I really have to ask you to define happiness.
I have arrived at a system which I think is the most accurate I have had, and I certainly would not describe my resultant state as what most would say is happiness.
It's a realisation of the wide variety of recording quality, and that the system does not mask that; the result a constant awareness of what has been done in the recording process.
But at least I am free of all that; "The top is a bit screechy, so I bought these speaker cables and they tamed it BS.
Linn
Hey John!
I hope you are happy and healthy...having spent a while working for a Linn dealer as well as installing and using many Technics SP-10s (MKI> III) at radio stations, I have had the chance to audition, modify and test quite a few TTs, both for enthusiast and broadcast use. I evaluated these systems with a Sound Technology 1510 and I wish I had the results here, but the thermal printouts are looooong gone.
In my experience, the most outstanding attributes of the Linn are:
1) Suspension isolation. Especially of it's time (1980s-1990s) it was much better isolated from external vibration than just about all others I had tested. The only higher degree of isolation I have measured was from an SP-10 mounted in a suspended marble isolation plinth made by Mitchell Cotter here in Chapel Hill, more about this later...
2) Rigidity of link between the tonearm and platter bearing. Very little differential movement is possible with their design.
3) Quiet center bearing assy.
The biggest problems with the Linn were:
1) Speed accuracy. It varies with the age of the belt and temperature.
2) W&F relative to the best DDs measured (SP-10 MKIII, Luxman 4xx series DDs). It varies with the age of the belt and temperature.
3) Ittok in conjunction with Linn carts have low compliance and distort on highly modulated LPs.
This being said, the isolation of the Linn was really good and it gave a better black background than most other TTs.
The Technics SP-10 MKIII is an amazing beast; W&F <0.02%, rumble & noise down around <-80 dB on an unmodulated groove (basically RIAA preamp noise), zero to locked speed in <45° of revolution. This makes them ideal for radio cueing. To boot, these TTs can be used 24/7 for decades with only an occasional cleaning and lubrication of the spindle bearing. I have two at WXYC with the EPA-500 toneams which have been in service since the mid-1980s and are still operating well. Of course it has zero inherent isolation since it is a raw TT, so I had been integrating them with isolation plinths.
There was only one problem with an SP-10 + isolation plinth approach: the starting torque of the SP-10 MKIII is so great, the reaction torque on the base when started up would wrench the floating plinth CCW until it came in contact with the base with a thunk and the resulting vibration would sometimes throw the needle out of the groove. Tightening the suspension down to reduce this caused a corresponding reduction in isolation. Putting the needle down after the starting moment cured this issue but led to noisy and clumsy segues. The iso platforms were abandoned shortly afterwards. In retrospect I could have modified the SP-10s to ramp up speed and taught DJs to back-cue farther...
My conclusion from the LP12 experience is most people (especially in the 70's and 80's when LPs were dominant) were more sensitive to noise floor contamination than small amounts of speed error or wow so that limitation of the LP12 didn't bother them. These days, when I go to an audio show room, with well-recorded acoustic instruments I can usually hear the speed/W&F difference between the digital rooms and belt-drive TT rooms by the purity of single-tones. Massed instruments, not so much.
Just my 2¢ worth,
Howie
Hey John!
I hope you are happy and healthy...having spent a while working for a Linn dealer as well as installing and using many Technics SP-10s (MKI> III) at radio stations, I have had the chance to audition, modify and test quite a few TTs, both for enthusiast and broadcast use. I evaluated these systems with a Sound Technology 1510 and I wish I had the results here, but the thermal printouts are looooong gone.
In my experience, the most outstanding attributes of the Linn are:
1) Suspension isolation. Especially of it's time (1980s-1990s) it was much better isolated from external vibration than just about all others I had tested. The only higher degree of isolation I have measured was from an SP-10 mounted in a suspended marble isolation plinth made by Mitchell Cotter here in Chapel Hill, more about this later...
2) Rigidity of link between the tonearm and platter bearing. Very little differential movement is possible with their design.
