Ok so want to build one and there are so many different ways to go about it so basically what I want is the holy **** effect . Can this be achieved with a 12? And a 300 watt rms plate amp??? And of course as always this is a budget build...
You'll have to be more specific as your 'holy **** effect' requirements may be different than some others. Even horn loaded, a 12" @ 300 W is a wimpy computer system 'sub' for some of us.
Also, do you want to build a TL or a vented one [MLTL]? If the former, then how long can it be since this will determine how low it can be tuned. For the latter, 6 ft long is usually enough.
GM
edit: More drivers + more or bigger cabs = more efficiency, so if the space, budget allows, more 'holy **** effect' will be available.
Also, do you want to build a TL or a vented one [MLTL]? If the former, then how long can it be since this will determine how low it can be tuned. For the latter, 6 ft long is usually enough.
GM
edit: More drivers + more or bigger cabs = more efficiency, so if the space, budget allows, more 'holy **** effect' will be available.
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Don't take things personally, you just missed his point. There are guys on here running quite literally thousands of watts just to their subwoofers. I mean, I personally am running 500W to a 10" and I would never call it earthshattering. The 8cuft 15" on 1.2kW I built a few years ago, yeah. That I would. It's about perspective, so what gives you the OH ****response likely isn't the same for everyone. A more useful criteria is that it needs extension to x Hz, but at a certain output level. More and more these days people, particularly manufacturers, are trading extension for SPL. "Flat" to 15Hz at 95db isn't as impressive as flat to 25Hz at 105, for example.
Ok so all this opinion chatter aside what would be better 2 12's or 1 using 300w so what would be a good 12 for using alone with the 300 and what would be good for 2 12's or am I better off running 500w to one 15? Me personally I worry about a 15 being too sloppy ...
Diygti, design of what you want is going to be (already) based on limitations.
300W, 12", and yes budget.
What will cost the most for your project (if you want to learn anything) will be time.
Plate amp, speaker, wood, glue, screws, connectors.
If you don't have the tools there is another cost unless you can borrow.
Or you could look into Kits that don't require very much in the way of woodworking tools.
I am sitting in front of my computer with good bookshelf speakers powered by a TPA3116 at about 20W/ch.
More than enough.
Sitting in front of the TV (8-10') is another story with more dynamic range needed. I would consider 20W/ch a little too low for that.
It is all relative.
Search this forum for others that have asked the same question about sub builds.
I cannot give a recommendation because I have not done enough work in that area.
Good Luck
300W, 12", and yes budget.
What will cost the most for your project (if you want to learn anything) will be time.
Plate amp, speaker, wood, glue, screws, connectors.
If you don't have the tools there is another cost unless you can borrow.
Or you could look into Kits that don't require very much in the way of woodworking tools.
I am sitting in front of my computer with good bookshelf speakers powered by a TPA3116 at about 20W/ch.
More than enough.
Sitting in front of the TV (8-10') is another story with more dynamic range needed. I would consider 20W/ch a little too low for that.
It is all relative.
Search this forum for others that have asked the same question about sub builds.
I cannot give a recommendation because I have not done enough work in that area.
Good Luck
Also if it helps I am running klipsch synergy f3 towers front and back and synergy center at 100 watts per channel
No, not really other than it allows a low XO point if desired, though it implies that the sub might be for LFE channel special effects. Is it?
So, back to my original Q, what does 'holy **** effect' mean performance wise to you?
GM
So, back to my original Q, what does 'holy **** effect' mean performance wise to you?
GM
Holy crap is I want to feel it in my chest and know it's there not take my breath away literally
Like I said, more drivers is better and better still to put them in individual cabs, so they can be more optimally located in the room.
There are quite a few good 12" available, but so far you haven't given us enough info to narrow it down a bit.
What do you mean by 'sloppy'? There are plenty of high SQ 15" available, though AFAIK none are particularly cheap.
Anyway, like anything else, you ideally want the right 'tool' for the job, but first you'll have to define its parameters.
GM
I'm pretty sure he would have stated his technical goals in the first post if he was able to. In the absence of any technical goals I'm going to Sherlock Holmes this a bit. I'm guessing the "gti" in his name might have something to do with a car and from the general style of writing I'm guessing he's relatively young. He lives in the US, and a quick search tells me 79.219 percent of US citizens live in urban areas. So I'm guessing he's not a stranger to car stereos.
For males under 30 that are familiar with car stereos, "impressive" starts at around 130 db. "REALLY impressive" starts around 140 db and "holy ****" starts around 150 db.
