Hello
I was wondering, why my DL103 cartridge sometimes sounded better and sometimes worse.
After removing the enclosure and the dust cover, I discovered iron filings touching the moving coil.
Any idea, how to remove this dust without destroying the windings?
Some years ago, my turntable spent some time in my workshop, where I also did metal work
Franz
I was wondering, why my DL103 cartridge sometimes sounded better and sometimes worse.
After removing the enclosure and the dust cover, I discovered iron filings touching the moving coil.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Any idea, how to remove this dust without destroying the windings?
Some years ago, my turntable spent some time in my workshop, where I also did metal work
Franz
See if you can blast them off with a can of isopropyl alcohol fitted with a tube in the nozzle?
http://cpc.farnell.com/SAIPA400H/el...vice-aids/product.us0?sku=electrolube-ipa400h
http://cpc.farnell.com/SAIPA400H/el...vice-aids/product.us0?sku=electrolube-ipa400h
Yes, seems to be a good idea, using a blast of isopropyl acohol. I'll try it.
I could remove some of the dust with a strong magnet. But not all.
Another view before cleaning:
Franz
I could remove some of the dust with a strong magnet. But not all.
Another view before cleaning:
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Franz
Adhesive tape (with the strongest adhesive you can find) will remove most of the visible filings, but what about any that have got into the yoke gap?
Yes I 've seen that before.
Use a fine brush to sweep them away ,be carefull not to rip any wire.
Compressed air, to blow it of?
Hope this helps.
F.
Use a fine brush to sweep them away ,be carefull not to rip any wire.
Compressed air, to blow it of?
Hope this helps.
F.
Removing
Hi
With respect, the advices given here are sure to break the coil wires. Blowing air or anything else will almost certainly shear the wires. Firsthand experience. I make 'em.
It would be best to take a small blob of well used plasticine (the stuff you stick notices with or kids play with). 'Knead' it in your hands until it becomes very pliable and then roll one end into a sharpish toothpick shape. Touch the magnetic particles and they will be adhering to the plasticine.
If it is likely you'll have more filings attracted to your cartridge, you can make a very thin membrane from high temperature silicone (the blue stuff). Squeeze a blob of the stuff on lintfree wax paper and put another piece of similar paper on top. Place on a sheet of glass with another shhet on top. Place a few kgs of weight on it and let it cure.
You will now have a very thin silicone membrane and ensure it has the thickness of rice paper.
Punch a disc of +-4mm dia from the membrane and cut a tiny slit with an NT cutter blade no longer than 1mm. Ensure there's enough space inside the casing and then slide the membrane over the cantilever. Ensure the disc is large enough to cover the coils but small enough to avoid snagging on the casing's inside.
WARNING: If you decide to try this, ensure the membrane does not pull the cantilever downwards when you insert the motor into the casing.
bulgin
Hi
With respect, the advices given here are sure to break the coil wires. Blowing air or anything else will almost certainly shear the wires. Firsthand experience. I make 'em.
It would be best to take a small blob of well used plasticine (the stuff you stick notices with or kids play with). 'Knead' it in your hands until it becomes very pliable and then roll one end into a sharpish toothpick shape. Touch the magnetic particles and they will be adhering to the plasticine.
If it is likely you'll have more filings attracted to your cartridge, you can make a very thin membrane from high temperature silicone (the blue stuff). Squeeze a blob of the stuff on lintfree wax paper and put another piece of similar paper on top. Place on a sheet of glass with another shhet on top. Place a few kgs of weight on it and let it cure.
You will now have a very thin silicone membrane and ensure it has the thickness of rice paper.
Punch a disc of +-4mm dia from the membrane and cut a tiny slit with an NT cutter blade no longer than 1mm. Ensure there's enough space inside the casing and then slide the membrane over the cantilever. Ensure the disc is large enough to cover the coils but small enough to avoid snagging on the casing's inside.
