Hello,
I have a Philip CD650 cd player. It has a CDM-2 transport. I've tweaked a couple of caps, bypassed oversampling and lifted a few resistors. It has been working amazing for the past 10 years and even better since the mods i made.
But today it died. I turned it on, it was cold, hadnt been used in hours, popped in an original CD. Pressed played, heard music. Then i skipped forward about 5 tracks with the remote control. I waited for the 5th track to start when it flashed DISC ERROR in the display! Since then, it hasn't recognized a single CD that i've put in, doesnt even display number of tracks and play time.
I also had heard, in the past few weeks, i handful of random static screaches. A CD would be playing and then there would be a quick scratchy noise, i would rewind to play the same part of the CD, thinking my CD was damaged, and then it would play perfectly... were these the warning signs of laser failure?
Now, this is what happens when i put in a CD: the CD does not spin, it is loaded and remains stopped (i can see through a little window). if i press play, i hear the transport moving but the cd remains stopped and then a get the DISC ERROR message.
if i leave a cd inside the player, turn it off and on, the CD begins to spin, i then get the disc error message and it keeps spinning for ever.
what i tried: opened it up, disassembled transport. the laser is not jammed, it rotates freely around its axe. the flat ribbon that connects the laser to the rest of the transport is also good, i tested all connnections with a multimeter. i then cleaned the laser using a dry cotton swab. it only had some dust. there were no signs of leaked caps or burnt electronics.
this resulted in no change.
where should i go from here, is it the laser that failed or something else? (the cd player does have thousands of hours of playing time in its 10 year history). is it possible to replace the laser?
i think i covered all the bases, but if i left someinfo out, please ask.
any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks.
I have a Philip CD650 cd player. It has a CDM-2 transport. I've tweaked a couple of caps, bypassed oversampling and lifted a few resistors. It has been working amazing for the past 10 years and even better since the mods i made.
But today it died. I turned it on, it was cold, hadnt been used in hours, popped in an original CD. Pressed played, heard music. Then i skipped forward about 5 tracks with the remote control. I waited for the 5th track to start when it flashed DISC ERROR in the display! Since then, it hasn't recognized a single CD that i've put in, doesnt even display number of tracks and play time.
I also had heard, in the past few weeks, i handful of random static screaches. A CD would be playing and then there would be a quick scratchy noise, i would rewind to play the same part of the CD, thinking my CD was damaged, and then it would play perfectly... were these the warning signs of laser failure?
Now, this is what happens when i put in a CD: the CD does not spin, it is loaded and remains stopped (i can see through a little window). if i press play, i hear the transport moving but the cd remains stopped and then a get the DISC ERROR message.
if i leave a cd inside the player, turn it off and on, the CD begins to spin, i then get the disc error message and it keeps spinning for ever.
what i tried: opened it up, disassembled transport. the laser is not jammed, it rotates freely around its axe. the flat ribbon that connects the laser to the rest of the transport is also good, i tested all connnections with a multimeter. i then cleaned the laser using a dry cotton swab. it only had some dust. there were no signs of leaked caps or burnt electronics.
this resulted in no change.
where should i go from here, is it the laser that failed or something else? (the cd player does have thousands of hours of playing time in its 10 year history). is it possible to replace the laser?
i think i covered all the bases, but if i left someinfo out, please ask.
any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks.
Open it up and remove the thing that holds the CD down.
Than switch it on without CD. You should see that the laser moves up and down and that the laser is on:
If you look at it from an angle
you can see an orange glow around the lens. But you don't see then that the receiving diodes work.
Or you can wait until i get home and post the testmode here😀
Might be a bit safer. From the testmode you can see at what stage it fails.
