solux -- the perfect light source?

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Do a google search on solux, check out the CRI (99.35!!)
with 80% of the heat reflected out the back, it takes care of the heat problem too.
I'm starting a diy projector and am planning on a 3x3 grid of the 4700K, 17 degree bulbs in series so I don't even have to have run a 12volt supply. If I were willing to live with less output from a 4x3 grid, (I'm not) I would have a 10,000 hour light source.
With 9 bulbs, I should be in the 2000 hour range with less than 50 bucks invested (5 bucks a bulb)

I want to hear if anyone else has run these bulbs, sounds like the best thing yet -- no halide ballast, better color, less heat...
 
The $5 a bulb is great price point, they last 3000 hours, and push a nice color temp, but at 50 watts a bulb, will it throw enough light for a projection application?

They're tungsten-halogen, so they would still get pretty hot I'd think, and wouldn't they at least need a low voltage transformer since they're 12V bulbs?

From what I've read, it looks like the Solux bulb performs best combined with their proprietary power transformer. You might have to account for the price of buying and canibalizing several light fixtures (track lighting seems to be their cheapest per-fixture at $34 a pop) if there isn't an easy way to implement an array of GU5.3 halogen 2-pin sockets into your cabinet.

Don't mean to sound harsh, just being the devil's advocate and bringing up the first thoughts that popped into my head.
 
devil's advocate

Thanks for the info. I actually have (25) 12v 75watt supplies that I got for 6.80 each. (I use them on woodworking display cabinets that I build.) They work great on typical mr11 or mr16 bulbs, so should work great on the solux.
The idea is though, that 50 watts IS NOT enough -- but an array of 10 degree or 17 degree bulbs would be. If you check out the 'net on the heat thing, they have a glass front to absorb heat and the reflector is designed to absorb infrared (heat) and uva / uvb -- visable spectrum is what they are supposed to put out.
I was concened that the 10degree bulbs would not "spread" enough and I would get hot and cold spots in the light. I also noticed that these are never rated CBCP due to the fact that they don't have a "hot spot" in the center of the beam -- VERY GOOD.

The other good thing about an array of the solux's is that it takes VERY little room, most people use at least a foot or two of depth just for light source, this should take inches.

I'm using a gateway profile 3 (15" 300:1 screen EASY and perfect to take apart -- already done) The great thing about the profile 3 is that it has lvds built on board AND the lower res (800x600, and 640x480) don't interpolate, so if 15" is just too much, I'll drop down a res and have a smaller screen. I have a new delta rear projection lens (45degree mirror) and I'm looking for my fresnels.
The good thing about using a computer is that I have full color control on the video card, so I can adjust for light, lcd, screen color problems.

As soon as I get the fresnels and the solux's I'll start mocking things up.

Any one else with info on these, let me know....
 
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm,

If I were sceptical I'd think along these lines..
- Low IR/UV
UV from a glowwire typa bulb is always low
IR for the same is always HIGH (but maybe a bit lower when compared to 'normal' halogen bulbs)
- CRI of 99+
Yeah, sure!
Did you actually look at their spectrum? My guess is that maybe in 50 years bulbs/technology will have evolved that far to create such an ideal spectrum.
- Where is the lumen/watt? Efficiency?

And then to your idea to combine several bulbs:
How do you intend to bundle/distibute the bulbs over the lcd surface to create an even/directional lightspread? I have not seen any working solutions with more than 1 lightsource.

Ok, I'm sceptical 🙂
I trust these 'specifications' as much as the 'specifications' from BenQ LCD monitors.
 
Suppose all the specs are true, (not that I believe ANY of them) you still have the MAJOR problem of directing the light if you use more than one bulb.
Lets say you use one big fresnel in front of your LCD with just 2 bulbs, and you are only trying to display 1 line of video.
You'd place one bulb to the left & one to the right.
1 of these bulbs will have to light 50% of the displayed line.
If you follow the light comming from that bulb towards the fresnel you'll see that the light hits the fresnel at different angles, eg the light will EXIT the fresnel at different angles and WILL NOT reach your projection lens; therefore you will not get a picture of half a line, but only of a fraction of that line.
Using more than 2 bulbs will display a dotted line or an uneven lighted line.

So whats your secret to get an even lit picture??
 
Re: devil's advocate

jbell said:

The idea is though, that 50 watts IS NOT enough -- but an array of 10 degree or 17 degree bulbs would be.
...

I was concened that the 10degree bulbs would not "spread" enough and I would get hot and cold spots in the light.


You might make a light grid to prevent light from overlapping each other.

multiple light sources won't be as good as one point light source. but it is worth to try. be sure to post your result here.
 