WARNING: If you decide to try this, ensure the membrane does not pull the cantilever downwards when you insert the motor into the casing.
bulgin
I was going to suggest Blu-tack. I use this the clean up smalll DC electric motors.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blu-tack
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blu-tack
Greg Erskine said:
Indeed I have used Blu-tak to clean up magnetic particles from the cartridge. I stick a pinhead-sized bead of blu-tak at the tip of a toothpick and GENTLY dab it unto the particles. Takes them right off the magnet. Particles that are not easily reachable are first CAREFULLY "swept" into position with a toothpick.
I have done this successfully many times. The only requirements are a feather touch and a little magnification. Also remember to keep your eyes ( I use a stereo microscope) on the delicate coils.
The blu-tak bead have to be changed every 3 or 4 dabs because it clogs up very fast.
Best practice first on a bad cartridge. You might find the procedure is not too difficult.
Bulgin's advice is good.
My $4000 Andriolli "Blue" got put down on a recent field of filings (Not me!) and after a total freakout, we took it to a fine machinist, who with the aid of a powerful microscope and the mentioned toothpick and bluetack,AND A LOT OF CARE, it cleaned up perfectly.
You can never hope to blow they off, they are too small to be bothered by the aitflow, and held too tight to the very sy=trong magnet, and you may damage the cartridge even more!
Regards, Allen
My $4000 Andriolli "Blue" got put down on a recent field of filings (Not me!) and after a total freakout, we took it to a fine machinist, who with the aid of a powerful microscope and the mentioned toothpick and bluetack,AND A LOT OF CARE, it cleaned up perfectly.
You can never hope to blow they off, they are too small to be bothered by the aitflow, and held too tight to the very sy=trong magnet, and you may damage the cartridge even more!
Regards, Allen
Thanks to all
Indeed, the particles are to small and they stick very strong at the magnet.
And the coils wires are sooo fragile!
I will follow the suggestions from Bulgin and post the results. But I must find the silent moment to do such a job.
Allen: do we see us at next ETF in Holland?
Looking forward
Franz
Indeed, the particles are to small and they stick very strong at the magnet.
And the coils wires are sooo fragile!
I will follow the suggestions from Bulgin and post the results. But I must find the silent moment to do such a job.
Allen: do we see us at next ETF in Holland?
Looking forward
Franz
Hi Franz,
Good luck and success with your cartridge.
I doubt if I will make the 8 hour drive to Holland for the ETF, such a stupid contest topic - what does that have to do with "real" tube audio?
Regards, Allen
Good luck and success with your cartridge.
I doubt if I will make the 8 hour drive to Holland for the ETF, such a stupid contest topic - what does that have to do with "real" tube audio?
Regards, Allen
Hi Allen
I regret, not to meet you there. But I completely agree to you: a "sound processor" shootout has nothing to do with "real" tube audio!
Thats why I take a 1 hour flight to Holland ;-)
I come visit you in Schaffhausen soon, as I live nearby since one year.
Regards
Franz
I regret, not to meet you there. But I completely agree to you: a "sound processor" shootout has nothing to do with "real" tube audio!
Thats why I take a 1 hour flight to Holland ;-)
I come visit you in Schaffhausen soon, as I live nearby since one year.
Regards
Franz
Franz,
Please do come and visit us in Schaffhausen. But please make a time before you do, we are not always here.
Love to see you! And to see all DIY Audio guys!
Regards, Allen
Please do come and visit us in Schaffhausen. But please make a time before you do, we are not always here.
Love to see you! And to see all DIY Audio guys!
Regards, Allen
Removing
Hi
It will be safer to form the plasticine itself into a sharp, toothpick-like end and use it directly without sticking it to the toothpick first. There's risk that the plasticine will detach from the toothpick and then you will have serious problems. I don't know the consistency/viscosity? of blue-tack as I have never used it. I found the stuff you buy as used by kids is perfect. Be sure to 'work' it in your fingers to become extra pliable and tacky. Warming under a lightbulb to get the right consistency will be OK. The 'right' consistency means that you should still be able to form it into a very sharp point without drooping. Magnification 10X with a clip-on loupe will be fine, plus good, natural light.