There is a CDM-4 drop-in replacement for a CDM-2. But they are scarse i guess. Maybe it is possible to take a CDM-4 laser from a 'normal' CDM-4 unit and put it on the CDM-2. The spinningmotor of CDM-2 is said to be better than CDM-4 (brushless, less effects on the rest of the circuits).
gr
Than switch it on without CD. You should see that the laser moves up and down and that the laser is on:
If you look at it from an angle
you can see an orange glow around the lens. But you don't see then that the receiving diodes work.Or you can wait until i get home and post the testmode here😀
Might be a bit safer. From the testmode you can see at what stage it fails.
There is a CDM-4 drop-in replacement for a CDM-2. But they are scarse i guess. Maybe it is possible to take a CDM-4 laser from a 'normal' CDM-4 unit and put it on the CDM-2. The spinningmotor of CDM-2 is said to be better than CDM-4 (brushless, less effects on the rest of the circuits).
gr
Ok, i got into test mode, seems to fail on laser focus. i think my laser did infact die 🙁
where should i go from here? dont tell me the player is as good as garbage...
does the cd960 use spdif or I2S?
where should i go from here? dont tell me the player is as good as garbage...
does the cd960 use spdif or I2S?
Ok, so you got to position 1 and it went back to 0. So laser focus does not work.
Open the player and remove the plastic holding the cd down (carefull, there is a spring loose then at the top). Now switch it on without CD.
Does the lense go up and down?
Does the laser emmit light (look at it from an ANGLE never straight into it. From an angle you can see a faint orange glow on the edge of the lense.
Greetings,
Open the player and remove the plastic holding the cd down (carefull, there is a spring loose then at the top). Now switch it on without CD.
Does the lense go up and down?
Does the laser emmit light (look at it from an ANGLE never straight into it. From an angle you can see a faint orange glow on the edge of the lense.
Greetings,
Did ya switch to sudden death mode ?
Just kidding...
Why not buy a new one from ebay, they are cheap.
If you can not fix it, have used but good cdm2, will sell one for 10$ + shipping.
homer09 said:
Just kidding...
Why not buy a new one from ebay, they are cheap.
If you can not fix it, have used but good cdm2, will sell one for 10$ + shipping.
Maybe i got ahead of myself, this is exactly what happens when i go into service mode:
without a cd: stays at 0, no matter what
with a cd:
- if i press next, it goes to 1, but stays there for ever.
- then i press next again, gets stuck on 2
- then next again, makes a different noise, goes to 3 for about one second and returns to 0.
I removed the plastic part the covers lens, turned on the cd player without cd like you asked me to do. the laser lens does infact move up and down a few times everytime i push play. i then darkened the room and try to see if there was a faint orange glow emitting from the lens, i was able to see 3 red dots on the edge, i guess this is the glow you are talking about. it has to be coming from the laser since it turns off when i turn off the player.
so if there is a glow, my laser is still good? what is the problem then? if you want me to do any other tests, just ask.
thanks so much for the help.
without a cd: stays at 0, no matter what
with a cd:
- if i press next, it goes to 1, but stays there for ever.
- then i press next again, gets stuck on 2
- then next again, makes a different noise, goes to 3 for about one second and returns to 0.
I removed the plastic part the covers lens, turned on the cd player without cd like you asked me to do. the laser lens does infact move up and down a few times everytime i push play. i then darkened the room and try to see if there was a faint orange glow emitting from the lens, i was able to see 3 red dots on the edge, i guess this is the glow you are talking about. it has to be coming from the laser since it turns off when i turn off the player.
so if there is a glow, my laser is still good? what is the problem then? if you want me to do any other tests, just ask.
thanks so much for the help.
thank you Bernhard
i will definetly consider buying yer cdm2 if guido can't solve my problem. you say they are cheap and easily available on ebay. is it just me, or am i unable to find any transports for sale on ebay?
i will definetly consider buying yer cdm2 if guido can't solve my problem. you say they are cheap and easily available on ebay. is it just me, or am i unable to find any transports for sale on ebay?
Hi guido,
Hi Homer,
Guido,
Can i do these service tests with my CD104 ?