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you got it

18wheeler, you read my mind, I'm going to use (20) 10degree spots in a 5x4 matrix, with a 2.5" shadow box to yield 12.5" x 10" flat light source. Moving the shadow box closer or farther away from the lcd to eliminate any "dark lines" or "bulb overlap." With 20 bulbs, that will give me 2 arrays of 10 bulbs, so it will work out perfectly for 12volt bulbs.
With a light source that already is parallel rays (or close to, due to the 10degree beamwidth) I won't need a fresnel behind, only optics infront of the lcd.

My only problem right now is finding a 12" wide fresnel to converge my image after the lcd, most are only 11" My 15" screen is exactly 12x9 and I don't want to cut off the outside edges.

If I can't find one, I may do the "100in tv thing from ebay" by using only a single lense and invert my screen. I won't use a fresnel though, probably the 7.5" lense from surplus shed. "Optical glass plano convex lens 7-1/2” diameter by 500mm focal length (19.7”). " That should be about the right pic size for my 17' throw distance. I'm hoping that a single lense will give me good optical quality, but I'm not betting on it..
Any one done it this way?

Ideas?
 

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yea, I know, 20 bulbs is a little overkill, but it would be the brightest screen I can imagine! (Even more than a 1000watt MH)
I know MH produces more lumens per watt, but I don't know of anyone who can capture all of the MH light -- alot of it is wasted.

It's also still cheaper than a 250w double ended, and you don't have to figure out reflector, columnating lens and fresnel....

I may decide it's too much and go back to fewer bulbs -- but when it comes to transmissive projection -- is there such a thing as too much?

The 12" fresnel at diy has the corners cut off, not good for 4:3.
But THANKS!! It is obviously an overhead fresnel that's a double, can you take it apart? or is it bonded together? My assumption is that with parallel light (roughly) coming through the lcd, that a double might do something funny optically. Usually these are behind the lcd to converge the light, not infront -- anyone know what it'll do? Will I get rings?

One other unknown, my lcd from my profile -- looks awesome, best screen I've ever seen. Partially due to the antiglare, diffusion glass that the lcd is bonded to. It should help reduce screendoor, but might decrease sharpness as well -- anyone know? Also, are people getting "enhanced" screen door due to the light entering the lcd at an angle on a typical OHP? Would it be not as noticable if the light were parallel entering the lcd and then converged after?

BTW -- I realize in my last post that if I don't converge after the lcd, I'll lose alot of brightness, but hey -- I might just be able to get away with it with 20 bulbs and a 7.5" lens, I'll let you know, bulbs are ordered. (IF, and I know it's a big IF it works -- I'll only have 100 in bulbs and 20 in a lens and my lcd costs, not bad) and 100 bucks isn't bad for a 3000 hour CRI 99.3 bulb that is "relatively" low heat.
 
Well, I guess my scepticism didnt affect you.
In short: you are going to heat up your projector with a total of 20x50=1000W! Subtract a little for energy converted to light (100 or so) that would still leave 900W to fry eggs on your LCD 🙂
And second (I've tried to explain this b4): all light that doesn't leave one of your bulbs at PRECISELY the correct angle to go through the lcd/pj/ onto your screen at the exact place it should go to will WASH OUT/DEFOCUS your picture or would in the best case just be lost.
That means maybe 0.1% of all light will generate a focused image,
5% will generate a defocused image (but hey! better defocused than none at all huh?)
94% will just wash out all blacks or is lost.

Good luck though.
 
multiple bulbs are bad? --so the guys using 2 loa's are all wrong and seeing double?

You're right, I don't get it. A fresnel behind a lcd bends diverging light rays into either parallel (one fresnel, if the point light source is exactly a focal length away) light rays, or into converging light rays if using a double fresnel (OHP).

A light array using very narrow focus bulbs (A 2" diameter 10 degree bulb shines a 4" circle at 2 feet) -- by definition generates parallel light rays. The deeper the "light grid" the more non parallel rays are removed -- leaving only a columnated light source. My assumption is that a light array at between 12-24 inches deep (which most guys use if they are using a 400 or 1000 MH) will have fewer divering rays of light, than using a point light source and a fresnel. This assumes that the point light source is at least a 1/4" or more "off" of the focal legnth of the fresnel. You are correct, a perfectly focused fresnel/point light source is best, but when people start using long arc 400 and 1000 MH's -- they are not using a point light source, and all the theory of a perfectly focused light source goes right out the window.
 
In addition to the 12" fresnel which *may* cut off the corners of a 15" LCD, DIYLabs also has a 250 watt double-ended MH bulb and electronic ballast for $150.

Add a reflector behind the bulb (simple as a metal soup ladle or whatever you'd like to experiment with), create some sort of reflective environment along the walls of your projector box if necessary (polished sheet metal, mirrors, aluminum foil, paint, whatever) and you've pretty much done all you can without too much additional expense.