Ah, Schaffhausen, the town of IWC. The best watch in the world 😀 A few decades ago, I used to represent IWC locally.
bulgin
Hi
It will be safer to form the plasticine itself into a sharp, toothpick-like end and use it directly without sticking it to the toothpick first. There's risk that the plasticine will detach from the toothpick and then you will have serious problems. I don't know the consistency/viscosity? of blue-tack as I have never used it. I found the stuff you buy as used by kids is perfect. Be sure to 'work' it in your fingers to become extra pliable and tacky. Warming under a lightbulb to get the right consistency will be OK. The 'right' consistency means that you should still be able to form it into a very sharp point without drooping. Magnification 10X with a clip-on loupe will be fine, plus good, natural light.
Ah, Schaffhausen, the town of IWC. The best watch in the world 😀 A few decades ago, I used to represent IWC locally.
bulgin
Plasicine is not universally available worldwide, and neither is real Aussie bluetak. But I have some if Franz needs it.
IWC, I drive past their factory (new on going up right now) on my way to Schaffhausen's other world class manufacturer - Vacuum State!
Regards, Allen
IWC, I drive past their factory (new on going up right now) on my way to Schaffhausen's other world class manufacturer - Vacuum State!
Regards, Allen
Thanks Allen, for your offer.
It is no problem, in Switzerland this kind of clay is called Plastiline and easily available. I just go in my youngest daughters room to take some.
But: it is to late!
One channel is dead, after trying the isopropyl blast two days ago. 🙁
No catastrophe for me, as I use a EMT TSD15 (on my EMT930) and I have already a new DL103 (for daily use). I ordered the new DL103 before I opened the old one.
And the old one played many hundert hours within the last 8 years.
I hope, this thread will help in future another people to avoid this situation!
Conclusions:
- never put a moving coil cartridge on a workbench before cleaning the bench.
- cleaning with warm and soft plasticine/Plastiline using a 10x magnifying glass
Franz
It is no problem, in Switzerland this kind of clay is called Plastiline and easily available. I just go in my youngest daughters room to take some.
But: it is to late!
One channel is dead, after trying the isopropyl blast two days ago. 🙁
No catastrophe for me, as I use a EMT TSD15 (on my EMT930) and I have already a new DL103 (for daily use). I ordered the new DL103 before I opened the old one.
And the old one played many hundert hours within the last 8 years.
I hope, this thread will help in future another people to avoid this situation!
Conclusions:
- never put a moving coil cartridge on a workbench before cleaning the bench.
- cleaning with warm and soft plasticine/Plastiline using a 10x magnifying glass
Franz
Removing
My sympathies Franz
I usually hide my dead carts where I cannot see them😀
Good luck with the new one😉
bulgin
My sympathies Franz
I usually hide my dead carts where I cannot see them😀
Good luck with the new one😉
bulgin
Re: Removing
Me too ! 😀 Once long forgotten they have a tendency to resurface and remind me of the circumstances of their demise..
Sadly some good cartridges like a Decca London, and a Denon DL-103 also went awol..
bulgin said:
Me too ! 😀 Once long forgotten they have a tendency to resurface and remind me of the circumstances of their demise..
Sadly some good cartridges like a Decca London, and a Denon DL-103 also went awol..
Thanks for your sympathies!
My Decca London, I used from 1974 to about 1980, I sold it two or three years ago to a fellow to refurbish it.
In the eighties, I used a Shure V15III. Only one of my three kids destroyed once a needle cantilever.
This Shure is still in use, in possession of a friend of mine.
And once I shot a (second hand) DL160 by burning the coils with a phonoclone, driven by reversed voltage, resulting in some voltage at the inputs
It is still in my household, but very well hidden...
Franz
My Decca London, I used from 1974 to about 1980, I sold it two or three years ago to a fellow to refurbish it.
In the eighties, I used a Shure V15III. Only one of my three kids destroyed once a needle cantilever.
This Shure is still in use, in possession of a friend of mine.
And once I shot a (second hand) DL160 by burning the coils with a phonoclone, driven by reversed voltage, resulting in some voltage at the inputs
It is still in my household, but very well hidden...
Franz
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