I agree... UK consumer rights are pretty good (Sale of Goods act) and yes it does work... don't be fobbed off.
Consumer rights and where to get help : Directgov - Government, citizens and rights
Keep calm, put it all in writing, get names of people you speak to and get the address of their registered head office.
Good luck 🙂 .... well actually luck doesn't come into it... it's your right.
Pay by credit card... contact the card company if all else fails.
I've asked for a collection AGAIN this Friday, and if they don't collect it, then I can claim the money back through Barclaycard/Paypal right? Anyway as they're reluctant to send out a replacement in time for my birthday party, I've been forced to order it elsewhere. Is there anything I need to watch out about incase this happens again? For the record, I did order proper speaker 6.35mm jacks with the amp too. It seems to be the same model amp but aparrently it only takes up 2 rack spaces whereas the faulty one I currently have takes up 3 rack spaces. This might be wrong, just have to wait and see.
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Well since you decided on your course of action ie business dealings and choosing the same rig.
I would take uppermost caution in setup and operation
1) connect everything up cold/off and gains on minimum
2) turn on everything but esp turn on PA lastly
3) raise the gains up slowly
4) Do not do any hot swapping of PA ins and outs to trouble shoot.
5) Reverse above sequence on powering down.
I would take uppermost caution in setup and operation
1) connect everything up cold/off and gains on minimum
2) turn on everything but esp turn on PA lastly
3) raise the gains up slowly
4) Do not do any hot swapping of PA ins and outs to trouble shoot.
5) Reverse above sequence on powering down.
And #6:
Get a digital voltmeter (I've seen them as cheap as $5.) and check the amps output terminals (turned on but no signal input) and verify THERE IS NO DC ON THE OUTPUTS!!!!! If there is, do not connect ANY load! (There might be a little bit like .05 Volts which is OK.)
But you probably need to learn to fix these things. There is a plethora of info here on the web and you could probably go to the library and check out some books on electronics. (There is even an Electronics for Dummies book which might be a good start.
Hey, what would you do if you were driving down the road and see a Crown in a trash can? Why, you'd stop and pick it up and take it home. That's happened to me. It would probably have at least 1 channel blown. But, remember this, if it worked before, it can work again!
Get a digital voltmeter (I've seen them as cheap as $5.) and check the amps output terminals (turned on but no signal input) and verify THERE IS NO DC ON THE OUTPUTS!!!!! If there is, do not connect ANY load! (There might be a little bit like .05 Volts which is OK.)
But you probably need to learn to fix these things. There is a plethora of info here on the web and you could probably go to the library and check out some books on electronics. (There is even an Electronics for Dummies book which might be a good start.
Hey, what would you do if you were driving down the road and see a Crown in a trash can? Why, you'd stop and pick it up and take it home. That's happened to me. It would probably have at least 1 channel blown. But, remember this, if it worked before, it can work again!
Would I? I probably wouldn't for many reasons, mainly that I will NOT find a Crown amp lying in a trash can cos people don't chuck them out unless they're BEYOND repair, secondly they're not thrown in trash cans, they're put in electronics recycling and thirdly it'd probably water damaged from rain. Then it will NEVER work again. You cannot repair water damaged electronics. I would know.
I'll look for a multimeter when the damn amp arrives, there seems to be a delay in order processing...
DC PROTECTION
Is Item in post #44 a good option for running vintage Amps (80') with Fancy drivers?
or a fuse is better?
Marc
Is Item in post #44 a good option for running vintage Amps (80') with Fancy drivers?
or a fuse is better?
Marc
waterlogged electronics
I worked for a company that, as a fill project when there wasn't anything urgent going on, repaired a $200000 Texas Instruments DFS III (Digital Field System) that had sunk in the sea off Ethopia for a week. Salt water really does a job on things, but after they fished it out, they put it in fresh water tubs and sent it by sea back to Houston. The connectors that weren't gold plated had to be replaced, the corrosion couldn't be stopped. But the bill was a lot less than $200000. An amp only has about 6 connectors, and they need to be replaced every 20 years whether it sunk in salt water or not.