The replacement cost on the 250w double-ended MH is $35 and burns at 20,000 lumens for an average of 5000-6000 hours and a likely 4200K-5000K color temp without the heat of a 400w mogul MH, which can be cooled with a two-fan cool air in/hot air out setup. I doubt such a simple cooling arrangement could do the same for twenty 50 watt halogens.

I just don't see the need to set up an elaborate multi-element lighing panel which complicates the amount of electrical work, source light heat and engineering necessary to perfect its optimal design (if possible).

Your intentions are good, but there's a point where over-engineering may not produce a suitable result.

For Zark's dual-Fluorex setup, it's still acting as a backlight and only for a miniscule 5" LCD panel -- not much surface area to deal with. Fluorex works in this instance because a fluorescent produces a very even and indirect light, suited epecially well for the backlighting and sidelighting you see in notebook and monitor LCDs. Sure, it's "bright" when you look at it, but you can't pinpoint a single spot or filament on the bulb where the source of the light is emanating from, and not as painfully intense as looking at a bare halogen, xenon or metal halide bulb (which I DO NOT recommend).

A direct light source is what a projector needs to function best, especially when it's pushing light through an opaque medium like film or an LCD panel across the distance to the screen. Compare the visible beam and distance of a simple flashlight or spotlight to the diffused area glow of fluorescent and you'll see how incandescent casts a much sharper and defined shadow. This visual effect should give you an idea of what to expect from such a light source in a projector with a larger LCD surface.
 
jbell said:


It's also still cheaper than a 250w double ended

and 100 bucks isn't bad for a 3000 hour CRI 99.3 bulb that is "relatively" low heat.


a 250w HQI will cost u 150$ for 10,000 hrs and 34$ for replacement bulbs.
your lights will cost 100$++ for 3,000 hours and |("PROBABLY")|
bake eggs on you lcd :-D , too match the HQI you would need to buy 300$++ worth of bulbs and it still wouldnt match the life of HQI.

100$ for 3,000 hrs why not just buy a retail projector?

if you DO decide to do this i hope you buy a projection panel since they can sustain more heat, mine can go nearly 50oC
LCD monitors are said to be very weak when it comes to heat....how do you plan to cool 20 halogens...?
with that in mind....Good Luck 🙂:nod: 😉
 
rapsac:
Since you are determined to make me understand, (and I appreciate that) I will try to explain my thoughts.

You keep assuming I have a fresnel behind the lcd --- with a light array you don't. I don't need to generate parallel light rays, I already have them. A 10 degree spot spreads from 2" to 4" over a distance of 2 feet. (Pretty tight focus)

Because I already have parallel light, I only need a fresnel AFTER the lcd to coverge the light to a projector lens.

I ordered a 12" fresnel from diylabs today just for that purpose. (someone posted that you could take it apart and use just one of the fresnels, with the grooves facing the projector lens)

The biggest problem will be making sure that the shadow box (that 18wheelere drew -- better than me) is the correct distance from the lcd. It needs to be close enough so that there are no bulb overlaps, but far enough away so that there are no dark lines.

Heat should not be a problem, a very large amount of the heat of these bulbs comes off the back side, so a couple 4" fans should be enough to vent.

I will be careful though of my lcd, I will start mocking things up with an overhead transparency film in place of where the lcd goes.
that'll give me a good idea on how much foward heat the solux's give off.
 

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I didnt draw a LCD, as they dont influence the direction of the light. Whether yours is above or below a fresnel doesn't matter.
You are trying to get your light from the bulbs through the lcd onto the screen. Every dot on your screen corresponds to 1 dot on your lcd, corresponds to 1 light bundle (dot-sized) from 1 of your bulbs right? With a single bulb & all optics in focus you will see that there is this 1 to 1 relation from bulb to screen. Now try the same when using multiple bulbs. Just draw a few points and you'll see what I'm trying to explain.
Or look at your drawing: you've drawn a single line from each bulb, but your bulbs will light up a section, so just draw a few more lines/bulb and you'll see where it all goes wrong.(best draw 2 adjacent bulbs+center light beam+ left&right beam)




As for heat: a normal OHP with a 400W halogen is cooled with just one 4" fan. But I wouldn't want to drop an LCD on top of it.
But a few 4" fans should keep it cool if you have a venting slot on top of your pj.
edit
like this:
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
 
I agree with you on the diverging light rays IF I am using a non focused light source. The solux's are a 10degree beam, which means that it is almost a perfectly parallel light source. That means that the diffractions that you refer to will be very very few.
(Remember this bulb only spreads from 2" source to 4" over a 2 feet distance. And, there is no hot spot, so it's very even.)

My point is that there will be a few non parallel light rays, but then a point light source and fresnel that is not "perfectly" aligned will do the same thing. AND if you are using a large light source like a MH400 or MH1000, then there are ALOT of light rays that are not focused.

It should not matter how many light sources I have, as long as I have a solid, even, parallel light source that comes into the back of the lcd.

Correct?
 
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