Only if you have one of those old Victrola or Edison players. Otherwise, you're producing an electrical signal from the relative motion of a coil and a magnet, running it through some amplification, and equalizing electronically. Along the way, you introduce errors from the cutting and stamping process, and errors from the vinyl compliance and the stylus/armature inertia. Throw in the inevitable pitch instability, variables in surface friction, and intrinsic cartridge noise, and what you have is something different than what came out of the mikes. You may prefer it, and many do, but you have to recognize that it's a series of distortions and colorations.
I think your statement "there is something about a turntable that transcends the music" is right on the money. There's ritual and imperfection all along the way, and that can be appealing in its own right.
Ever heard of Johnson noise? Magnetic domain size? Vinyl particle size?Dumbledog said:
No. Vinyl plays an analogue of sound. Just like a tape deck.Dumbledog said:
There is more distortion, more noise, more ripples in frequency response, more wow/flutter (analogous to digital jitter). Some interpet these problems as increased 'detail'.
What I am getting at in my original post is that with vinyl you have an element that is actually producing sound vibrations. The needle. Next time you have a vinyl playing put your ear next to the cartridge. The needle is playing music, which is magnetically picked up. A tape skips the point of producing vibrations and goes straight to the magnetic pickup of a signal. I might not have been clear but that was the distinction I was trying to make as a potential complication in the proper design of a turntable. You have to account for an element that is dealing with actual acoustic vibrations.
And yes, I have heard of all those things. Those are all of what I consider to be the practical limits of the design. You can counteract them through certain design elements, but there is a practical limit where more resources poured into counteracting them is not going to solve the problem. This practical limit prevents analogue from having the ideal circumstance of infinite variability. And the same applies to distortion, noise, flutter.... All can be overcome with design, IN THEORY. in practice, not so much
Sadly, Johnson noise occurs in theory as well as practice. Curiously, the theory and the practice agree! Hence the 'infinite variability' of analogue is not an 'ideal circumstance' but a 'mythical circumstance'. Limits to performance found in practice often occur in good theory too; it is naive theory which can miss them.
I didn't pick up that you were listing complications in the design of a turntable. I thought you were praising analogue for recording real sound, instead of mere data.
I didn't pick up that you were listing complications in the design of a turntable. I thought you were praising analogue for recording real sound, instead of mere data.
hahahahaha!!!!
Analog was all about polishing the hardware. Digital doesn't care so much if the hardware is polished. Polishing your Johnson may or may not improve your analog experience.
hahahahaha!!!!
Analog was all about polishing the hardware. Digital doesn't care so much if the hardware is polished. Polishing your Johnson may or may not improve your analog experience.
Jokes aside, the polishing is really what I am getting on about. Polished hardware=$$$$$$$ That is the single biggest advantage of digital is that there is minimal need for polishing. It is more cost efficient, which matters for many people. And, since there is minimal need for polishing, digital is more consistent- it doesn't matter if 'there is dust in the finish'.
But, polished stuff is more pretty
if i want to hear pure analogue i get my guitar out and strum away, anything else is just false. i don't care what people say and how good a system is everything reproduced threw an amplified signal is a representation and not the real thing. we all have different ears so we all hear different things even someone playing an acoustic guitar in front of them will hear it different to another person sitting next to them. if your system 'sounds good' to you then that's all that matters. people can keep chasing that 'perfect sound' but you will never ever get it. what you will get is a sound tailored to your ears be it digital or analogue source.
listen to the music not the system.
listen to the music not the system.
Ok, analogue we have record albums (vinyl LPs), R-2-R tapes, cassette tapes, VHS tapes, Beta tapes, 8-track tapes, Laser discs, tuners, any other ones?
And with that we have turntables, cartridges, tonearms, phono stages, Open Reel tape decks (play/record), analog preamps, cassette tape decks (play/record), VHS and Beta tape recorders/players, 8-track tape players, laser disc players, AM/FM analog radio tuners, analogue amplifiers, analogue interconnects, analog AC power chords, analog RCA and XLR jacks, analogue speaker wires, analog loudspeakers, analogue musical instruments, analog microphones, analogue musicians and singers, analogue venues (concert halls, discotheques, cabarets, clubs, auditoriums, ...), analogue listeners, ...analog world.