I looked at the website in post # 44 about the rapid protector. The technical specifications link came up as a blank page with a tiny logo. I've asked on the DC protection thread if it is snake oil, but nobody has an opinion. The picture shows a device with 2 big capacitors, 2 relays, and some other things. If the capacitors are 3300 uf @ 85 WV, they are good for a 120 watt channel, but who knows without a spec. The relays would have to be tied to a detection circuit, or they have to provide one that can be set to what? wattage limit? See the speaker protection thread currently showing three stars for more discussion. Bottom line, the simplest solution is a diac (two back to back zeners) set to a couple of volts below the power supply rails on a dual supply amp, triggering a triac big enough to blow the speaker fuses, or lacking that, the power supply fuse. Good luck.
I worked for a company that, as a fill project when there wasn't anything urgent going on, repaired a $200000 Texas Instruments DFS III (Digital Field System) that had sunk in the sea off Ethopia for a week. Salt water really does a job on things, but after they fished it out, they put it in fresh water tubs and sent it by sea back to Houston. The connectors that weren't gold plated had to be replaced, the corrosion couldn't be stopped. But the bill was a lot less than $200000. An amp only has about 6 connectors, and they need to be replaced every 20 years whether it sunk in salt water or not.
I looked at the website in post # 44 about the rapid protector. The technical specifications link came up as a blank page with a tiny logo. I've asked on the DC protection thread if it is snake oil, but nobody has an opinion. The picture shows a device with 2 big capacitors, 2 relays, and some other things. If the capacitors are 3300 uf @ 85 WV, they are good for a 120 watt channel, but who knows without a spec. The relays would have to be tied to a detection circuit, or they have to provide one that can be set to what? wattage limit? See the speaker protection thread currently showing three stars for more discussion. Bottom line, the simplest solution is a diac (two back to back zeners) set to a couple of volts below the power supply rails on a dual supply amp, triggering a triac big enough to blow the speaker fuses, or lacking that, the power supply fuse. Good luck.
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No. A fuse takes too long to blow. Your speakers would be toast in the event of DC by the time a fuse blows.
But yeah, it should be okay for a vintage amp presuming the wattage is not too high. But it can stand 90V DC so I would think it would be fine.
Anyway the amp arrived today in absolutely appauling condition. One of the corners was bent and the cord's plug was in pieces. Nevertheless, I replaced the plug (just the plug, the cord was fine) and mounted the amp and its blanking plates into my 4U case. This is a different model than the one which blew at the beginning of this topic because it only takes 2 rack spaces so I mounted it in the middle of the rack. So far, so good. Lasted longer than 2 minutes, still going should be okay for my 16th party on Sunday. Had to use speakon adapters cos it doesn't have jack outputs and my speakers only have jack inputs. Hehe, should have considered this when I designed my speakers.
However, the sound quality is NO WHERE NEAR as good as the Sansui Hi-fi amp. The bass is really weak too. Why is this? The Sansui was made in like 1970s and still beats a 2000s piece of kit on sound quality...
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Would have to measure it to see. Is it really low or just subjectively low (maybe because the amp sounds harsh ?).
Sansui was pretty decent at the time... perhaps it was a circuit that sounded warm and musical (even harmonics predominating in the distortion).
At least you got the amp 🙂
I bet the Sansui amp was an FET amp. They do sound different. When I worked for the government we routinely washed electronic equipment to get the dirt and grime out. Then you have to let them completely dry in a hot box. Then we fixed them.
What's a FET amp? I know the Skytronic one is a MOSFET one.
Yes the Skytronic one does sound slightly harsh at times but I did manage to boost the bass on it with iTunes and Realtek because it the amp only has volume contols whereas the Sansui amp has bass/treble controls so I didn't need to adjust it on the PC till now. Also the ground loop is ******* me off pretty bad but some tape over the Earth pin on the laptop's power supply fixed it.
