A buddy of mine has a pair of JL10w3v2's which recently stopped working for him(and they're out of warranty). He knew I have a way with speakers, so he asked me to take a look and brought them by.
The first thing I did was check the amp, it worked, then I looked at the subs for physical damage. The cones moved in and out without any scraping or noise, and they didnt look to be in bad shape. I then tested the voice coils with a small battery. It turned out that only one coil each speaker actually worked. The other coils werent working for some reason. So I figured the voice coils arent fried, but one isnt working on each speaker, so maybe theres a bad connection somewhere.
I checked the tinsel leads at the "binding posts" and they were soldered on well and I checked for continuity across the tinsel leads and they didnt have it. So I removed the dust caps and took a look inside. The tinsel leads run into magnet wire as soon as they come into the speaker cone and I'm assuming that is where the connection failed. I got some magnet wire exposed and bare and tested again with the battery. both voice coils worked on BOTH speakers.
So what I need to do now is solder in and run some new tinsel leads. I guess I could use the old ones, but they're burried in muck and goo that is supery sticky and hard to remove. I'd rather just cut them out and put in new ones personanly. Is there any online source where I could get tinsel leads from? If not, would super fine stranded copper with a thin rubber sheild work? Any suggestions??? These subs dont have any insane excursion or anything. At most 1" one way linear but its probably more like .75" or .5"
Any ideas are appreciated, Thanks guys
The first thing I did was check the amp, it worked, then I looked at the subs for physical damage. The cones moved in and out without any scraping or noise, and they didnt look to be in bad shape. I then tested the voice coils with a small battery. It turned out that only one coil each speaker actually worked. The other coils werent working for some reason. So I figured the voice coils arent fried, but one isnt working on each speaker, so maybe theres a bad connection somewhere.
I checked the tinsel leads at the "binding posts" and they were soldered on well and I checked for continuity across the tinsel leads and they didnt have it. So I removed the dust caps and took a look inside. The tinsel leads run into magnet wire as soon as they come into the speaker cone and I'm assuming that is where the connection failed. I got some magnet wire exposed and bare and tested again with the battery. both voice coils worked on BOTH speakers.
So what I need to do now is solder in and run some new tinsel leads. I guess I could use the old ones, but they're burried in muck and goo that is supery sticky and hard to remove. I'd rather just cut them out and put in new ones personanly. Is there any online source where I could get tinsel leads from? If not, would super fine stranded copper with a thin rubber sheild work? Any suggestions??? These subs dont have any insane excursion or anything. At most 1" one way linear but its probably more like .75" or .5"
Any ideas are appreciated, Thanks guys
Orange county speakers little page on speaker repairs cracks me up.
"As a rule of thumb, speakers double in price about every 10 years. What this means is the speakers you bought in 1976 for $200-$300 would now cost about $800-$1200 to replace with equal quality today"
all I have to say is riiiiiiight
I think I'm just going to go with super fine strand copper with rubber insulation. I think that should hold up pretty well and considering the flexibility it should have a negligable effect on the drivers parameters. Does anyone see a problem with this?
"As a rule of thumb, speakers double in price about every 10 years. What this means is the speakers you bought in 1976 for $200-$300 would now cost about $800-$1200 to replace with equal quality today"
all I have to say is riiiiiiight
I think I'm just going to go with super fine strand copper with rubber insulation. I think that should hold up pretty well and considering the flexibility it should have a negligable effect on the drivers parameters. Does anyone see a problem with this?
I bought a Brahma 15 MK I with a burnt tinsel lead off of ebay for $75 some time ago. I repaired the lead with Radio Shack test probe cable. Maybe not the best replacement, but it has worked fine for the past few months. As you suggest, you need a wire with a flexible insulation. Just make sure the wire is rated for the wattage you are going to send through it.
Desoldering braid eh? I've never really heard of that....
After doing a bit of googling it seems that its just a woven braid to soak up hot solder... Well most of the ones I've seen are pure copper. Wouldnt that oxidize after a while? Would aluminium or something else be better? I know aluminium oxidizes too... Kinda makes me wanna stick with my orginal thought to go with the flexible insulated fine strand wire
After doing a bit of googling it seems that its just a woven braid to soak up hot solder... Well most of the ones I've seen are pure copper. Wouldnt that oxidize after a while? Would aluminium or something else be better? I know aluminium oxidizes too... Kinda makes me wanna stick with my orginal thought to go with the flexible insulated fine strand wire
Hmm, well Ive seen pure copper recommended over its alloys when burying pipe/cable for grounding due to it corroding less than alloys. I think copper alloys are generally more for mechanical reasons than corrosion resistance.
Aluminum oxidizes almost instantanously, but usually the outer oxidation layer prevents any further oxidation. Spill some mercury and watch out. Id use copper of some sort in this application though.
Aluminum oxidizes almost instantanously, but usually the outer oxidation layer prevents any further oxidation. Spill some mercury and watch out. Id use copper of some sort in this application though.