I got the B&O service manual - many thanks, but my its complicated for a novice like me
Should the disc/motor be spinning when the laser is moving up and down ? mine does not, does yours at this point homer ?
I have to either fix it soon or return it for a refund from the guy i got it from - but i REALLY dont want to do that, i'd love to keep it
Guido,
Can you see where i should check for a voltage on the motor when it should spin the disc ?
Thanks.
I know, im a
🙁 Sorry guido, im just running out of time i can keep it
Hi Homer,
Guido,
Can i do these service tests with my CD104 ?
I got the B&O service manual - many thanks, but my its complicated for a novice like me
Should the disc/motor be spinning when the laser is moving up and down ? mine does not, does yours at this point homer ?
I have to either fix it soon or return it for a refund from the guy i got it from - but i REALLY dont want to do that, i'd love to keep it
Guido,
Can you see where i should check for a voltage on the motor when it should spin the disc ?
Thanks.
I know, im a
🙁 Sorry guido, im just running out of time i can keep it
=> It will always stay at a level, until you hit next!
0=standby
1=focus done!
2=disk starts spinning, arm goes to centre of the disk
3=start reading the disk.
So focus is ok, guess the laser is fine!
But now for your problem. Maybe the arm does not move ok.
Go to mode 0 and use f forward and f reverse to move the arm.
The arm should move quite quickly back and forth.
It is going to be difficult to do measurements. You need to do them on the pcb under the transport..
Guido
0=standby
1=focus done!
2=disk starts spinning, arm goes to centre of the disk
3=start reading the disk.
So focus is ok, guess the laser is fine!
But now for your problem. Maybe the arm does not move ok.
Go to mode 0 and use f forward and f reverse to move the arm.
The arm should move quite quickly back and forth.
It is going to be difficult to do measurements. You need to do them on the pcb under the transport..
Guido
brianuk said:Hi guido,
Hi Homer,
Guido,
Can i do these service tests with my CD104 ?
I got the B&O service manual - many thanks, but my its complicated for a novice like me
Should the disc/motor be spinning when the laser is moving up and down ? mine does not, does yours at this point homer ?
I have to either fix it soon or return it for a refund from the guy i got it from - but i REALLY dont want to do that, i'd love to keep it
Guido,
Can you see where i should check for a voltage on the motor when it should spin the disc ?
Thanks.
I know, im a
I think the disk only starts spinning after focus is done. So you should also check if you can 'see' the laser (Angle!). There is no testmode as far as i know, just the flowchart at the end of the doc.
Remember, there are many parts in these old players. Many things that can go wrong. Probably the fault is a bad connection or soldering
guido said:
ok i have confirmed that that arm does in fact move in mode 0. a single tap of search forward or backward sends the arm to the other end where it bounces a little before stopping in position. it responds well and seems to be working fine.
if you say that the player is supposed to remain in test position until your press next, then i guess my player has a problem at test 3, because it only stays at 3 for 1 second and jumps back to 1. what does the service manual say about that?
thanks alot, at least i know my laser is fine, thats a relief, now to find the real culprit... what measurements do i have to make? i have digital multimeter, and i do have access to the pcb under the transport (with some effort).
homer09 said:
Regarding eBay, I meant the whole player.
Then you also can come closer to/find the error by exchanging boards, transport.
homer09 said:
Hi,
it is going to be difficult without a scope. Start with the powersupply around the 7210 and the buffer/amplifier towards the disk motor. What happens is that the HF signal is sent to the 7210 decoder which then steers the turntable speed (among other things) with an opamp as buffer.
Go to mode 3 and give the disk a spin. Maybe it picks up or
maybe you can hear something at the output.
It could be that you dont have a 7210, but a M4808 decoder. Seems to be the same thing more or less, but with some bugs!