The future of analogue sources is in the hands of analogue people. ...The analog makers (recording engineers) and the analog listeners and the analog buyers.
The question is: what percentage analogue music represents today in comparison to the digital music. ...And five years ago, and ten years ago, and twenty years ago?
...So that we can have a rough idea of what it could be five, ten, twenty years from now.
Anything else is just cheap whiskey.
Eventually we'll all live in a total virtual world, and physicality will take the seaside of the ocean.
Our rooms will be less encumbered with remnants and debris, and we'll have our paintings and flowers back.
And no matter what, even a thousand years from now, analogue will still have a place in our heart.
And with that we have turntables, cartridges, tonearms, phono stages, Open Reel tape decks (play/record), analog preamps, cassette tape decks (play/record), VHS and Beta tape recorders/players, 8-track tape players, laser disc players, AM/FM analog radio tuners, analogue amplifiers, analogue interconnects, analog AC power chords, analog RCA and XLR jacks, analogue speaker wires, analog loudspeakers, analogue musical instruments, analog microphones, analogue musicians and singers, analogue venues (concert halls, discotheques, cabarets, clubs, auditoriums, ...), analogue listeners, ...analog world.
The future of analogue sources is in the hands of analogue people. ...The analog makers (recording engineers) and the analog listeners and the analog buyers.
The question is: what percentage analogue music represents today in comparison to the digital music. ...And five years ago, and ten years ago, and twenty years ago?
...So that we can have a rough idea of what it could be five, ten, twenty years from now.
Anything else is just cheap whiskey.
Eventually we'll all live in a total virtual world, and physicality will take the seaside of the ocean.
Our rooms will be less encumbered with remnants and debris, and we'll have our paintings and flowers back.
And no matter what, even a thousand years from now, analogue will still have a place in our heart.
Jokes aside, the polishing is really what I am getting on about. Polished hardware=$$$$$$$ That is the single biggest advantage of digital is that there is minimal need for polishing. It is more cost efficient, which matters for many people. And, since there is minimal need for polishing, digital is more consistent- it doesn't matter if 'there is dust in the finish'.
But, polished stuff is more pretty
Yes, of course. Digital was invented not just because they thought it could be better, but because it would be easier to mass produce at a lower cost. At least, that's my understanding.
I only have analogue acoustic musical instruments left in my music collection; I burned down all my digital electric guitars, pedals, amps, and all.
I listen to my analogue sound system without electricity!
The fire, the wildlife, the jungle, the woman's scream (moaning) at night from the bedroom's window, the snow caps melting, the avalanches, the volcanoes' eruptions, the wind, the wind, the wind ... the rain, the ocean's waves, the stampedes, the earth's shaking, trembling, opening, quaking, children playing and singing, ducks surfing, and people living real life outside and playing music and travelling and real troubadours ....
_________
_________
Bob, the joke is that for young people vinyl is 'in', they buy LPs without even having a turntable to play it on! Never discount the power of nostalgia ...
Me... My fist vinyl preceded my turntable by 8 days. But vinyl has a contagious quality to it. My roommate just bought a vinyl so he can play it on my table. Granted, it was the Beverly Hills Cop soundtrack.
Digital is making some progress in the last few years, since 1983 the year of the 'perfect' resolution/revolving revolution of the compact disc (Sony/Philips).
And analog (albums) are abundant south and north of the border. ...America.
Plus London Drugs have some brand new ones too (physical stores), but without them turntables to play them albums.
Tomorrow we might see a resurgence with cassette tapes; hold on real tight to your hat!
If it sells, people will buy it; anything!
And analog (albums) are abundant south and north of the border. ...America.
Plus London Drugs have some brand new ones too (physical stores), but without them turntables to play them albums.
Tomorrow we might see a resurgence with cassette tapes; hold on real tight to your hat!
If it sells, people will buy it; anything!
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