Suggestions about using copper wire or braid of some sort are misguided at best. The life span will be quite short. Real tinsel lead is available, use it.
Lead out wires on speaker that look like they are copper are actually phosphor-bronze or beryllium-copper alloys, not just plain copper.
The ones that look aluminum are actually a silver alloy.
Most larger towns have somebody doing re-coneing, call them, or order from someone like OCS, Millersound, etc.
You generally only get one shot to do it right, so take the time to do it right.
Lead out wires on speaker that look like they are copper are actually phosphor-bronze or beryllium-copper alloys, not just plain copper.
The ones that look aluminum are actually a silver alloy.
Most larger towns have somebody doing re-coneing, call them, or order from someone like OCS, Millersound, etc.
You generally only get one shot to do it right, so take the time to do it right.
With the amount of magnet wire I have exposed... I could do it 20 times...
I really doubt super fine strand copper with flexible insulation would fail before a few years time. Honestly I dont care if it lasts forever... Its not my speaker. If he has to come back and pay me to fix it again in a year or two, well it will still be cheaper than having it done somewhere else or buying new speakers.
Just like the cone and suspension the leads have resonant nodes. I have experimented with other types of wire that was very flexible but if you connect the speaker to a function generator you will see gross vibration at ceartain frequencies grealy reducing reliability. At low power its fine but real tinsel leads are light and have a ceartain degree of damping or low Q. Heavy insulated wire that is too soft can actualy form multiple nodes at higher bass frequencies riping itself apart.
Hi,
your thoughts on using ultra flexible instrument lead sound OK.
But strip the insulation off, you don't need it tucked away as it is.
The 0.1mm cores used to form these leads will not fatigue that quickly and you could anneal them before you fit them to lengthen their life even more. If you are ambitious try plaiting them just like the ladies do with their hair. Looks real good on them, don't know about your speakers though.
your thoughts on using ultra flexible instrument lead sound OK.
But strip the insulation off, you don't need it tucked away as it is.
The 0.1mm cores used to form these leads will not fatigue that quickly and you could anneal them before you fit them to lengthen their life even more. If you are ambitious try plaiting them just like the ladies do with their hair. Looks real good on them, don't know about your speakers though.
I took a look at the Rat shack desoldering braid and well for 2dollas and a few cents I figured what the hell. Its super flexable and probably about 14 or 16 guage actually so it can handle some power I'm sure. I think Im going with this... Thanks for the suggestions guys... I think this thread is done
real lead-in braid is best, wick OK for bandaid
Got a Fender guitar amp here with the same problem. I took a look at the wire remnants under the microscope, hmmmm sure looks like somebody cut these wires with scissors. Now why would anybody do that? Anyway, I did put in some solderwick as the temporary fix, this allowed me to verify the speaker was still OK. Wick is OK but not great for this application, it will of course stiffen at the solder joints so you have to leave extra length for slack, it ain't as flexible so it won't move as well as real lead-in braid, I would worry about using it in this application. When you solder to it some of the flux dries out, after that you get tarnish, maybe you could reflux it to keep it flexible, who knows. If this was some precious restoration I wouldn't use the wick. Anyway I have ordered new lead-in wire, when it gets here I will replace the wick and fix it right. I couldn't find a local source, so I ordered from www.speakerbits.com in Australia, cost is reasonable, postage is about 3 bucks.
Got a Fender guitar amp here with the same problem. I took a look at the wire remnants under the microscope, hmmmm sure looks like somebody cut these wires with scissors. Now why would anybody do that? Anyway, I did put in some solderwick as the temporary fix, this allowed me to verify the speaker was still OK. Wick is OK but not great for this application, it will of course stiffen at the solder joints so you have to leave extra length for slack, it ain't as flexible so it won't move as well as real lead-in braid, I would worry about using it in this application. When you solder to it some of the flux dries out, after that you get tarnish, maybe you could reflux it to keep it flexible, who knows. If this was some precious restoration I wouldn't use the wick. Anyway I have ordered new lead-in wire, when it gets here I will replace the wick and fix it right. I couldn't find a local source, so I ordered from www.speakerbits.com in Australia, cost is reasonable, postage is about 3 bucks.
To increase the flexibility (and lessen the possibility of fatigue), just wind it round the shank of a small screwdriver or similar to form a self supporting spiral. This used to be a standard 'anti-vibration' trick, and I've seen military gear designed for rough handling in which all the components have a loop formed in their leads for the same reason.
I've actually been meaning to put an update here
I'm reluctant to say I am not very wise.... Whoever said desoldering wick wouldnt have much longevity... you were RIGHT! Either that or I really didnt leave enough slack because about 2 weeks ago I get a call and hear that the subs stopped working...
The leads were torn apart
I'm reluctant to say I am not very wise.... Whoever said desoldering wick wouldnt have much longevity... you were RIGHT! Either that or I really didnt leave enough slack because about 2 weeks ago I get a call and hear that the subs stopped working...
The leads were torn apart
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