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Hi thought id pipe in.
Some Crowns , QSC's and other commercial amps are actually manufactured under contract by Phonic . Im pretty sure you have Phonic in britain , I use a number of them in pro situations and thier as bullet proof as the "name" companies they manufacture for. You should be able to find a MAX 1500 or 2500 used on ebay for decent money and It'll give you exactly what you want , they are also remarkably decent sounding amps. The only difference with name brand is usually a better service network. Phonic still needs some help in this area , but as many of thier designs are just "relabeled" for the name manufacturers they are virtually identical .
Note; Tech's have a name for FET's when they let loose , it's not Field Effect Transistor its Fire Emiting Transistor's :-}
Cheers....Rck
Found a pro-amp for sale in britain Ebay
Yamaha P4500 Power Amplifier on eBay (end time 01-Jun-10 00:01:15 BST)
Only 175 but well worth it.
Cheers....Rck
Yamaha P4500 Power Amplifier on eBay (end time 01-Jun-10 00:01:15 BST)
Only 175 but well worth it.
Cheers....Rck
I actually thought Crown were owned by Harmon Internation Industries. It kinda explains why they're so expensive!
Anyway are you basically saying my beloved Sansui amplifier will go up in flames 😱 I only found it in the attic half a year ago!
Reply
Harmon Kardon is like most of the more expensive brands held by a management company these days.
Typically they will contract many of thier designs.
Due to the cost of trying to manage a manufacturing operation , most commercial electronics manufacturing is actually done by 3rd parties .
So the end result is that most this stuff is made under contract by other guys like Phonic, who's been around since 77 and doing contract manufacturing forever.
They actually make good product.
Companies like QSC who has contracted them for I think 3 or 4 different amps insist on a specific parts usage and design methodologies.
The result is your get what you pay for the QSC amps are more expensive
but , they have an excellent dealer network and decent service on thier products . 3 of Phonics are identical , but phonic doesn't have a strong dealer network or strong service. The result is you pay much less, but if you do have a problem , you better know some good QSC tech's or crown tech's to help you.
FET amps only go up in flames when submitted to the most excessive abuse or outright failure , most FET amps have a lot of protection on them to prevent such occurances. So your old Sansui should be fine .
If you know how to solder "properly" I would take the cover off and look for any "wire-wrap" connections .
"Wire-Wrap" was a technique used in the 70's and 80's for electronic and computer connections which sped up the manufacturing process.
It essentially consist's of interconnect wires inside the amp being wrapped around terminal pins on various circuit boards . Wrie wrap used an "average" quality solid wire for these interconnect's (ie Board to Board)
either solder these connections using liberal amounts of flux to remove
oxides or replace the wire outright with a good quality 18ga multi strand teflon coated wire (tends to significantly improve signal quality.
Them use something like MG Chemical "Safety wash" on the pot's (getting it inside them is always interesting . Most 70's build Japanese stuff is very well made ( read overbuilt) , remember they where being funded by their government to basically kill the american electronics marketplace.
So there's many really good examples of well built stuff from the 70's , Sansui was one of them.
Cheers...Rck
Harmon Kardon is like most of the more expensive brands held by a management company these days.
Typically they will contract many of thier designs.
Due to the cost of trying to manage a manufacturing operation , most commercial electronics manufacturing is actually done by 3rd parties .
So the end result is that most this stuff is made under contract by other guys like Phonic, who's been around since 77 and doing contract manufacturing forever.
They actually make good product.
Companies like QSC who has contracted them for I think 3 or 4 different amps insist on a specific parts usage and design methodologies.
The result is your get what you pay for the QSC amps are more expensive
but , they have an excellent dealer network and decent service on thier products . 3 of Phonics are identical , but phonic doesn't have a strong dealer network or strong service. The result is you pay much less, but if you do have a problem , you better know some good QSC tech's or crown tech's to help you.
