Silver interconnects sound brighter to me too, i'm not going to attempt to explain why, they just do. Maplin used to have a high purity copper coax and a solid silver version of the same cable. I tried both with the same plugs, solder, system etc they were the same length but sounded quite noticeably different. The copper version was duller sounding where the silver was brighter with more emphasis on detail. A good wire but not cheap and it can sound bright with sibilance issues highlighted. I have also tried a smaller diameter silver coax which had a similar effect, resistance and capacitance don't, for me, explain why this happens although it probably does explain why long interconnect cables sound poor compared to very short cables of the same type. This makes a good case for diy cables imo, you can make them just long enough for purpose.
I used to hate changing anything in the signal path of a valve amp, every time I re-soldered a joint somewhere it would take a couple of weeks for the sound to open up again, this was something I noticed the most with valve amps. Different cables also seemed to make a more noticeable difference with valve amps than solid state in my experience.
That being said, as I get older, it strikes me that I don't notice quite so much of a difference between different cable types as I did 10 years ago. My hearing is starting to dim a little bit i'm afraid.
I used to hate changing anything in the signal path of a valve amp, every time I re-soldered a joint somewhere it would take a couple of weeks for the sound to open up again, this was something I noticed the most with valve amps. Different cables also seemed to make a more noticeable difference with valve amps than solid state in my experience.
That being said, as I get older, it strikes me that I don't notice quite so much of a difference between different cable types as I did 10 years ago. My hearing is starting to dim a little bit i'm afraid.
I have to agree with AndrewT, bad cable construction and or connector termination allows for this to happen, then the cable is flawed. but the we are talking about DIY audiophile cables😀
Belief 😉
Paranoia 🙂
Thank you for the vote of confidence but I assure you I am neither deaf or paranoid, nor would I ever suggest that people who hear no S/Q difference between different conductors are deaf or have a mental issue of some kind!
A lot of people say they hear differences, a lot say they don't.
I actually envy the ones who don't, it's a simple test but they should try it. They can rule out all boutique components from then on and save a load of cash.
I wont pay for fancy interconnects but I can find decent cable and well made plugs and solder to a professional standard so I make my own. Does this make me mad, some well regarded sound engineers also use different types of cable to achieve a particular tone. We don't complain about how they reached that conclusion when we listen to their work. Are they also paranoid and/or deluded?
A lot of people say they hear differences, a lot say they don't.
I actually envy the ones who don't, it's a simple test but they should try it. They can rule out all boutique components from then on and save a load of cash.
I wont pay for fancy interconnects but I can find decent cable and well made plugs and solder to a professional standard so I make my own. Does this make me mad, some well regarded sound engineers also use different types of cable to achieve a particular tone. We don't complain about how they reached that conclusion when we listen to their work. Are they also paranoid and/or deluded?
Plug discussions should be banned along with cables and ALL boutique components!
Measurement fanatics can not help themselves, they just have to personally attack anyone who has an opinion about hifi or sound on which they can not produce a scientific paper to back up.
Measurement fanatics can not help themselves, they just have to personally attack anyone who has an opinion about hifi or sound on which they can not produce a scientific paper to back up.
I think what you mean is "fundamental physics fanatics." No paper needed, just some good evidence, whether measurement or ears-only, if you're claiming that you're observing a phenomenon which goes beyond well-accepted and battle-tested physics. Otherwise, indeed you will not be taken seriously by anyone with even basic knowledge of the issues.
Look, I came at this from the same basis as you, if it cant be measured then it can't be real.
The problem with this approach is that it assumes we can now measure every valid effect and predict the consequences. Even if we can get very close we can't be certain of producing something we would want to listen to. Many an amp has been built which measures well but sounds uninspiring, do we simply accept that this is a fault with our hearing, even when we have heard better sound from an amp which does not measure as well.
Nelson Pass seems to think not, he recently said he was willing to accept a little higher distortion figure if the amp sounds better. Why would anyone put up with any distortion if it could be cancelled out? And what is the point of achieving such low noise measurements just to feed it to a speaker which probably produces massive distortion levels?
The problem with this approach is that it assumes we can now measure every valid effect and predict the consequences. Even if we can get very close we can't be certain of producing something we would want to listen to. Many an amp has been built which measures well but sounds uninspiring, do we simply accept that this is a fault with our hearing, even when we have heard better sound from an amp which does not measure as well.
Nelson Pass seems to think not, he recently said he was willing to accept a little higher distortion figure if the amp sounds better. Why would anyone put up with any distortion if it could be cancelled out? And what is the point of achieving such low noise measurements just to feed it to a speaker which probably produces massive distortion levels?
Ok I have settled on the following: 28 awg .99999 silver wire from a jeweler supply company back east, 20 gauge Teflon tubing spiral wrapped so that it completes a full turn every 2". I am using only two wire and not shielding the cables. I will have each wire on opposite sides of a 1/4" cotton rope. The wires will be shrink wrapped at each end to the rope, then I will wrap the whole thing with 1" plumbers Teflon tape twice, one direction then the other. The wires will be silver soldered to XShadow Vampire RCA plugs, was considering Cardas silver plated plugs but changed my mind. The difference of almost $50 a set was really tempting but the base metal being brass was the decision factor. I will solder and shrink wrap the (+) lead, solder the (-) lead, put a braided cover over the cable then shrink wrap the base of the RCA to the cable using adhesive lined shrink wrap. Total length of each cable is 18". Total cost for two cables just over $150.00 because of the jacks. If I went with the Cardas jacks the cost would be under $100.00.