3) Quiet center bearing assy.
The biggest problems with the Linn were:
1) Speed accuracy. It varies with the age of the belt and temperature.
2) W&F relative to the best DDs measured (SP-10 MKIII, Luxman 4xx series DDs). It varies with the age of the belt and temperature.
3) Ittok in conjunction with Linn carts have low compliance and distort on highly modulated LPs.
This being said, the isolation of the Linn was really good and it gave a better black background than most other TTs.
The Technics SP-10 MKIII is an amazing beast; W&F <0.02%, rumble & noise down around <-80 dB on an unmodulated groove (basically RIAA preamp noise), zero to locked speed in <45° of revolution. This makes them ideal for radio cueing. To boot, these TTs can be used 24/7 for decades with only an occasional cleaning and lubrication of the spindle bearing. I have two at WXYC with the EPA-500 toneams which have been in service since the mid-1980s and are still operating well. Of course it has zero inherent isolation since it is a raw TT, so I had been integrating them with isolation plinths.
There was only one problem with an SP-10 + isolation plinth approach: the starting torque of the SP-10 MKIII is so great, the reaction torque on the base when started up would wrench the floating plinth CCW until it came in contact with the base with a thunk and the resulting vibration would sometimes throw the needle out of the groove. Tightening the suspension down to reduce this caused a corresponding reduction in isolation. Putting the needle down after the starting moment cured this issue but led to noisy and clumsy segues. The iso platforms were abandoned shortly afterwards. In retrospect I could have modified the SP-10s to ramp up speed and taught DJs to back-cue farther...
My conclusion from the LP12 experience is most people (especially in the 70's and 80's when LPs were dominant) were more sensitive to noise floor contamination than small amounts of speed error or wow so that limitation of the LP12 didn't bother them. These days, when I go to an audio show room, with well-recorded acoustic instruments I can usually hear the speed/W&F difference between the digital rooms and belt-drive TT rooms by the purity of single-tones. Massed instruments, not so much.
Just my 2¢ worth,
Howie
Ed I know you can do that first plot without all the line and EMI trash confounders.
Yeah, I used to use a Newport air-servo isolation table to hold a drop-shape/contact angle tester and it was awesome as well. Unfortunately both of those approaches would still be wrecked by the SP-10 MKIII start torque reaction...of course for home use one could be modified to ramp up slowly...hmmm, dang it Bill! Now you have me thinking of a new project...the last thing I need despite being locked-down. lolol
Cheers!
Howie
Happiness is listening to the music and not fretting about what to swap around next in the vain hope of reaching closer to nirvana!
I think the late J Gordon Holt summed it up best when he defined 'neutrality' as (paraphrase) 'something everyone claims they want until they get it'.
After years of audiophilia nervosa I've found I can enjoy the music on anything, but that doesn't stop me building stuff to move the main system on a notch here and there. But as I age I listen to a lot more old recordings and the performance matters more to me than the absolute fidelity.
Have you considered a damper, such as high performance motorbikes have on the steering column? Other idea might be a bump stop to limit the torque twist.
Of couse in the domestic installation spinning up in 300ms is only of use to impress friends when they come over! And yes, I'd love a setup where you can flick the cue lever, hit start and the table is locked to speed before the needle hits the vinyl!
Well I fret, until I confirm that what I am listening to is readily identifiable as flawed, then I am relieved, getting a comfort from knowing that I'm being objective about what is presented to me.
This takes me into another form of intimacy with the performer, that of hearing their attempt, striving to create in a performance.
Effectively that is what we ended up with: loose suspension and a bump stop. Even with a scant 0.050" or so clearance to the bump stop the torque reaction was so violent it made cueing iffy...I suppose it is possible to balance the factors including slowing the speed ramp and get an acceptable compromise and I do have 2 spare SP-10 MKIIs taken out when the MKIIIs were put in so...
AWAY DEMON I COMMAND THEE!!!
