thanks apart from the dispersion how do you rate the sound quality ? i like the technical idea of these drivers buy haven't heard many opinions about their sound quality. I feel like dispersion could be delbt with . an acoustic lense of some sort like you describe could maybe help there. had interesting results using a scaled karlsonator on a faital pro 3fe25 . no measurements but sounds pretty even around the room which is all I worry about really . maybe some version of this or similar could be used
I'm a huge fan of well made planar drivers in general, so I'm a little biased. I personally feel that once equalized, they are more resolving of fine details than traditional cone drivers. They certainly have simpler construction (NOT easier to make necessarily) and less distortion causing mechanisms than cone drivers. I've been using the BG product for a long time and these Radian drivers are the next step in that basic design. Same designer, Igor Levitski. Do the current improvements SOUND any better than their BG couterparts? I don't have an answer for that. Are the worth the much higher asking price as compared to the Parts Express BG copies or similar chinese knockoffs? To me, yes. The construction quality is much higher. But make no mistake, the Parts Express drivers are great at their price points.
thanks this is exactly what I wanted to hear ! I'm more tempted by the radian as imagined it would be better and more consistently made than the parts express drivers . some of the smaller tweeters seen really affordable as well so not too painfull to add to an order just in case you can't improve the dispersion of the ln10n
An accessible copy of Vance Dickason's test review of the Radian LM10n planar midrange now appears in the May 2024 edition of Audioxpress Magazine, in the Voice Coil Test Bench section.
That is certainly my experience with the handful I've had. I would not be surprised if the higher price is simply a factor of QC rejects.
That said, the LT6 has bigger magnets than the Neo3 type drivers which causes more off-axis bumps and for me that stopped me using it as a tweeter. I'm not sure if that is the case for the Ln10n vs Neo10. Maybe not, looking at the front hole pattern?
The physical build quality of the Radian is much higher than the PE or BG clones. At least on the V2 drivers. All of the Radian now share the same construction as the large 8 and 10" units. They are very substantial and feel like a quality product. But I suspect you are right, and that these are sorted out to a highly consistent degree.
Is there a Radian planar that can be used from around 350Hz up to replace a Manger driver...? I would like to clone this speaker, Overkill Audio Encore but use a planar instead of the Manger. https://www.diyaudio.com/community/threads/system-pictures-description.23208/page-115
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No, there isn't. The Manger can do that because it has a significant xmax (travel distance). You will be able to see it popping back and forwards with loud snare drums etc..
Planars have minimal travel distance, like barely measurable.
You might do it with a full range driver or a BMR.
Planars have minimal travel distance, like barely measurable.
You might do it with a full range driver or a BMR.
Thanks, thats interesting.
I have tried lots of BMR's and variations but none of them are good enough.
I will keep looking...
Cheers
A.
I have tried lots of BMR's and variations but none of them are good enough.
I will keep looking...
Cheers
A.
I'm going to disagree with Tenson here. I think a single Lm10 can work well as low as 350-500 with a steep cover and dsp correction. As far as I know, those Manger drivers have rather low sensitivity themselves, so the radian already has an advantage. They can actually take quiet a fair amount of clean power too. Once in a sealed enclosure, the low end doesn't roll off as bad as the plots that you see being open baffle. The trouble you'll run into is HF beaming, but you might solve that with acoustic felt cheeks to block a portion of the diaphragm from emitting HF energy.
Thanks Studiotech, that opens up some possibilities...I am hoping to keep it a simple two way, so could run twin Beyma P80 Fe/N 12 inch or maybe 15 inch or 15 P80 Fe/N) with the Planar in the middle MTM style so crossing over around 1,000 Hz with the 12's or around 700 to 800 with the 15's.
Or not keep it simple.... Enter these bad boys https://legacyaudio.com/products/view/valor
I am fascinated by the twin AMT in a horizontal configuration and keen to explore the concept. Running two planar drivers in place of the two AMT's could work?
Also, how how about this idea:
Three planar drivers, One in the center mounted vertically with one each side mounted horizontally?
That would reduce diaphragm movement by 66 %,(decreasing all distortions by 66%!) increase sensitivity by over 4dB and if wired in parallel, gain another 4 dB or so from dropping impedance to around 2.6 Ohms (assuming they are 8 Ohm rated?) (My power amps are totally stable with very low impedance loads).
So a super sensitive, low distortion mid/top driver array with very broad and even coverage.... 🙂🙂 Yea!
To me these advantages far out weigh the overrated issue of comb filtering / interference from three overlapping point sources.
What do you think...Thanks!
A.