FET amps only go up in flames when submitted to the most excessive abuse or outright failure , most FET amps have a lot of protection on them to prevent such occurances. So your old Sansui should be fine .
If you know how to solder "properly" I would take the cover off and look for any "wire-wrap" connections .
"Wire-Wrap" was a technique used in the 70's and 80's for electronic and computer connections which sped up the manufacturing process.
It essentially consist's of interconnect wires inside the amp being wrapped around terminal pins on various circuit boards . Wrie wrap used an "average" quality solid wire for these interconnect's (ie Board to Board)
either solder these connections using liberal amounts of flux to remove
oxides or replace the wire outright with a good quality 18ga multi strand teflon coated wire (tends to significantly improve signal quality.
Them use something like MG Chemical "Safety wash" on the pot's (getting it inside them is always interesting . Most 70's build Japanese stuff is very well made ( read overbuilt) , remember they where being funded by their government to basically kill the american electronics marketplace.
So there's many really good examples of well built stuff from the 70's , Sansui was one of them.
Cheers...Rck
found by the side of the road
There is a Crown CS1000 in Wincester, KY for $150 Friday 5/21.
CROWN CE1000 Power Amp - $150 (Winchester,Ky.)
Date: 2010-05-21, 2:26PM EDT
Reply to: sale-5bsrq-1752548355@craigslist.org [Errors when replying to ads?]
Works and looks great.
Been used in home audio past 2 years
I will guarantee it.
Price is FIRM!
Call eight59-744-5809 "Unquote.
Got a really nice picture of the Stakon connectors on the back in the ad, I've never seen them before. This amp has so much power it would light my ears up and make them blink. Bet it has a better protection circuit than yours. Pity your mains voltage is 220.
There is a Crown CS1000 in Wincester, KY for $150 Friday 5/21.
CROWN CE1000 Power Amp - $150 (Winchester,Ky.)
Date: 2010-05-21, 2:26PM EDT
Reply to: sale-5bsrq-1752548355@craigslist.org [Errors when replying to ads?]
Works and looks great.
Been used in home audio past 2 years
I will guarantee it.
Price is FIRM!
Call eight59-744-5809 "Unquote.
Got a really nice picture of the Stakon connectors on the back in the ad, I've never seen them before. This amp has so much power it would light my ears up and make them blink. Bet it has a better protection circuit than yours. Pity your mains voltage is 220.
Watch it bud... depends on the definition of "you", as it doesn't include me. 🙄
Case history: I fully repaired and got operational a sharp LCD TV that was damaged in a fire, and hit with a fire hose and fire extinguisher also. then it sat for a couple weeks before i got it. Now it works and got put back into service. Sure, it took a new bezel and stand, but the electronics were 100% recoverable. and the panel sustained minor polerizer film damage which i peeled off and replaced.
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Well bit off topic, but my ol' iPod Nano couldn't be repaired after water damage... I left it in my pocket, trousers went through the wash. Dried for weeks on end without trying to turn it on, then finally plugged it into the PC. Apple Logo appears w/o backlight. Backlight 'tries' to switch on, but iPod cuts out then does the cycle again and again. The battery was abnormally large too. So I removed it and plugged the iPod into the mains, it does work but cannot be synched to any PC. So that's not good enough.
Anyway thanks for finding the QSC amp but incase no one's realized, I live in the UK 😀
Also I don't think the Sansui AU 2200 has ANY protection whatsoever. Infact, it makes a LOUD pop when I switch it on too.
Well those kinds of electronics are a different story. most of that type have BGAs and when oxidation setup underneith the IC, yea itll reek havok like that. I guess i got lucky with mine as it has a BGA as well.
I've had many hi-fi systems and I can assure you that the amplifier changes the sound quite markedly. I worked up through the food-chain until I ended up with a 150W class A amp, which sounded better than all the previous ones.
Then I tried a tube amp - I'll be not buying any more transistors for audio 😉
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