Could be that the bug appeared. Do you have spareparts (other old philips player). My first try would be to swap the 7210, but i have a spare 😀
Ok, here i am a couple of weeks later and this is the situation.
i bought an old 473 philips player which also has a CDM2 transport. A simple swap between the two players and i confirmed that my 650 transport is in good working condition. The 473 transport does not work in the 650, producing the same results as above.
But now something weird happened as i swapped the transports a couple of times. All of a sudden, the 650 (with its original transport) began to work! It read total track time, and mode 3 in test mode worked, i heard music! Of course, i had no idea what i did to fix the problem. So i packaged up the player, screwed the loose parts and fired it up again, it no longer works! Since then i havent been able to get it to work again!
What could be the problem? i definetly rule out the transport, this leaves other candidates for the problem: the pcb attached to the 650 transport (the 473 does not have this pcb, its on the main board so i was unable to test it), the front panel which controls the transport, or the connection to the main pcb.
i tested all the connections between the above parts, all the wires seem to connect properly. where could the problem be?
any help? thanks!
i bought an old 473 philips player which also has a CDM2 transport. A simple swap between the two players and i confirmed that my 650 transport is in good working condition. The 473 transport does not work in the 650, producing the same results as above.
But now something weird happened as i swapped the transports a couple of times. All of a sudden, the 650 (with its original transport) began to work! It read total track time, and mode 3 in test mode worked, i heard music! Of course, i had no idea what i did to fix the problem. So i packaged up the player, screwed the loose parts and fired it up again, it no longer works! Since then i havent been able to get it to work again!
What could be the problem? i definetly rule out the transport, this leaves other candidates for the problem: the pcb attached to the 650 transport (the 473 does not have this pcb, its on the main board so i was unable to test it), the front panel which controls the transport, or the connection to the main pcb.
i tested all the connections between the above parts, all the wires seem to connect properly. where could the problem be?
any help? thanks!
Is the 7210 or M4808 decoder soldered on in a socket?
Maybe if you swap that one, it controls the motor turning.
(you could try to unsolder the 11.2896 xtal for a moment: the disk should start spinning with lightspeed.
If you pass step 2 the next thing would be that the 7210 starts the spinning of the disk and control the speed by the incoming HF signal.
Think you have a bad solder-joint at the decoder or de decoding microprocessor. Tap on the ic's or use some cold-spray.
Good luck.
Maybe if you swap that one, it controls the motor turning.
(you could try to unsolder the 11.2896 xtal for a moment: the disk should start spinning with lightspeed.
If you pass step 2 the next thing would be that the 7210 starts the spinning of the disk and control the speed by the incoming HF signal.
Think you have a bad solder-joint at the decoder or de decoding microprocessor. Tap on the ic's or use some cold-spray.
Good luck.
The emitterfollower pair after the servo opamps have failed on me several times. Sometimes even when they measured good on a tester.
where do i find all those ics (7210, M4808, 11.2896 xtal)? Will they be on the main PCB, or hidden in the layered pcbs attached to the front display? Is the decoder microprocessor near the display or on the main pcb near the dac?
how do i test for bad joints, how do i use cold spray?
sorry if these questions are obvious, im not too fimiliar with repairing cd players, im learning as i go.
how do i test for bad joints, how do i use cold spray?
sorry if these questions are obvious, im not too fimiliar with repairing cd players, im learning as i go.
SAA7210 is the 40 pen dip on the main pcb (could also be a M4808). Xtal is connected near the SAA7220 (dip28) on main pcb.
decoder microprocessor is the MAB84.. on the main pcb, could be that you have a small pcb mounted on the main pcb, it will be on there then.
Bad joints could be seen sometimes, better is to just re-solder the processor and 7210 anyway.
A scope would be handy to see what works and what doesn't..
gr
decoder microprocessor is the MAB84.. on the main pcb, could be that you have a small pcb mounted on the main pcb, it will be on there then.
Bad joints could be seen sometimes, better is to just re-solder the processor and 7210 anyway.
A scope would be handy to see what works and what doesn't..
gr
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