming that MH was a million times brighter than Halogen. The color differences are there. The thing is that w/ a DIY projector, your really have to use the absolute best equipment you can to have something that will compare to a commercially bought LCD projector.
And the last things is the heat. That is the number one major problem with halogen. For every lumen of halogen, your putting out a lot more heat than every lumen on MH. My 11k lumen MH is extremely hot, and the fan is annoyingly loud because of it. A non-air-conditioned, closed window room will heat up during the course of a viewing. And it's a stinky humid kind of heat. Not good. I can only imagine how bad a halogen that puts out that much light would be.
Secondly, I don't recall anyone claiming that MH was a million times brighter than Halogen. The color differences are there. The thing is that w/ a DIY projector, your really have to use the absolute best equipment you can to have something that will compare to a commercially bought LCD projector.
And the last things is the heat. That is the number one major problem with halogen. For every lumen of halogen, your putting out a lot more heat than every lumen on MH. My 11k lumen MH is extremely hot, and the fan is annoyingly loud because of it. A non-air-conditioned, closed window room will heat up during the course of a viewing. And it's a stinky humid kind of heat. Not good. I can only imagine how bad a halogen that puts out that much light would be.
Re: Okay, some answers
mmm...we might have to agree to disagree on this one
mmm....what I actually said was:
Both my 12000 lumens MH and my Halogen are extremely quiet. They both have these long cylindrical fans that are highly efficient - you can see what I mean if you look at the auction pic. in the link above.
However, the climate in the UK is somewhat different to the Californian climate.
Aircon ? we should be so lucky!
Lifter said:
mmm...we might have to agree to disagree on this one
Lifter said:
mmm....what I actually said was:
henrik_mork said:
Lifter said:
Both my 12000 lumens MH and my Halogen are extremely quiet. They both have these long cylindrical fans that are highly efficient - you can see what I mean if you look at the auction pic. in the link above.
However, the climate in the UK is somewhat different to the Californian climate.
Aircon ? we should be so lucky!
Hey, I'm not trying to hurt your sales or anything. I have the cylindrical fan too (those things are called crossflow blowers). It's not that bad, but combined with the fans I need to keep the LCD cool, it is annoying.
the 3m 1/10 looks best to me. good colors and (by the pic) good black levels. bright isnt always best. there has to be a balance or everything looks washed out.
stangely, before I looked at pictures I took, I thought elmo was a little bit brighter. But I couldn't compare them side by side (only have one good working bulb, and there is only one projection screen).
And believe me, after a minute or so the 3m looked as good as others to me 🙂. I have trusted my eyes for such a long time
And believe me, after a minute or so the 3m looked as good as others to me 🙂. I have trusted my eyes for such a long time
ap0the0sis said:
no, no, no, it was overexposed. the real picture is dimmer. It was hard to make out the dark scenes when I was playing Matix.
EDIT:
It maybe to do with the color temperature. 3M is "warmer". thus makes picture rich in red/orange color.
3m is watchable. Other two didn't have problem with the dark scenes. I agree the bright scenes were a little bit washed out. but better LCD screen may give you better black.
I don't think I can use 3m with any light on, but other two seemed to be fine as long as there were no direct light shining on the screen.
I don't think I can use 3m with any light on, but other two seemed to be fine as long as there were no direct light shining on the screen.
IMHO....
The 3M looks pretty good to me....look at the richness of the colours on the left and right-hand sides of the top image.....mmmmmm...lovely and warm, just like cinema should be.
I guess the image you would prefer might vary on the era of movies you like watching. If you liked some of the later 1950's Bogart movies for instance, you might well prefer the warmer image. If you are watching T3, or the Matrix, you might prefer the starker, colder image.
Do you think this debate could be likened to the one that raged (and still does rage) between vinyl record junkies, and the CD audio perfectionists??
There are parallels for certain.
Anyway, I will be back with more testing, just as soon as I get into my new house!
The 3M looks pretty good to me....look at the richness of the colours on the left and right-hand sides of the top image.....mmmmmm...lovely and warm, just like cinema should be.
I guess the image you would prefer might vary on the era of movies you like watching. If you liked some of the later 1950's Bogart movies for instance, you might well prefer the warmer image. If you are watching T3, or the Matrix, you might prefer the starker, colder image.
Do you think this debate could be likened to the one that raged (and still does rage) between vinyl record junkies, and the CD audio perfectionists??
There are parallels for certain.
Anyway, I will be back with more testing, just as soon as I get into my new house!
Re: IMHO....
I would like to love 9550 too, IF my eyes can do 1/10" shutter speed like my camera does 😀. Because of the "speed" of my eyes, it looks more like the one in 1/20" 🙁
So, anyone know if there is a special pair of eyeglasses that enhance my eye 'speed' ?