I did consider shielding the cable to make a balanced set, but for how short I am making them they would not benefit. But if I did, there is a company out there making expandable copper braiding for this, or actually wrapping the cable in a 3M copper tape which is embossed and solder able. If I did do this I would have only the source end soldered to the RCA (-) jack and insulate the destination end.
Oh and guys...... I am a woman, so the proper reference is "She" not "He".
I did consider shielding the cable to make a balanced set, but for how short I am making them they would not benefit. But if I did, there is a company out there making expandable copper braiding for this, or actually wrapping the cable in a 3M copper tape which is embossed and solder able. If I did do this I would have only the source end soldered to the RCA (-) jack and insulate the destination end.
Oh and guys...... I am a woman, so the proper reference is "She" not "He".
The latter contradicts the former, since I've never said that, nor do I believe it. If you did, fine, I'll take your word for it, but don't attribute that sentiment to anyone who approaches audio rationally.
Good luck Merrisasjc, i hope they make you happy. I once bought fancy phono plugs, Eichmann Bullet plugs (copper version) I heard no difference between them and cheap neutrik plugs. The cable makes more difference, shorter the better. Anyway it's not recommended to use dissimilar metals in contact with each other. Corrosion caused by electrolysis is something I have experience of as a marine engineer, but i'm told it happens in damp atmospheric conditions too.
To help maintain a proper sense of balance, someone will be along shortly to tell me i'm deluded, or, if I am very lucky, paranoid
😉
To help maintain a proper sense of balance, someone will be along shortly to tell me i'm deluded, or, if I am very lucky, paranoid
😉
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Are you always this patronising to people you don't even know 🙁
I could see your point if I was the only person ever to claim that a conductor's material type/mineral composition can vary its sound characteristics. Do carbon resistors sound the same to you as metal film ones of the exact same value? If so do they measure any differently in any way to prove this theory, or is it madness to discuss a component in the signal chains effect simply because it is outside of the chasis?
BTW if your attitude is typical of, as you say 'anyone with even a basic knowledge of the issues' Then I couldn't care less what any of you think of me, anyone or anything.
Have a nice day!
I've had (among far too many) a few NVA power amp's (no, nothing to do with nam) I read many posts by owner Richard Dunn over the years really attacking anyone who dared to suggest he fit a power socket instead of captive mains cable, so they could plug an audiophoo mains cable into their amps.
I actually fell out with him over the need for quarter inch thick conductors in speaker cables. Anyway I looked at his site recently, his tune has changed. Apparently his latest top of the range amp is indeed good enough for him to hear an improvement with a fancy mains cable.
This is the kind of person in this industry I dislike, one who attacks others for their lack of knowledge while making a good living by selling amps using someone else's design from decades ago.
I actually fell out with him over the need for quarter inch thick conductors in speaker cables. Anyway I looked at his site recently, his tune has changed. Apparently his latest top of the range amp is indeed good enough for him to hear an improvement with a fancy mains cable.
This is the kind of person in this industry I dislike, one who attacks others for their lack of knowledge while making a good living by selling amps using someone else's design from decades ago.
It depends on the circuit and the circuit position, since resistors themselves are just passive components and don't have a sound. Carbon comp (I assume that's what you mean) have a higher voltage coefficient of resistance and higher excess noise than metal film resistors. Where those parameters are critical, one might find an actual audible difference in amplifiers using these resistors. Used in places where these parameters are not critical (see the recent discussion on grid stoppers in the ImPasse thread, for example), they unlikely to cause an amplifier to sound different when going between one and the other.
I find that silver sounds 'brighter', perhaps too 'bright' to be comfortable, unless it is broken in. This is for you newcomers who still use their ears for listening.
So, you agree an audible difference can be heard in certain applications.
You also agree this could be due to the differing composition of the resistor. You fail to see my point however. Can these differences be measured by any standard equipment, can you show me any data which highlights this difference. I'd guess not but yet it is accepted by most that it exists.
A cable has resistance, capacitance AND it is in a critical part of the signal chain, why would it's composition not also have an audible effect which does not show up on a scope (yes I can use one)?
This is a genuine question and NOT an attack on anyone's ego, bias, point of view, whatever.
D
Thank you sir! I agree fully with your opinion.
I still think after more than 30 years of messing with hifi, that the ears still play a surprisingly important role in all this, I can't provide measurements which back this up though so it's obviously an attempt at subversion 😉
You'd guess wrong. The differences are easily measurable and show up on the spec sheets from most manufacturers.
It can, if it's defective or not suitable for the application (e.g., unshielded wires for high impedance, low voltage transmission). Depending on the defect, you'd want to use a scope or a spectrum analyzer to determine the nature of the defect.
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Daffy: SHOOT HIM NOW! SHOOT HIM NOW!
Bugs: You keep out of this. He doesn't have to shoot you now.
Daffy: He does so have to shoot me now. I demand that you shoot me now!
Elmer: *BLAM!* (shoots Daffy)
Daffy: (to Bugs) Let's run through that again.
Bugs: Okay. Would you like to shoot me now or wait 'til you get home?
Daffy: Shoot him now. Shoot him now.
Bugs: Keep out of this. He doesn't have to shoot you now.
Daffy: HA! That's it! Hold it right there! Pronoun trouble.
From Rabbit Seasoning, 1952. Classic.
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