PS I am not a fan of most commercial loudspeaker companies, but over the years I think Legacy Audio has offered great value high end products, this is one of Bills videos explaining some of his ideas..... Interesting stuff. https://legacyaudio.com/news/watch-lifting-the-veil-on-music-with-legacy-audio
Or not keep it simple.... Enter these bad boys https://legacyaudio.com/products/view/valor
I am fascinated by the twin AMT in a horizontal configuration and keen to explore the concept. Running two planar drivers in place of the two AMT's could work?
Also, how how about this idea:
Three planar drivers, One in the center mounted vertically with one each side mounted horizontally?
That would reduce diaphragm movement by 66 %,(decreasing all distortions by 66%!) increase sensitivity by over 4dB and if wired in parallel, gain another 4 dB or so from dropping impedance to around 2.6 Ohms (assuming they are 8 Ohm rated?) (My power amps are totally stable with very low impedance loads).
So a super sensitive, low distortion mid/top driver array with very broad and even coverage.... 🙂🙂 Yea!
To me these advantages far out weigh the overrated issue of comb filtering / interference from three overlapping point sources.
What do you think...Thanks!
A.
PS I am not a fan of most commercial loudspeaker companies, but over the years I think Legacy Audio has offered great value high end products, this is one of Bills videos explaining some of his ideas..... Interesting stuff. https://legacyaudio.com/news/watch-lifting-the-veil-on-music-with-legacy-audio
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Yes sorry my late night reply was a bit of mixed thinking. This is true. A large planar like LM10 or Neo10 won't work as a replacement to the Manger due to excessive HF beaming (and geneal HF off-axis irregularities). In general, most planars that can act as a tweeter will be limited on the low end. Even the 10" ones won't like 350hz you'll need more like 500hz.
I have played with foam cheeks on a Neo10 and Neo8. There is just no way it will do without a tweeter. You need to loose so much output at the top end by foam absorption that you end up with an unusuable amount of treble, even for DSP.
I've also owned Manger drivers. If they were £100- £150 each Id recommend them. Sadly they are far more expensive, I checked my emails just now and I sold the pair used for £536 in 2007. God know what they cost today?
I never got them to perform in a way I was truly happy with. They were dynamic and had a smooth response but after a longer time with them I could not dismiss the lack of 'inner detail' that you get with really low distortion speakers (such as good planars!).
Does anyone happen to know the Sd and Xmax of the LM10N?
Or if not, is there any information about this parameters from BG Neo10 or similar drivers?
I would like to find out, which Max SPL we can expect from the LM10N at 300Hz.
Or if not, is there any information about this parameters from BG Neo10 or similar drivers?
I would like to find out, which Max SPL we can expect from the LM10N at 300Hz.
The membrane's ripples squeeze and expand instead of "normal" back and forth movement. They compress at too high signal amplitude instead of bottoming, so they are kind of forgiving.
I've stressed my B&G Neo 8 and Neo3 open back sometimes, but I don't use club-like spl. Below outdoor measurements individually and as system, dipole, mic distance was 1.2 - 1.5m I don't remember. Neo8 gets rapidly stressed below 600Hz but for nearfield use it might go gown to 300Hz well
indoor at 1.6m
I've stressed my B&G Neo 8 and Neo3 open back sometimes, but I don't use club-like spl. Below outdoor measurements individually and as system, dipole, mic distance was 1.2 - 1.5m I don't remember. Neo8 gets rapidly stressed below 600Hz but for nearfield use it might go gown to 300Hz well
indoor at 1.6m
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The sound is nice. The speaker was voted to have best sound at a diy audio fest...
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1a44vFKWPlnALozIWkUXtBFl90Haa35JE/view?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1a44vFKWPlnALozIWkUXtBFl90Haa35JE/view?usp=sharing
Can four of these be used without tweeter in a array with shading of no 1&4 with inductors?
And I mount them in a closed box?
I will use active crossover and dsp
And I mount them in a closed box?
I will use active crossover and dsp
You can try. HF dispersion will be narrow, both horizontally and vertically if you don't try to make something to mask off a portion of the radiating surface area. Regarding the closed box, depending on your ultimate SPL needs, you may get down to 200-300hz cleanly, handing off to a nice woofer. Use a good amount of absorption material inside the box with the LM10.
@studiotech
Have you implemented these?
How do they sound compared to your prior reference midrange?
I've had an eye on these for open baffle, like the designer has done.
Have you implemented these?
How do they sound compared to your prior reference midrange?
I've had an eye on these for open baffle, like the designer has done.
I still have not finalized a design just yet for the ultra near field chair system using these. And I'm still collecting parts. Recently bought a Kali Audio SW-6.2 for low bass duties to use in conjunction with the radian planars. This little thing tested so well on Erin's audio corner I couldn't resist.