By the way, f/2 1/8" gives right exposure for 3M, and f/2 1/20" gives right exposure for elmo and dukane ( well, more or less.)
henrik_mork said:
I would like to love 9550 too, IF my eyes can do 1/10" shutter speed like my camera does 😀. Because of the "speed" of my eyes, it looks more like the one in 1/20" 🙁
So, anyone know if there is a special pair of eyeglasses that enhance my eye 'speed' ?By the way, f/2 1/8" gives right exposure for 3M, and f/2 1/20" gives right exposure for elmo and dukane ( well, more or less.)
The problem with this comparison is that the gamma and contrast settings would need to be adjusted for each OHP.
HM, are you adjusting them to look as good as it can for each one?
HM, are you adjusting them to look as good as it can for each one?
No - I've yet to make the refinements you suggested and re-run the tests - I will get round to it sooner or later.
18 wheeler's pics are a little bit closer to the mark though, aren't they.....I think I get the idea about exposure 18W, but can you allow fo the fact that your eyes 'adjust' during watching to maximise and optomise the image you're viewing - for example, when our TV broke down recently, and we were forced to use a 14" portable in a medium-sized room, it seemed tiny to begin with, and I didn't like the really convex screen it had.
However, after being engrossed in a movie or program for 30 minutes or so - I "forgot" that I was watching a matchbox-sized screen, and really enjoyed the show anyway.
What I mean is, I wasn't all the time thinking "my god, how tiny is this!"
Just MHO....
18 wheeler's pics are a little bit closer to the mark though, aren't they.....I think I get the idea about exposure 18W, but can you allow fo the fact that your eyes 'adjust' during watching to maximise and optomise the image you're viewing - for example, when our TV broke down recently, and we were forced to use a 14" portable in a medium-sized room, it seemed tiny to begin with, and I didn't like the really convex screen it had.
However, after being engrossed in a movie or program for 30 minutes or so - I "forgot" that I was watching a matchbox-sized screen, and really enjoyed the show anyway.
What I mean is, I wasn't all the time thinking "my god, how tiny is this!"
Just MHO....
I've got an Elmo 305-sd and It pretty much looks just like 18W, there's kind of this cold-steel-blueish look to it, I can warm it up a bit with adjustments but when you get scenes that show a lot of white ie: snow there's just no getting past it.
remember HQI has two temp: 3200k and 4000k. I am wondering if HQI people should get 3200K in order to have this 'warm' color?
remeber our HMI575 bulbs are 6000k color temp. I have been thinking that they have too much blue in them for my liking as well. I think the 4200k should be about perfect, most halogens are 3200k and I dont care for the excess of red tint this tends to produce.
Hey guys, I'm currently usin an 250w HQI with 4000k (or 4200k, can't remember) colour temp, and I find that it's really just perfect for computing/movies. I know that images aren't very good for indicating since cameras can compensate etc, but I took these photos taking this into account and doing my best to represent it as best as possible. But images aside, I personally find the colour reproduction with 4000/4200k to be perfect and not too warm not too cold.
Keep in mind the wall is a pale pale green so everything has a slight greenish tinge. Check out the following movie too:
Fifth Element
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An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Keep in mind the wall is a pale pale green so everything has a slight greenish tinge. Check out the following movie too:
Fifth Element
-rep
Still think it comes down to the mood of the material you are watching
A luscious 1960's Technicolor extravaganza of a film (i.e. Italian Job, The Great Escape, or any Sean Connery Bond movie for instance)
or on the other hand
any action / sci-fi or similar type movies from the 1990's onwards.
These two different film types would probably benefit from from halogen and MH respectively.
Not to say halogen does not have a place in helping project current movie material - IMHO something like LOTR - The Two Towers, would thrive in the glow of a warmer light.
A luscious 1960's Technicolor extravaganza of a film (i.e. Italian Job, The Great Escape, or any Sean Connery Bond movie for instance)
or on the other hand
any action / sci-fi or similar type movies from the 1990's onwards.
These two different film types would probably benefit from from halogen and MH respectively.
Not to say halogen does not have a place in helping project current movie material - IMHO something like LOTR - The Two Towers, would thrive in the glow of a warmer light.
Well, considering in most cases we'll probably only have one OHP and one bulb, it'd be best to go down the middle so we could watch the most material enjoyably. Rather than having to watch -everything- in a certain cast. I suppose you could pretty easily have 3 bulbs.. but I like to rely on the film's own color cast based on neutral light sources for ambience.
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just to qualify heat output: halogen=more heat per lumen,
but, as the the MH has more lumens e.g. by a factor of three, then the heat output is pretty similar.
This is my experience having tried both, anyone got different?
but, as the the MH has more lumens e.g. by a factor of three, then the heat output is pretty similar.
This is my experience having tried both, anyone got different?
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