Howie
Scott,
Look at the date of the plots. I can get more of the power line noise out today. And if I ever rebuilt the test gear I can get rid of the high frequency stuff by changing to a nonferrous case.
Current problem is trying to get below the dirt on some updated resistor measurements. Working through some equipment limits and may have to build a few more bits to extend the range of my old AP system 2. I suspect I can get things at least 10 dB better than before and will aim for 20!
But those old images show issues between cables with shielding, length, cable construction, conductor diameter and conductor contamination.
However as my conclusion back then was that the cable issue really was one of the wrong standard for signal level. Pro level is 20 dB higher and that buries the issue. Tweak stuff with low levels, high impedance and poorer shielding allows under some conditions cable construction to yield poorer results that may be perceived under some conditions.
Look at the date of the plots. I can get more of the power line noise out today. And if I ever rebuilt the test gear I can get rid of the high frequency stuff by changing to a nonferrous case.
Current problem is trying to get below the dirt on some updated resistor measurements. Working through some equipment limits and may have to build a few more bits to extend the range of my old AP system 2. I suspect I can get things at least 10 dB better than before and will aim for 20!
But those old images show issues between cables with shielding, length, cable construction, conductor diameter and conductor contamination.
However as my conclusion back then was that the cable issue really was one of the wrong standard for signal level. Pro level is 20 dB higher and that buries the issue. Tweak stuff with low levels, high impedance and poorer shielding allows under some conditions cable construction to yield poorer results that may be perceived under some conditions.
The engineer I followed in 1985 was a fan of using whatever budget he could get to indulge in upgrade-itis. When I started there I set the orphaned MKIIs up in a Production Room but the jox wanted to use SL1200s, since that was the "cool" thing for dance DJs to use.
To be fair, since the SL1200 is a complete record player it can be brought to dances a lot easier than an SP-10 MKII with an outboard power supply, 20 pound iso table and Grace tonearm......as a result they sit in my office now.
Cheers,
Howie
Anyone note that Google now has permission to use part of its' new privately built trans-pacific fiber optic cable!
More personally I got my Arduino university education kit in today. It includes DSP software as part of the package. Tomorrow I will start the course. Being an old guy I have previously designed and build systems such as a school intercom based on an IBM PC, C based large venue control systems and long long ago a TTL based minimum serial general purpose micro computer. Intended for a DIY article just as the 8008 appeared!
More personally I got my Arduino university education kit in today. It includes DSP software as part of the package. Tomorrow I will start the course. Being an old guy I have previously designed and build systems such as a school intercom based on an IBM PC, C based large venue control systems and long long ago a TTL based minimum serial general purpose micro computer. Intended for a DIY article just as the 8008 appeared!
Thanks.Free? For lathe mastering? You have a lathe but want a free ride?
Ok, try this one:
GVST - GMonoBass
or this one, 32 bit only
Basslane | Tone Projects | Unique Audio Plugins
I just want to apply vinyl mastering to existing recordings I have and compare.
Thank you.
So cheap Gold cable is worse hum pickup than bare silver wire ?.
Both cables cause significantly higher imd than bare silver wire ?.
Thanks again for your work.
Like you I find that solders are slightly different and cables can have quite strong audible differences.
How many people do you think wrote the following?
"Those working with and listening to lead solders exclusively are coming from a different reference frame, trust your own ears (and the missus and friends/visitors), your wire twist nut experience has already told you that solder makes difference.
Your task now is to understand the sounds of different solders...."
"Like you I find that solders are slightly different and cables can have quite strong audible differences."
I must admit to a complete surprise at anyone saying that they can hear differences between solder formulations.
Given the inherent proximity of the copper conductors being soldered, and the probable volume of solder used, it is hard to accept a perceived difference to sound quality.
In the UK, and maybe this extends further, for military and medical purposes only lead solder is allowed.
Given the inherent proximity of the copper conductors being soldered, and the probable volume of solder used, it is hard to accept a perceived difference to sound quality.
In the UK, and maybe this extends further, for military and medical purposes only lead solder is allowed.