A sonotube build will amount to a ported box. (Or a less than perfect transmission line.) So it's not going to be anything special just by virtue of using sonotube.
Most of the sonotube builds I've seen were large and low tuned EBS type designs in which ability to play low notes trumps ability to play loud. From my expert profiling above you can see that I've guessed that you might prefer loud to low, please correct me if I'm wrong. Low and loud are at odds with each other in this game, pick one or the other or a bit of both. But not a lot of both, not with a single 12 and 300 watts.
If you want loud, do it the same way the car audio guys do it. Pick a decent (or better than decent) high q driver, put it in an undersized box and tune it too high. Tuning = lowest room mode for max expletives from your friends when showing it off. Stick it in the room corner, preferably in the basement with all solid concrete walls and give it all the power you've got.
Or if you want it low, build it large and tune it low. But a single 12 with 300 watts and a low tuning won't impress anyone unless you have a ridiculous amount of room gain.
I found a single 12" to be quite adequate, though this was in a room of about 3.5m square. It was a JBL GTO1214, ~75L ported box tuned around 18Hz, with some eq to get flat to around tuning. Around 200w, it gets impressive, though it takes some fairly chunky satellites to get the rest of the system up to volume cleanly - I was using a pair of decent PA 12" two-ways.
The resonant frequency of the floor is 14Hz 😀
I'd say the problem with chasing the "holy crap" effect is that there is very little media out there that has the dynamic range there to really show it off. The Sound Check CD with the jet flyover does a good job - turn it up so you can hear the birds and insects, and then wait. Just don't come running to me if your speaker cones end up on the floor 😉
The resonant frequency of the floor is 14Hz 😀
I'd say the problem with chasing the "holy crap" effect is that there is very little media out there that has the dynamic range there to really show it off. The Sound Check CD with the jet flyover does a good job - turn it up so you can hear the birds and insects, and then wait. Just don't come running to me if your speaker cones end up on the floor 😉
There's plenty in the movies, but it takes a serious system to deal with them: The New Master List of BASS in Movies with Frequency Charts
GM
GM
Sorry GM, but I'd argue otherwise about the dynamic range: I haven't found anything like the jet flyover, and would suspect that most movies are squashed to within a 20dB range (between, say, someone talking quietly and the loudest explosion), otherwise very few systems could ever deal with them.
I'd quite like to find an action-type film where there's no volume compression at all, mostly to find out whether or not my system is adequate yet...
Chris
I'd quite like to find an action-type film where there's no volume compression at all, mostly to find out whether or not my system is adequate yet...
Chris
I sure we're having fun circumventing the language censor so let me put it the only way I know.
Stop it.
No further warnings.
You didn't state your budget, but an Eminence Lab12 gen2 in a tapped horn would work quite well.
I just want to ad that most descent systems can be adjusted for dynamic range.
mine has the option in quarter steps.
So even if the dynamic range would be 100dB, the viewer still could compress the range from his seat.
mine has the option in quarter steps.
So even if the dynamic range would be 100dB, the viewer still could compress the range from his seat.
Hmm, not really. You cannot actively change the dynamic range of an amplifier or loudspeaker. By definition, that doesn't even make sense. If you're talking about highpassing and lowpassing the system, then sure, but that's not the same thing.
How about a bit of 'how to build a sonotube' info, instead...
Plenty of good 12" drivers that will work in these cabinets. I won't go into driver selection unless requested. 4 cu.ft. and 25-28hz tuning is about the best compromise between loud and low for these guys. That means a pair of about 20" or so long ports. The 'tuning' that svs, hsu, etc and others in the sonotube builds have done is plug a port to drop tune. That way you can have the best of both worlds, more spl when needed, and lower when needed.
The biggest problem with sonotube is its light weight. It's bad when you have to sit a person on top to keep them from dancing around. Build 2 -- one front center wall, rear center wall, or front/rear diagonal corners works best.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/subw...-building-sonotube-subwoofer.html#post1755616
Plenty of good 12" drivers that will work in these cabinets. I won't go into driver selection unless requested. 4 cu.ft. and 25-28hz tuning is about the best compromise between loud and low for these guys. That means a pair of about 20" or so long ports. The 'tuning' that svs, hsu, etc and others in the sonotube builds have done is plug a port to drop tune. That way you can have the best of both worlds, more spl when needed, and lower when needed.
The biggest problem with sonotube is its light weight. It's bad when you have to sit a person on top to keep them from dancing around. Build 2 -- one front center wall, rear center wall, or front/rear diagonal corners works best.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/subw...-building-sonotube-subwoofer.html#post1755616
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